Phrasing in electronic music and the curse of predictability

[jancivil]

Why would a dance tune in 3/4 be so odd? .

I imagine that it has a lot to do with the asymmetry of the beat and human physicality.
3/4 isn't popular
It's a pretty obvious thing to think about, and reasonably conclude that it isn't likely to be a very good idea.

Do you reckon that it used to be easier for people to dance to back in the 1800's when they all had that extra leg?

Seriously though, that African music I posted is obviously dance music, but doesn't seem to require a rigid metric structure. I played African music for a while with a master drummer and he always insisted that people dance when we played, but he would also (gently) step on your foot if you tried to tap out the "beat" in a Western sense because that would interfere with understanding how the music actually fit together. What I am objecting to is not the idea that some music has a rigid symmetrical duple structure, but rather, the idea that to be danceable music MUST have a rigid structure.

It wouldn't surprise me to find that our objection is supposed to be to the number two, in fact I have found evidence here that some people think like that.

there is all sorts of music, african, afro-cuban, latin music that relies on the presence of three and two at the same time which makes it more fun for the body. It's body music. People have trouble moving with a son clave? Evidently not.

if someone has a problem dancing to everything that isn't a two-division & resolved inside of ONE BAR OF (I am honestly amazed to see this) 4/4, they can't be much of a dancer. I see all this lingo to make a severe limitation necessary sound like it's so subtle and tricky and esoteric.

Aha, now the argument is that this is so because the beat [four on the floor] is constant and the DJ has to mix it to the next tune. So, is it all at the same tempo all night? I had a girlfriend who was a house DJ. There was actually modulation of the time in that.

So you, ghettosynth were initially trying out an argument for it per se: It seemed necessary that Sendy was wrong, operating out of bad assumptions, and this elaborate argument ensued from you.
But now this is just what some crowds have to have.
Would you say that the some crowds are more restricted in their ability to respond to rhythm?

I said it before, all this lingo to support not being able to find the time without that four on the floor. A great mass of people with no rhythm gathered to dance. It takes a lot of drugs to be there I guess.

[Jesse J]

Do you find this piece predictable?

I dare you to listen trough it from beginning to end without skipping. Turn your audio on and your screen off.

http://elephantwrestler.bandcamp.com/

After that go google the source of inspiration and get experimenting!

It's fun to take a trip outside popular formats.

Edit: I do agree that unfortunately pop needs to be 4/4 because otherwise rythmically challenged people would fall over and hurt themself and then potentially sue your ass.

[ghettosynth]

3/4 is not uncommon in psytrance.

So, do you have some examples. I generally don't like psytrance that much, that is, I didn't like it in the 90s so I don't listen to it much. That said, I'd like to hear what people do in 3/4 time in the genre.

If you listen to psy-trance on beatport, it's almost entirely dominated by straight up 4/4. That's really what I remember about it, other than the overly long "dreamy" intros. It's also described in the Wikipedia page as being based on 4/4.

So, seriously, I'd love to hear some examples.

[herodotus]

Of course, people may have "expanded their horizons" and simply concluded that odd time signatures, or changes in time signatures, aren't in fact, all that interesting.

Yes, it's possible.

It's also possible that the guy who makes the things on the coffee shop wall that look like finger painting could really do stuff that looks like something by Dali or Escher, but has decided that doing finger painting is a superior form of artistic expression.

Possible, yes. But I am skeptical.

Isn't that part of the message in this thread?

KVR threads have messages these days? I've been away for too long.

That to some, they seem like an obvious attempt at trying to add complexity for its own sake, or, as Raymond Seroul put it, "too clever by half."

I would say those people were uneducated, then. Odd time signatures are part of ancient folkloric musical traditions from India to Bulgaria. To assert that whole musical cultures are 'trying to add complexity for its own sake' just doesn't make sense.

[ghettosynth]

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[qa2pir]

jancivil you're the conservative as you cannot tolerate new definitions even on a hypothetical level...

reactionary stupidity out of sheer ignorance ['you can't do that': "formal innovation is a revolting child"] is not new.

again, a tu quoque from you when you can't actually manage an argument.

you fail to recognize beyond form. and you fail to consider a new and substantial definition of creativity.

[qa2pir]

ghettosynth that was an enlightening post

[t3toooo]

jancivil you're the conservative as you cannot tolerate new definitions even on a hypothetical level...

reactionary stupidity out of sheer ignorance ['you can't do that': "formal innovation is a revolting child"] is not new.

again, a tu quoque from you when you can't actually manage an argument.

you fail to recognize beyond form. and you fail to consider a new and substantial definition of creativity.

a definition and creativity that you define.

[ghettosynth]

...

[herodotus]

You know, you stay away from a favorite place for a while and you forget about all those lovable details that made you like it in the first place.

This thread is classic kvr in every day.

jancivil, ghettosynth, I salute you.

[ghettosynth]

ghettosynth that was an enlightening post

Thanks man, I'm not that anyone else is paying attention though

Time to get back to tripledub, or whatever we're calling it.

[Jesse J]

Do you find this piece predictable?

http://elephantwrestler.bandcamp.com/

The long post.

Thank you for the best review and insight I've ever gotten for my music, even for this live in studio piece. Marvelous!

I would post more, but two kids crying here...

[GeckoYamori]

3/4 is not uncommon in psytrance.

So, do you have some examples. I generally don't like psytrance that much, that is, I didn't like it in the 90s so I don't listen to it much. That said, I'd like to hear what people do in 3/4 time in the genre.

http://soundcloud.com/loopus-in-fabula/04-good-time





I've heard plenty of radio pop in 3/4 as well that can be more or less classified as dance. It doesn't seem like such an outlandish idea to me.

[qa2pir]

a definition and creativity that you define.

yeah man all the way.

[ghettosynth]

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