TAL-U-NO-LX. Uber accurate Juno 60 emulation.

[Bronto Scorpio]

As I said, I have never heard of you before, probably because I am simply not interested in those synths you spend so much time on.

So, no offense regarding what I said about your U-NO-LX demo

Gruß in die niedersächsische Provinz

No offense taken!

now, kids, do I have to make you both stand in the corner?
take a time out?

Yaaay! I love corners

Let's get back to the synth itself

Here is a small trick:
One of the problems with 1 osc synths is that it's hard to get slightly atonal, bell-ish stuff out of them if they don't offer additional stuff like filter FM.

In U-No-LX you can get some stuff like that nontheless.

Simply deactivate all waves but the sub osc and turn it down until you have enough headroom for the resonance (somewhere around the middle of the slider should be OK) and turn the resonance into self-oscillation.
Now set the keyfollow slider to 100% and move the cutoff slider to pick out individual harmonics until you get a nice sound.
The balance between the sub osc volume, the filter cutoff and the resonance is important for this kind of sound!
Try it with long relase times and the chorus

You also don't have to set the keyfollow to 100%. It often sounds quite nice when it's set to 0.

Cheers
Dennis

[faun2500]

Excellent! Seeing as pretty much all music these days will be recorded on to a hard drive, CD or as an MP3 then the analog synth will be digitalized and will be no different to the plugin with is a lot more convenient!!

Agree. But then there is one obstacle yet to overcome with regard to emulations, namely that a blind tests with MP3s (and also wave files I think) already has shown that people can not tell a synth like Oxium from Synth 1 and these from a real Jupiter 8 (can not find the thread now though). Well if synth 1 can be taken for a Jupiter 8 and vice versa, why spend a lot on money on emulations? Under these circumstances a lot of synths could make analog-like patches that can not be distinguished from the real thing on a digital medium, even free ones. Emulation then becomes a qustion of sound design and not component modeling

Cheers

I actually understand what your saying. Its a good point. But I do think that a lot of softsynths do sound different so this one sounds more like a juno than say, zeta 2 or synplant???

Does it sound analog? I don't know, what does analog sound like - Dull, noisy?? lol

It sounds good, looks good (this is important for me too), is easy to program and was cheap!

[electro]

Plug in the same parameters and TAL LX will sound just like the Hardware Juno. Imagine that for well under $100.00

TAL LX is the most successful emulation of a hardware analog to date. Don't listen to the naysayers. Some will never be satisfied or grateful for anything.

[fluffy_little_something]

I actually understand what your saying. Its a good point. But I do think that a lot of softsynths do sound different so this one sounds more like a juno than say, zeta 2 or synplant???

Does it sound analog? I don't know, what does analog sound like - Dull, noisy?? lol

It sounds good, looks good (this is important for me too), is easy to program and was cheap!

Same here, it looks appealing, inviting. What am I supposed to do with something like Poly-Ana? It sounds good, but its user interface is a mess, that probably violates some human rights conventions on torture

[Dean Aka Nekro]

Doh Yeah
Its Another Thread About Teh
Villainy & Virtues Of Teh Virtual Analogue
Again...Yep: How Analogue Teh Digital Can Sound...
Synths = GAY! - Cuts & Runz Wit Teh Soretooth Grin

[IncarnateX]

I actually understand what your saying. Its a good point. But I do think that a lot of softsynths do sound different so this one sounds more like a juno than say, zeta 2 or synplant???

Does it sound analog? I don't know, what does analog sound like - Dull, noisy?? lol

It sounds good, looks good (this is important for me too), is easy to program and was cheap!

Same here, it looks appealing, inviting. What am I supposed to do with something like Poly-Ana? It sounds good, but its user interface is a mess, that probably violates some human rights conventions on torture

I agree with both of you in so far as I would first and foremost take a synth for what it is in itself and not what it is suppose to imitate. And yes, Faun, the deal with emulations might be that some analogish synth patches are better imitated on certain softsynths than others thought they can be reproduced on a wide range of softsynths in general.

Cheers

[lionscub68]

Seriously, you kids better get off my lawn!
Behave! Or I'll rehash the old KVR topic about the merits of tarnce music.
Yes, I just wrote tarnce.

[PAK]

Agree. But then there is one obstacle yet to overcome with regard to emulations, namely that a blind tests with MP3s (and also wave files I think) already has shown that people can not tell a synth like Oxium from Synth 1 and these from a real Jupiter 8

That was more about the sounds chosen, in a small snipet, rather than the usage of MP3. The sounds weren't particularly closely matched, and one of the examples was quite "clean", which is something people associate more from digital code rather than analogue hardware. It's not difficult to lead people to different conclusions based on those sorts of things. I doubt raw wave files would've made much of a difference. Doing something like modulating the filter more in examples, however, would be more likely to produce results which can be better differentiated.

The qualities of analogue synths usually survive low quality Youtube encoding, never mind encoding with mp3's at high bit rates. It's really about what the sound is doing, which might give enough clues to spot differences and know one thing from the other. It's possible to pick examples where there's next to no difference, and so you can say to people "look how close this is". Whereas someone else can choose other aspects of the synths architecture and show it's nowhere near. Which brings me to..

Emulation then becomes a qustion of sound design and not component modeling

That's always been the case to a certain degree. But that's true of analogue hardware too. EG someone might say an Alesis Andromeda sounds nothing like a Minimoog, then give an example sound.. which someone else might go and match extremely closely on the Andromeda! Given enough flexibility a good sound designer can attempt to bend a synth to do their will. It's as much about the person programming the sound as it is about the synth.

Someone might say Diva's closer to a Minimoog than Arturia's emulation, But give me a transient shaper, EQ, and compression and I guarantee I can find some sounds where Mini V could be made to sound closer than Diva on its own. In a sense that sort of thing is the wrong comparison to be looking for. It's really about what sounds you want and how easily something enables you to get there..

If someone wants the extremes of analogue then they should buy a hardware analogue modular already. VST's won't be getting close to that any time soon. But, for a more "bread and butter" side of things - IE stuff all over pop and electronic music of the last 40 years - some of the better synths are now getting pretty good as stand-ins, I think.

Uno LX sounds a lot like a real Juno. Get all aspergers on its ass and anything from the way the oscillator waves combine, to the harmonics, to distortion, to noise is neither correct on this emulation nor on Diva. Pick the right (or wrong) combos of that and, yeah, you can likely make the differences stand out like a sore thumb. That doesn't mean they can't cover a giant portion of sounds where you struggle to tell things apart either.

[fluffy_little_something]

Indeed, I wonder how many of those who bought the TAL emulation have ever used a hardware Juno. Probably not too many. I sure haven't, I don't know what the Juno 60 sounded like exactly, and I don't care. I like the TAL because it has a clean yet powerful basic sound, and it is surprisingly flexible thanks to Roland's architecture. I often stack two instances and use semitone detuning to compensate for the missing second oscillator. I add effects and save the whole thing as one sound. DAWs are great in this respect

[Echoes in the Attic]

Just tried it. Makes Diva look very light on cpu!

[Bronto Scorpio]

Here is a small trick:
One of the problems with 1 osc synths is that it's hard to get slightly atonal, bell-ish stuff out of them if they don't offer additional stuff like filter FM.

In U-No-LX you can get some stuff like that nontheless.

Simply deactivate all waves but the sub osc and turn it down until you have enough headroom for the resonance (somewhere around the middle of the slider should be OK) and turn the resonance into self-oscillation.
Now set the keyfollow slider to 100% and move the cutoff slider to pick out individual harmonics until you get a nice sound.
The balance between the sub osc volume, the filter cutoff and the resonance is important for this kind of sound!
Try it with long relase times and the chorus

You also don't have to set the keyfollow to 100%. It often sounds quite nice when it's set to 0.

A quick example (First without keytracking, then with keytracking and then with chorus): Reso Keys

Cheers
Dennis

[audiojunkie]

Plug in the same parameters and TAL LX will sound just like the Hardware Juno. Imagine that for well under $100.00

TAL LX is the most successful emulation of a hardware analog to date. Don't listen to the naysayers. Some will never be satisfied or grateful for anything.

I've listened and compared and agree that TAL LX is the best "Juno 60" emulation, but I think the OP-X Pro II does a FANTASTIC job emulating the Oberheim products, and the industry tends to agree that the OP-X Pro II is the best hardware emulation for the hardware it is modeling. It might be going a "bit" too far to say that it is the "most successful emulation."

Nevertheless, I again agree that the TAL-U-NO LX is great!

--Sean

[metrosonic]

Stunning example of what you can achieve with the 'limited' architecture of U-No-LX.

I've got to say this is the best $40 I've spent in quite some time. And having owned a Juno 6, to my ears at least the emulation comes very, very close especially with the newly modelled chorus section.

For those commenting on the high CPU usage a new V2 package was posted today that fixes an error on the OSX version. The CPU hit is now half what it was for the buggy version.

JM
------------
https://soundcloud.com/leftside-wobble

Here is a small trick:
One of the problems with 1 osc synths is that it's hard to get slightly atonal, bell-ish stuff out of them if they don't offer additional stuff like filter FM.

In U-No-LX you can get some stuff like that nontheless.

Simply deactivate all waves but the sub osc and turn it down until you have enough headroom for the resonance (somewhere around the middle of the slider should be OK) and turn the resonance into self-oscillation.
Now set the keyfollow slider to 100% and move the cutoff slider to pick out individual harmonics until you get a nice sound.
The balance between the sub osc volume, the filter cutoff and the resonance is important for this kind of sound!
Try it with long relase times and the chorus

You also don't have to set the keyfollow to 100%. It often sounds quite nice when it's set to 0.

A quick example (First without keytracking, then with keytracking and then with chorus): Reso Keys

Cheers
Dennis

[dexterbella]

A quick example (First without keytracking, then with keytracking and then with chorus): Reso Keys

Absolutely lovely!

[faun2500]

Indeed, I wonder how many of those who bought the TAL emulation have ever used a hardware Juno.

Not used, but heard!