Berlin Modular (ancient thread)

[KBSoundSmith]

the U-he team are working on Zebra 3, which I can't wait to see (something in my gut is telling me that Zebra 3 might possibly prove to be the most significant soft synth to ever be developed. I just have a feeling we'll be talking about soft synths pre-Zebra 3 and post-Zebra 3 after a couple of years).

Nah, that's way exaggerated. Z3 won't remotely have the significance of Diva.

Otoh no-one has copied Zebra's concept yet in, hmm 8 years, so its significance may be solely on the user side, but has no broader influence on synthesis per se. I guess marketing divisions put Zebra down as not sexy enough, cluttered with tabbed panels. Which just means they haven't understood it yet. But if Zebra3 looks sexy enough then, yeah, maybe some competition will pop up, about 10 years late. (That said, as w'rabbyt pointeth out, a synth with a similar concept existed beforehand, but wasn't a success)

Well, I love that you have multiple successes which I think can arguably be your "real" legacy

I do agree that Diva is a major milestone in soft synths (probably THE milestone so far), it oozes with quality. I just don't think we should forget how wonderful Zebra is, as well as how wonderful it will be. And I understand that a modular/semi-modular is always going to have a tough time being considered #1 due to (relative) complexity of use, as well as the fact that it isn't specialized in some way. But I think that when it comes to a modular that provides ease of use, a very wide sound palette, and simply the versatility to make sounds that other environments simply can't make, I think Zebra is untouchable.

What I think: Diva is #1 in sound. Zebra is #1 in concept.

I can't imagine what Berlin Modular will be like when it's done, though. I'll have to come up with a different category to give it number one status

[jbuonacc]

It's a dilemma with polyphonic synths. If output VCA envelope was bypassed, all 8 or so voices would sound at once. Special momophonic modes are required to avoid cacophony and make things usable. One needs to drop the voice concept, as we did with Zebrify.

hmm, that's not good. i wasn't aware that Zebra had this "limitation" as well (haven't spent much time with it). i guess the only solution would be to send it a MIDI note-on that's the full length of the song? i don't know if there's any way to 'latch/hold' either. using successive note-ons ruins the feel of the drone with it re-triggering.

if there's any way that this could be worked out, that'd be great.

[chilly7]

It may have been earlier in this thread, I don't remember, but I recall that Urs wrote that he thought that there may be the possibility to make one giant synth that will be the Berlin Modular, while releasing Bazille as a separate standalone in the meantime. Not sure what those plans are at the moment, if they've changed or not. So I guess subject to change/still being planned?

Plus, it's a long way off, since he and the U-he team are working on Zebra 3, which I can't wait to see (something in my gut is telling me that Zebra 3 might possibly prove to be the most significant soft synth to ever be developed. I just have a feeling we'll be talking about soft synths pre-Zebra 3 and post-Zebra 3 after a couple of years).

Well, I think most of us want the sound quality of Diva and possibilities of Zebra!!!
Yes , it might be very CPU intensive program, and not awry body might have the high end computers, but this can be fixed if the provide a couple or at list a two sets of algorithms for low CPU consumption and the highest end algorithms which Ofcause will demend a very good CPU

[chilly7]

Just read the FIRST POST IN THE THREAD.

Hmmm, not quite... the thing has evolved since, like KBSoundSmith says, instead of offering three different synths we might merge them into a single one. Think Bazille with Diva's way of swapping modules

Whoa - I smell a CPU munching beast. Will a 12-core not be enough?

You may be able to play a note or two

Well that is not exectly true, computer power groves very quickly and even consumer CPUs like Intel I7 3 gen is quite powerful right now and the progress and power of computers is going quantum lips .

So I think we should not worry that much.

So Uhe give us the best possible algorithms!!!

[chilly7]

.

What I think: Diva is #1 in sound. Zebra is #1 in concept.

I can't imagine what Berlin Modular will be like when it's done, though. I'll have to come up with a different category to give it number one status

It is time to merge both

[justin3am]

It's a dilemma with polyphonic synths. If output VCA envelope was bypassed, all 8 or so voices would sound at once. Special momophonic modes are required to avoid cacophony and make things usable. One needs to drop the voice concept, as we did with Zebrify.

This morning I was playing with Bazille, imagining how cool it would be to have DIVA's Voice Map Modulator. I imagined that one mod destination could be Voice VCA Offset. This way we could manually let signal from each voice through without needing to trigger voices with notes. It's fun to dream.

[chilly7]

It's fun to dream.

And I can convince u it is even more fun when it is real!

[Alfa210]

when scale osc's fine in multi in neg-direction from 0 to -1 (+shift) there is no difference in sound. Is it ok?

[ pos Steps Jump at 100 ]

little glitch or feature?

bz-seq

if you look at the screen you'l see a small jump in top steps..

[Urs]

when scale osc's fine in multi in neg-direction from 0 to -1 (+shift) there is no difference in sound. Is it ok?

Yes. It's a workaround.

Negative values *divide*. Divison by 0 is of course undesired, and anything between 0 and 1 would make the value bigger. Thus I simply made the region from -1 to 0 a division by 1, so no effect. (Same in ACE I think)

[ pos Steps Jump at 100 ]

little glitch or feature?

bz-seq

if you look at the screen you'l see a small jump in top steps..

Interesting... just a small glitch... might be fixed eventually...

[TB4C]

Well i bought ACE and love it.....just a bit scared to do too much with Bazille as after December all my efforts with Bazille may end up being futile after it stops working.... I don't like to "borrow" synths..... I prefer to buy them and have them when I can afford them.

Regards

[olikana]

all the talk about zebra 3 (jeez zebra 2 just got an update can't it rest for a while?) is getting me worried whether this semi-modular will be ready for xmas...and personally i don't wish for any other xmas present!
if it had all types of FM (linear, exponential, through zero, phase distortion etc) and an arp2600 filter as core LP (some say it's just a moog filter...for sure it's very similar)
then pretty much it would be my dream synth.

[justin3am]

an arp2600 filter as core LP (some say it's just a moog filter...for sure it's very similar)

the model 4012 filter on earlier 2600s and Odysseys was a Moog clone, the model 4072 filter (sometimes referred to as the "post-lawsuit filter") on later 2600s is a different design.

In regards to filter topology, I think it would be cool to see switched-capacitor filter (like Bin-Tic or Bionic Lester) or CMOS filter (like Wasp or OSCar) in Bazille. They would fit well with Bazille's sonic personality.

On the other hand, I really like the filters in Bazille as they are. When resonance is set to 48-50 (with Gain set to 0 and Cutoff in audible range), pinging the filters with a short envelope or pulse produces some wonderfully natural tuned percussion sounds. Very Serge-like.

[Bronto Scorpio]

all the talk about zebra 3 (jeez zebra 2 just got an update can't it rest for a while?) is getting me worried whether this semi-modular will be ready for xmas...and personally i don't wish for any other xmas present!
if it had all types of FM (linear, exponential, through zero, phase distortion etc) and an arp2600 filter as core LP (some say it's just a moog filter...for sure it's very similar)
then pretty much it would be my dream synth.

Edit: Justin was faster

Cheers
Dennis

[olikana]

edit: oky

[justin3am]

It's all good, we like what we like. Who cares what is going on under the hood?
Well obviously, I do to some extent...
but I think what is really important is how you interact with the synth. Sure the design of the filter may be the same as/similar to Moog, but the Arp is still it's own instrument.

edit: oops, I was responding to the pre-edit comment.