KVR Audio

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:08 pm

EvilDragon wrote:C-R is not a problem, you guys are bloody overreacting! You can generate the licence file from a computer that's online, then just transfer the file to your DAW and install it. Totally a non-issue. The file even gets e-mailed to you so you can use it on any number of computers, and basically as I figured it out, you just do this once and you're done with it.

A complete non issue.

It wouldn't be so bad if what you are telling is correct, but from how I understood things, it is just like a normal C/R install where the serial is tied to the hardware ID, and you can't use it on any number of computers (as you suggest it can). It is the tying the software to the hardware that I don't like, and that is the key issue that I have with C/R protection. If the company goes under (we we at KVR have SEVERAL examples of that happening), we'd be stuck.

Personally, I make a stand on C/R and other similar copy protection on principle--I just plain won't support companies that hassle me or leave me with less freedon than a criminal. It is not something everyone has to make a stand on--it's just my own agenda and campaign.

--Sean

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:09 pm

cryophonik wrote:I must be going blind because I can't find any upgrade info. I have a V-Station license, but I haven't installed it or used it in years - is this a free upgrade/update?

It appears to be a free update, but I'm not positive.

--Sean

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:10 pm

sockofgold wrote:Any engine updates? 64-bit bit is nice, but for a "2.0" update, you would think they could overhaul the sound engine...

Egh, nevermind. I don't even care what has been updated if it's using C/R. There are plenty of better synths out there that don't require that garbage.

There doesn't appear to be anything special added to this synth, other than 64-bit and the updated VST SDK compilation.

--Sean

Debby747 · Post by **Debby747** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:12 pm

EvilDragon wrote:A complete non issue.

Yes and no.
As a customer I remain the right to refuse such non-issues before they become issues.
Am I overreacting? Probably.
But otherwise I'd be over-hyped by an exciting upgrade news!
Will I support Focusrite's choice and choose to downgrade to a product with C/R? No.

What I find particularly disappointing is that there is no real incentive for "going v2.0".
According their changelog there is nothing new/improved but:
Mountain Lion compatibility
64-Bit plug-in types
RTAS, VST3
multi plug-in type installer
new authorization procedure

Which looks like a mere maintenance upgrade.
If it turns out this upgrade is free, then fine, never mind the version number.

But I had expected something more attention grabbing and breath-taking than keeping up with OS reliabilities. Pity.

Greetings
D.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:15 pm

8 voice polyphony? That's taking "realism" a bit far isn't it?

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:15 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
sockofgold wrote:The point is that is requires an authorization server to be able to use it, and one cannot count on that always being available. It's not a "non issue" at all.
It's totally a non-issue. I just authorized it, got the licence file, AND got it in my inbox. I moved that to my inbox "stash" which never gets deleted. That's about it. Just gotta do this ONCE. And never again.

This is totally fine by me.

As I mentioned before, if this is true, then it isn't C/R. It is just a serial# protection. However, it appears to me that the serial number is generated by the computer that the serial number is run on (which ties it to the hardware). If my laptop dies, and the company is gone or if they think I've had my share of Authorizations, then I'm out of luck. I would be overjoyed to be proven wrong, I truly would, but it doesn't appear to me to be the case. Have you tried using the same serial number and key on different computer installations to verify what you are telling us?

--Sean

T-CM11 · Post by **T-CM11** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:18 pm

EvilDragon wrote:C-R is not a problem, you guys are bloody overreacting!

I will not ask permission to use the software I bought when I want to (or have to) change my computer hardware. It's as simple as that. Do you have some principles of your own? Can I call them "overreacting"?

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:20 pm

EvilDragon wrote:I think that x64 is really worth it, and they really made their C-R not a hassle, well it was done in a minute. Not really jumping through hoops.

This is good, I agree, but if the company disappears, how does one get a new authorization for a new computer or laptop? My understanding is that the serial is generated during the install on the computer, and that unique serial number is tied to the hardware the serial number is generated on. The unique serial number will be different on a different computer. The software key that was generated, based on the unique serial number, would be different for the different hardware device. This leaves the consumer vulnerable if the company goes under or decides not to let you do any more authorizations. This is why it is so important to me that the application be not tied to the hardware.

--Sean

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:22 pm

lotus2035 wrote:
audiojunkie wrote:Yeah, with C/R copy protection. I may just stick with 1.7, since I can use my serial code with it for any system, at any time.

--Sean
Well arent you da travelling musician installing softwares on 100s of computers every week.

Not really. The stance I make is more on principle than for any other reason.

--Sean

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:22 pm

audiojunkie wrote:
EvilDragon wrote:
sockofgold wrote:The point is that is requires an authorization server to be able to use it, and one cannot count on that always being available. It's not a "non issue" at all.
It's totally a non-issue. I just authorized it, got the licence file, AND got it in my inbox. I moved that to my inbox "stash" which never gets deleted. That's about it. Just gotta do this ONCE. And never again.

This is totally fine by me.
As I mentioned before, if this is true, then it isn't C/R. It is just a serial# protection. However, it appears to me that the serial number is generated by the computer that the serial number is run on (which ties it to the hardware). If my laptop dies, and the company is gone or if they think I've had my share of Authorizations, then I'm out of luck. I would be overjoyed to be proven wrong, I truly would, but it doesn't appear to me to be the case. Have you tried using the same serial number and key on different computer installations to verify what you are telling us?

--Sean

Well, I clicked on "Activate", got linked to Focusrite e-store, entered my name, e-mail, serial number, licence file was sent to me that's it. No hardware info was taken I think.

Coincidentally I have another PC here but it doesn't have W7 installed there yet (I'm missing some more components too, like graphics card), but when everything is up and running, I'll try with just transferring the licence file to that PC, without internet at all. If it works, I'll let you know, but that could be a week from now or more...

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:23 pm

Incredible that Novation still updates this plugin! I mean, basically, it's from 2003 i think. Soon to be celebrating a decade of existence.

But yes, a little downside would be that they really, really could have added more polyphony. That's about the only issue i have with this great plugin.

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:29 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
audiojunkie wrote:
EvilDragon wrote:
sockofgold wrote:The point is that is requires an authorization server to be able to use it, and one cannot count on that always being available. It's not a "non issue" at all.
It's totally a non-issue. I just authorized it, got the licence file, AND got it in my inbox. I moved that to my inbox "stash" which never gets deleted. That's about it. Just gotta do this ONCE. And never again.

This is totally fine by me.
As I mentioned before, if this is true, then it isn't C/R. It is just a serial# protection. However, it appears to me that the serial number is generated by the computer that the serial number is run on (which ties it to the hardware). If my laptop dies, and the company is gone or if they think I've had my share of Authorizations, then I'm out of luck. I would be overjoyed to be proven wrong, I truly would, but it doesn't appear to me to be the case. Have you tried using the same serial number and key on different computer installations to verify what you are telling us?

--Sean

Well, I clicked on "Activate", got linked to Focusrite e-store, entered my name, e-mail, serial number, licence file was sent to me that's it. No hardware info was taken I think.

Coincidentally I have another PC here but it doesn't have W7 installed there yet (I'm missing some more components too, like graphics card), but when everything is up and running, I'll try with just transferring the licence file to that PC, without internet at all. If it works, I'll let you know, but that could be a week from now or more...

No problem.

I'm patient.

If it works, then it really isn't challenge response as we know it to be--it would just be verification that the true owner is getting the software key. However, this doesn't seem to be the case. It seems to be C/R, which I am actively campaigning to try to get companies to do away with (along with dongles).

--Sean

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:33 pm

Oh, wait.

Have my old WinXP PC here. I forgot to tell that I also have to input the OS in the licence generator. The Win7 licence file didn't work on WinXP. So I generated a new key, that worked of course. So, seems like the only thing that's making the difference is OS selection, which is easy enough, make a key for every OS you plan to use.

I will let you know what happens with the new W7 PC when it's functional.

audiojunkie · Post by **audiojunkie** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:33 pm

chk071 wrote:Incredible that Novation still updates this plugin! I mean, basically, it's from 2003 i think. Soon to be celebrating a decade of existence. But yes, a little downside would be that they really, really could have added more polyphony. That's about the only issue i have with this great plugin.

I agree that with modern systems and all, more polyphony would be beneficial. However, I think the company goal, is a 1:1 replica of hardware. For me, before polyphony, I'd rather see an improvement in the patch naming and management. I can always run more than one instance of the app to increase polyphony, but it is a real pain in the butt to find the patches I want to use in the synth. The good thing about it, is that it sounds really nice, and uses very little CPU.

--Sean

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:36 pm

audiojunkie wrote: I agree that with modern systems and all, more polyphony would be beneficial. However, I think the company goal, is a 1:1 replica of hardware.

Yep, that will be it i guess. The thing is that this thing can produce very nice sounding, spacey pads and stuff, so more polyphony would be rly great. But then, as you said, not so authentic anymore.

V-Station 2.0 is out (64 bit)