In the photo the audio waveform is delayed by silence in the cableguys plugin that he's trying to use, and he's saying that the delay is a result of no proper PDC support and the latency introduced by pro-q and pro-c are causing the shift, where a DAW with proper PDC would adjust it and the cableguys plugin would see it as he expected to see it, without any silence in the beginning.hibidy wrote:I blame it.However, with my dumb little live lite (x64 though!
) I've been getting pretty groovy.
... Still not sure about this PDC thing. I kinda understand better (it's a midi thing, not an audio thing one guy said??) I dunno. The photo doesn't sink in with me.
I saw another viddy with a guy who was trying to use I guess a compressor (it wasn't a very good viddy) and the click/music was off of the buss. I haven't got a bunch of VST's loaded on this machine yet (still rebuilding)
Ableton Live 9 announced
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- KVRAF
- 8519 posts since 7 Apr, 2003
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- KVRAF
- 2336 posts since 13 Oct, 2002 from Terra Firma
I'll own up straight away and say I use Reaper but I bought Live 4 in the past and stopped using it because of the PDC problem. I went from Live to Sony ACID and then to Reaper when Sony stopped updating ACID.
The reason PDC is so important is that in a mix with lots of third party plugins (especially if you own UAD and Powercore cards as I do) the Host has to be able to compensate for any plugin delays otherwise tracks will go out of sync.
Live 9 looks like an interesting update but if it still has PDC problems then that's a huge problem. I'm only going on hearsay in this thread but if it's true then the Live team has missed the opportunity to correct a fundamental flaw in Live.
Is there any third party PDC plugin corrector available for Live? Maybe that might be a solution until PDC is fixed.
The reason PDC is so important is that in a mix with lots of third party plugins (especially if you own UAD and Powercore cards as I do) the Host has to be able to compensate for any plugin delays otherwise tracks will go out of sync.
Live 9 looks like an interesting update but if it still has PDC problems then that's a huge problem. I'm only going on hearsay in this thread but if it's true then the Live team has missed the opportunity to correct a fundamental flaw in Live.
Is there any third party PDC plugin corrector available for Live? Maybe that might be a solution until PDC is fixed.
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- KVRist
- 78 posts since 4 Jan, 2012 from USA
Actually, it appears that there's something odd going on here in Live 8:munchkin wrote:I'll own up straight away and say I use Reaper but I bought Live 4 in the past and stopped using it because of the PDC problem. I went from Live to Sony ACID and then to Reaper when Sony stopped updating ACID.
The reason PDC is so important is that in a mix with lots of third party plugins (especially if you own UAD and Powercore cards as I do) the Host has to be able to compensate for any plugin delays otherwise tracks will go out of sync.
Live 9 looks like an interesting update but if it still has PDC problems then that's a huge problem. I'm only going on hearsay in this thread but if it's true then the Live team has missed the opportunity to correct a fundamental flaw in Live.
Is there any third party PDC plugin corrector available for Live? Maybe that might be a solution until PDC is fixed.
I loaded 12 instances of Pro-Q on a track containing a kick drum, which caused the lag issue in VolumeShaper as expected. (screenshot)
However, I then made a duplicate of the track, removed every instance of Pro-Q, and added a utility device to reverse the duplicate's phase. By all means these two tracks should NOT cancel out because the one with all the Pro-Q instances is delayed by a considerable margin, but if we take a listen and look at the master fader, there is absolutely no output whatsoever. The tracks are still canceling each-other somehow. (screenshot)
It looks like the tracks themselves are being synced at the end of their plug-in chains, but the individual plug-ins are not getting delay compensation as they should be. The weirdest part is that you can clearly see the delay between the two tracks on their volume meters despite the audio syncing up perfectly, which means that Ableton's track meters do not properly represent the timing between tracks.
Last edited by colinssx on Thu Nov 01, 2012 12:19 am, edited 2 times in total.
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- KVRAF
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
I appreciate the help and the work and the answers, more than you'll know, but do you realize I'm loosing what little hair I have trying to keep up with this?????? 
Again, it's odd that that cable guys plug is being used it live on their own demo and they provide a demo (don't they?) and this hasn't been addressed on either end.
Again, it's odd that that cable guys plug is being used it live on their own demo and they provide a demo (don't they?) and this hasn't been addressed on either end.
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- KVRAF
- 13754 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle
I don't know if this has been asked, or if you have stated it elsewhere, but how many plug-ins are you actually using/trying to use, where PDC is/has been an issue for you?hibidy wrote:I appreciate the help and the work and the answers, more than you'll know, but do you realize I'm loosing what little hair I have trying to keep up with this??????
Again, it's odd that that cable guys plug is being used it live on their own demo and they provide a demo (don't they?) and this hasn't been addressed on either end.
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil
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- KVRAF
- 42529 posts since 21 Dec, 2005
No no no, not for me, I'm the one asking about it, I haven't ran into a situation with my little LL8 x64 where it's an issue.Shabdahbriah wrote:I don't know if this has been asked, or if you have stated it elsewhere, but how many plug-ins are you actually using/trying to use, where PDC is/has been an issue for you?hibidy wrote:I appreciate the help and the work and the answers, more than you'll know, but do you realize I'm loosing what little hair I have trying to keep up with this??????
Again, it's odd that that cable guys plug is being used it live on their own demo and they provide a demo (don't they?) and this hasn't been addressed on either end.
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- KVRist
- 78 posts since 17 Dec, 2010
Unbelievable, Cubase got this solved on 2003, 10 years later and Ableton still can't fix it, and the price they're charging for the software 
. I hope they go broke, seriously.
. I hope they go broke, seriously.-
- KVRAF
- 13754 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Seattle
hibidy wrote:Which reminds me, I only have live lite. I can't run a shitload of plugs, is it just not even an issue at this stage?
I'm not a musician, but I've designed sounds that others use to make music. http://soundcloud.com/obsidiananvil
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- KVRAF
- 2263 posts since 6 Aug, 2007
So, would this affect instruments that require sync as well? I am transferring a song I am working on from Cubase 6 to Live 8, and once of my instances of ACE has a very strong, obvious tempo-synced LFO on the filter.
Sometimes when I hit play, it is perfectly in sync with the song, but other times when I hit play, it is just WAY off, and I basically just have to give the space bar the old double-tap until it plays with it synced properly.
There's no drift, though. It's either perfectly in sync or way out of sync. But I know it's not ACE's fault, because it never happened in Cubase, and the patch is exactly the same.
Is this the same PDC issue you guys are talking about, or am I experiencing something different? It's certainly not the end of the world, but it does definitely fall into the "annoying as balls" category. =/
(And for what it's worth, I'm not talking about a few samples worth of drift--I'm talking about ACE just obviously having no clue where its LFO needs to be synced to, but only about 40% of the time. Very weird.)
Sometimes when I hit play, it is perfectly in sync with the song, but other times when I hit play, it is just WAY off, and I basically just have to give the space bar the old double-tap until it plays with it synced properly.
There's no drift, though. It's either perfectly in sync or way out of sync. But I know it's not ACE's fault, because it never happened in Cubase, and the patch is exactly the same.
Is this the same PDC issue you guys are talking about, or am I experiencing something different? It's certainly not the end of the world, but it does definitely fall into the "annoying as balls" category. =/
(And for what it's worth, I'm not talking about a few samples worth of drift--I'm talking about ACE just obviously having no clue where its LFO needs to be synced to, but only about 40% of the time. Very weird.)
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- Banned
- 48 posts since 8 Aug, 2011
For all Live 8 user (standard).
I have phoned with Ableton : An new list of users are created and they on the list can upgrade for 179 Euro
If you want the price call the support of Ableton and check if you are on the list.
The list are only user who want to buy the upgrade but got an other price after one day
I have phoned with Ableton : An new list of users are created and they on the list can upgrade for 179 Euro
If you want the price call the support of Ableton and check if you are on the list.The list are only user who want to buy the upgrade but got an other price after one day
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- KVRAF
- 11312 posts since 18 Aug, 2007 from NYC
Just a heads up... Live 9 Beta is either now public, or it will be soon. I can't get it to show the same info I received the first time, but maybe you will?
I found the signup on the Live Answers page under the "How do I participate in the Live 9 beta program?" link:
https://www.ableton.com/en/help/
I've downloaded the 64bit version, and the Live 9 packs made available so far, but the 32 bit version is a very slow download.
I found the signup on the Live Answers page under the "How do I participate in the Live 9 beta program?" link:
https://www.ableton.com/en/help/
I've downloaded the 64bit version, and the Live 9 packs made available so far, but the 32 bit version is a very slow download.