Laptops getting Worse for for Recording?

[nix808]

I voted no, they aren't getting worse,
coz performance must be improving.
I could have said yes coz now not as many have firewire ports.

If I wanted a serious lappy I would get a Dell XPS,
or Alienware, but these darn ones have the Firewire missing too.

[egbert]

This is a bit like doing a vox pop on the street and asking random passers by if typical forty-year-olds' coronary arteries are getting more occluded by plaque. Few have the technical knowledge or experience to give a useful answer.

[hibidy]

Oh egbert, I'm not sure I agree with that. I mean, let's be realistic for a moment: With all the "ooooo/ahhhhhh" that has gone on in this arena, they can be somewhat of a crapshoot, don't you think? I'd never use my lappy for music. That is not to say you CAN'T use one (please do not confuse!!) but it's not quite obvious that one vs the other is going to be great, is it?

If I had to do music on a lappy, I'd get a (don't ask/don't tell) As expensive as they are, I believe that by and large I hear more people giving them high marks.

[egbert]

I'm not sure if I have been sufficiently clear about what I mean. If users understand the issues with DPC and low latency audio then they can test configurations of a particular laptop and audio interface and assess its performance - eg if you get crackles and dropouts on audio at a given buffer size.

You can also see whether a given laptop tends to overheat when running significant CPU load - having a quad core that wants to go into some kind of power saving mode or protective shutdown because it is running >50% CPU for more than a few minutes is not much use. Not everybody answering a poll like this will know about this stuff or be able to give reliable information so the signal is at risk of being swallowed by the noise.

I would love reliable info on what works and what doesn't. We could perhaps make a sticky thread or even have a dedicated subforum for user reports where we can share information and offer some guidance on what to test for and how to do it.

The professional DAW builders - some of whom are kind enough to share their knowledge here - are the ones who know about this stuff and I gathered that they have been having trouble getting kit that works over the last couple of years. They have for example worked with manufacturers to get special BIOS versions in their attempts to fix some of these issues.

[jethrobull]

I voted no.Well...laptops have always been terrible for any performance jobs.

[bronxsound]

Lappies are actually getting better apart from macbooks

[pdxindy]

I think laptops are getting better because the cpu's are faster, they have more ram, faster graphics and faster connectivity.

As for reliability, I have only used Mac laptops for some years. My current MacBook Pro is 4 years old, has been used heavily. Had no troubles except battery needed replacing. On another MacBook, the optical drive failed twice and the hard-drive died. The Mac Store did all the repairs free of charge each time. With my Macs, I always get the Apple-care and then I know I have 3 years without any hassles cause Apple replaces anything that fails. That one Macbook was the only one that has had any problems out of 6 or so. I am about to buy a new 15" MBP Retina

[sellyoursoul]

Pc's are definitely improving in processing power, memory, and storage, but performance for real time applications isn't improving, and it may even be sliding back. I mean, audio latency, dpc latency, and asio drivers in general.

[DuX]

I feel compelled to clear one thing up. A misconception, or a myth, people usually don't get about more powerful CPUs. First, your computer's performance is far more dependent on the operating system, and programs you're working with than you might think. A computer with a cheap Intel i3 processor, and efficient, smoothly working operating system, efficiently programmed programs, will work better, without crackling at 50% usage, than an i7 with a clogged/bloated operating system with many background processes, and bloated, inefficiently programmed programs. The *raw* CPU power will be better with i7, and you will render, encode, archive data faster, but the subjective smoothness that you get with such a system will just not be on pair with an optimised one and a less powerful processor.

What I mean to say is - if you set it all up well, it doesn't matter what CPU you're using. For as long it's not Celeron 300, of course... [very old]. All today's CPUs you can buy will suffice, and give you smooth enough experience with your computer if you set up the OS properly, and use good programs. If you stuff your computer up to the brim with everything, your system will work slowly, and will be a PITA to look at and work with, no matter the OS, the CPU, the VGA or whatnot. Nothing can help against slow and bloated OS and slow and bloated programs!

For a simple comparison, one of my clients uses ProTools 7.4. That thing takes about a few minutes to boot, and I use Reaper and EnergyXT that boot in a second! But we have the same CPUs. Also, even though I installed his OS, he tends to fill it up with unnecessary garbage within weeks, so I have to come and clean up the mess as much as I can. The same OS [XP] boots at my place, from normal HD in about 15 seconds, I can start the Reaper immediately after boot up and work. That's about 20sec after I turn on the computer, without any SSD for now, but I plan to add it in this computer, too. I have an SSD in my other computer that I use for multi track, field recording, and as a controller/mixer for my TC Konnekt 48 interface, and it consists of a little AMD 350 ITX board, with XP SP3, and it dosn't choke up at all no matter how many audio tracks you record with it! The difference between this small computer and my main computer in CPU power is huuuge, but they both work smoothly! I can't even tell the difference until I start working with the plug-ins, of course.

And yes - DPC latency on both my computers is between 10-20 microseconds. DPC latency depends on the things I mentioned, and the choice of drivers. I tend to test the various versions of drivers and see which version of them works the best. You can have an i7 10000 CPU, but if your DPC latency is 1000 microseconds all the time, or sporadically, you won't be able to work smoothly with this computer.

Cheers!

[Johnny!]

Asus K73SV - Quad Core Sandy Bridge i7 / 8GB DDR3 / Windows 7 SP1 x64



running like this for couple of minutes. BUT - it's after several driver updates + BT & LAN turned off (dont use em anyway).

what bugs me is why not a single manufacturer makes laptop really suited for audio - I mean - they could use some actually useful audio chip etc. but no, even MacBooks use shitty Realtek chips...

edit: here's dpc checker built into NI Traktor Audio drivers, running for like 15 minutes:

[DuX]

The main problem with laptops is that they stuff them with so many stupid devices, so much stuff with bad, over-bloated drivers, that contribute negatively to its performance, it's incredible. Companies also tend to save on chips/devices as much as they can, and they don't care if you'll have DPC latency of 10 or 1000 for as long as your laptop works. And it does work, eh? It just doesn't work as smoothly as it could if they put some "Thing-Chew" wireless card instead of, say, Intel wireless one that works better, and the drivers are better. Greed has influenced and impeded every part of our lives... ahhh.

One example of useless device and bloated software: do you install that stupid "fingerprint software"? Does anyone? It's only use is to log you on into Windows with your fingerprint, but for that they use software that works in the background all the time and consumes resources, and makes DPC latency worse. Why? So I never use that thing... people don't like to log on into Windows anyway, at least my clients don't. They like it when it boots directly to the desktop.

I guess some people do use this "fingerprint" software and device, but if you don't hold any secrets in your laptop, and just want to work with your DAW in peace, just skip installing it, and disable it in the "device manager". Every little bit of "less" is better for you, especially under Windows, oh and OS-X, either.

Cheers!

[saturdaysaint]

Macs are still great in my experience. Since they have to run GarageBand and Logic properly, you can assume the components have been well vetted for running low latency audio.

Granted, I want good Windows options too. If I go that route, I'll buy at Costco, who have a pretty liberal return policy. I'm hoping to see more Microsoft stores, which reportedly sell a good selection of crapware free PCs.

[sellyoursoul]

Macs are still great in my experience. Since they have to run GarageBand and Logic properly, you can assume the components have been well vetted for running low latency audio.

Granted, I want good Windows options too. If I go that route, I'll buy at Costco, who have a pretty liberal return policy. I'm hoping to see more Microsoft stores, which reportedly sell a good selection of crapware free PCs.

No crapware/good drivers is determined by manufacturers, not retailers. These manufacturers have been doing the same thing since before I first began using a pc, trying to cram as much crap into the box as possible, with no concerns for real performance. Look at how bloated Windows has become, look at the buggy drivers from manufacturers, look at the crapware being installed by oem's. This isn't a retail issue.

[V0RT3X]

Laptops are kind of the future of producing music on ..


So my answers was no.


Considering these facts

1. Processing speeds are multiplying every year or two

2. Prices are going down on older hardware which is still very powerful

3. Hardware is getting smaller in size = ultimate portability

4. Most good laptops come with USB 2.0, 3.0 & now Thunderbolt ports

5. Recording directly into your laptop will ultimately come down to what kind A/D Converters your external sound card has and the speed of your laptop. Also the acoustics of your recording environment and what kind of microphones or preamps you use..



So yah there you have it..

[hibidy]

Oh. First thing I did with this laptop was get an oem win7 license. Didn't know ya awl didn't.