FL 11 release?

[Decadent Sympozium]

All I want is an old way of block building and an old style of channel/pattern management. I'm so god damn slow on this, I really don't like it and although many find it more to their style, I find it as far away from mine as possible. I can't possibly understand why anybody would decide to drop out the design completely - I understand an attempt to push something different and I don't mind the changes. What I mind is completely excluding the old design.

Other than that, I fail to see any necessary upgrades, although it would be cool to have an ability to set different tempos for different patterns. EG. the main song is 150, but I can set pattern#1 to play on 75. I'd like that.

[mellotronaut]

does anybody know, what has happened to the mac version project? abandonned or still in the making?

[BERFAB]

So no one really seems out of joint that IL seems to be taking a pass on x64? I was surprised that v. 10 was not native x64, and I will be simply AMAZED if v. 11 isn't as well.

Win 8 is now a reality. 64 bit is not a novelty, it is the standard. How can any credible dev that prides themselves on 'innovation' NOT move heaven and earth to make x64 a reality?

[sjm]

All I want is an old way of block building and an old style of channel/pattern management.

You can just use the "lock to content" option for tracks in the playlist and you're good to go. The pattern management (move up/down etc.) is admittedly a bit worse now, but gol is aware of this and hopefully will improve things a bit. The browser simply doesn't work that well for it at the mo.

The one pattern per track thing is really inefficient though, I'm not sure why you'd want to do that. It just means everything gets spread out all over the place vertically and you have a much worse overview of what you're doing. The new way makes much more sense (but as said before, you can go 1 pattern/track if you really, really want to).

See the multitude of threads in the IL forum for more (here's one at random that goes into the pattern management a bit: http://forum.image-line.com/viewtopic.php?f=100&t=89112).

gol has since said that he plans to add auto-coloring (gradients) for patterns in future. But the pattern management thing is only partially related to the new playlist in the sense that there's no replacement. If you have a good suggestion (that also works using the new playlist paradigm), why not post it on the IL forums?

[memyselfandus]

It's still FL1 if they don't add an easy way to use multiple time signatures. seriously. wtf?

I am probably the only one on here who cares about this though..

[Decadent Sympozium]

The one pattern per track thing is really inefficient though

Inefficient how? My songs get more and more complex but I didn't find the new solution increasing the complexity or giving me more freedom. The only good thing I like about the new method is the ability to retract a pattern/block/sample from start or end, so I don't have to multiply the patterns and have different length variations of the same thing and can use it right away. But I do see people saying it does give them freedom, so in my opinion it is a matter of taste and therefore should have either two versions or extra option - if I'm right, the version 8 or 9 had an option of turning block system on and off. What was wrong with that? Nothing. Perfect solution for everybody.

Lock to content.

Lock to content thingy works only partially, even if I lock it, sooner or later I will click something somewhere that will eventually put a different pattern/sample into the locked content. I am also not used to the browers because when, for example, my eyes see pattern#4 I logically presume if I click it the pattern will appear. But it does not because patterns don't matter anymore. So I have to pull down the browser with tons of patterns - horribly unviewable unless your songs have 10 patterns, and in case of locked content be super-careful not to click something along the way (because even if it's locked to content, I can still move a sample/pattern into it, and so does FL in case of automations, for example). Also, I often confuse (or fl does) one selected pattern with another, so I also have to pay attention to where and what was selected. If my samples are titled SFX01,SFX011,SFX0111, eventually I'll make a mistake and put the wrong thing in a wrong place, you can't view pattern and sample the same way as before, et cetera. It bothers me and tires me, and a person who tells me they can't have an extra two options for switching the design styles is a straightforward liar.

[highkoo]

lol at 'organization' being an argument against blocks.

Have they confirmed no blocks in v11?
I know that was the word pre-10, but they seem to have struck a compromise with the current 'option'.

It will be the same shit storm all over if they finally do axe them completely....

And I will probably stay on v10 for a couple years until Im comfortable with lock-to-content.

I have seen it said that there are proposed future playlist features that are not compatible with the block style. Maybe so, but I have not heard about what those features are.
If its time sigs that eventually kill blocks I think I will choke on irony.

[sjm]

If you've locked to content, you just need to click in the track in the playlist to add the pattern. You don't need the browser. Sorry if I misunderstood you, and you meant something else.

Also, you can just click on a pattern in the playlist to select it and paste it into the playlist (or just copy it using shift-click). I've actually never used the browser to select a pattern since the new playlist was introduced.

As to why it's really inefficient - simple: you use up loads of vertical space when you don't need to. This means loads of scrolling and the need to change the order of patterns all the time. It's fine if you only have 10 patterns, but things quickly got disorganised when working on a large project.




As an example, I have an ancient FL 7 song with about 180 patterns. In total there are about 35 channels, 15 are one shot vocal samples and would in theory be a single track in FL10. So in FL7 I've got 180 patterns (after merging loads of smaller patterns to longer ones just to keep things semi-manageable).
In FL10, I can reduce everything to, say, 15-25 tracks (it's 15 mixer tracks in the original).

I personally find 20ish tracks much easier to navigate and organise than 180+.


Also, even if your samples are called SFX01 etc. you can call the pattern whatever you want and colour it... a little bit of organisation goes a long way - it isn't FL's fault that you don't do that (but it was FL's fault that big projects became vertical behemoths).

Seriously, give it a proper go, it's a much better system now, even if some things ain't perfect.

[sjm]

It's still FL1 if they don't add an easy way to use multiple time signatures. seriously. wtf?

I am probably the only one on here who cares about this though..

Not at all, it comes up once every two weeks on the IL forums. I want it too.

[highkoo]

Not sure who you are talking to sjm, but your pic example is a good one to show the contrast in ways of working;
If I had a track built with six different patterns in one lane, it would drive me batshit.
There are just drastically different ways of working. I mean, its not that my tracks look like the left hand of your pic either. I use both sections and there is a ton of stuff in the playlist.
Basically, I build all my drums in the blocks, and all automation and longer audio goes in the playlist. Its super fukkin awesome.

I see what people like about the playlist. I understand that vertical space is the issue. Your way allows you to pack the upper rows full of various things, theoretically, before having to use the second row.

I get it, I just dont want to be forced to do it.
I mean, what is gained by killing the oldest core part of the sequencer?
There may be an answer to that, but lets hear it.

[osiris]

Blocks...bleh.
All you have to do is hit the sample with your cursor and the name will show up at top of playlist then put that sample where you want it. What's less confusing?
I love playlist because I can hack midi files to death and rearrange however I please, even take two different ones and smash them together. No IL, pleaase don't change a thing. Or either do a Microsoft and give people a choice of New View/Classic View.

[highkoo]

Imageline needs to figure out how the anti-block movement was started and bottle that shit up.

[trimph1]

Why is block such an issue?

[osiris]

I actually hate it. I had a synth that wouldn't play and was tearing my hair out about it. Turns out I had the block whatever activated and it wouldn't play because the block wasn't there.
Blocks are so last century....

[systemfehler]

Blocks are so last century....

So are step sequencers. My guess is that'll be going next. I stick to Version 9 anyway. It's ok for anyone to dismiss blocks, to me it's one of the features no other host has. Lifetime free updates, I haven't paid for that.