LuSH-101

[dalor]

Weak Envelopes or Antelopes?

[Nighthawk77]

Also incredibly limited are real trumpets, they cant do 18 notes chords like on your average VSTI, or acoustic Pianos ( you cant transform them into a pad by modifying the attack ), and especially guitars ( you're limited to FIVE fingers, such an heresy nowadays )


My Sh-101 is here to stay ......

LtZ

Very good point!

I found my instrument of choice and NO CPU HITS! (I just wish it had MIDI controllers)!!!


HARDWARE TO THE MAX, BABY!

[SoulState]

[quote="ZenPunkHippy"][/quote]
Result of using both envelopes are not enough for me. This is the first thing that i have tried. Why not to make one normal fast envelope (exponential) that acts like two? Considering that here is only two of them for all modulation things...
I know how to program synths, maybe better than 99% users in this thread, believe me.
Use two for filter cutoff, and nothing remains for other things like dedicated pitch env to add extra attack click. And when modulating pitch with adsr for click - there is NO CLICK like should be. Very slow attack phase of this env's. Only way to make extra attack is using of 2nd layer for click. This is wrong.
If this synth sounds very similar to original SH-101 it's ok... But now almost 2013 already, why not to improve some more things and make synth's performance in terms of sound charachter (like envelopes) better (faster) than original?

[ENV1]

Weak Envelopes or Antelopes?

Evenlopes, actually.

(You know, the opposite of oddlopes, which are generally much punchier.)

[Frantz]

Evenlopes very, VERY WEAK!

Even-lopes are better than odd-lopes. Use your own earlobes to judge.

[ZenPunkHippy]

there is NO CLICK like should be. Very slow attack phase of this env's. Only way to make extra attack is using of 2nd layer for click. This is wrong.
If this synth sounds very similar to original SH-101 it's ok... But now almost 2013 already, why not to improve some more things and make synth's performance in terms of sound charachter (like evenlopes) better (faster) than original?

In the demo I posted, the click is the obvious thing giving the hardware away.

The click is one of the more annoying things about the SH-101. I understand why it happens, and agree it should be included for a perfect emulation, but FWIW I'm pleased it's not there.

The kick drums out of LuSH-101 sound pretty solid, Himalaya has shown that it's possible to get close to 1:1 with a typical bass sound, so I don't think this is such a big deal.

When tweaking the 2 synths side by side alternating through the same pattern, it is incredibly difficult / impossible to tell which is which.

Peace,
Andy.

[SoulState]

The click is one of the more annoying things about the SH-101. I understand why it happens, and agree it should be included for a perfect emulation, but FWIW I'm pleased it's not there.

This is not that "click" that i mean =) I telling about ability to program fast clicks with pitch envelope _intentionally_ like in sound example below...

what are some examples of "non weak" envelopes?

can you provide a sound clip?

thanks.

Lush envelope vs Sylenth1 envelope. Sylenth1 have a PROPER envelope with fast attack.
First is Lush and then is Sylenth in both clips. Sylenth's env's is much more snappy.

http://soundcloud.com/tests-1/lush-vs-s ... ter-cutoff
http://soundcloud.com/tests-1/lush-vs-sylenth-pitch-env

[kmonkey]

bizarre

[ZenPunkHippy]

lush evenlope vs Sylenth1 evenlope. Sylenth1 have PROPER evenlope with fast attack.

Synlenth 1 has an envelope. Whether it's "proper" or not is open to debate

OK, so your example shows that Synlenth 1 has a very strong sounding click at the start of each note. That's great.

Perhaps it was an overreaction on my part, but your dismissal of LuSH-101 is quite over the top, basically naming it unusable because of this 1 feature is IMO utterly ridiculous - sorry.

Peace,
Andy.

[SoulState]

Synlenth 1 has an envelope. Whether it's "proper" or not is open to debate

Lol, "Synlenth 1" really has an "evenlope", ahhah =) Agree that Sylenth 1 has an envelopes ahhah i infected people with misprints

Perhaps it was an overreaction on my part, but your dismissal of LuSH-101 is quite over the top, basically naming it unusable because of this 1 feature is IMO utterly ridiculous - sorry.

Peace,
Andy.

Just unusable only for me at this moment, in some sort of sounds in dance music, like snappy basses, stabs, etc... Lack of attack in this type of sounds makes overall mix flat and muddy.
Proper layering can solve this problem somehow...

[fluxmind]

Amusing

I know how to program synths, maybe better than 99% users in this thread, believe me.

[SoulState]

If you can get that punch from the Lush - then you are a God of sound design, but this is impossible for that moment because of his weak env's =((((
This is another Sylenth1 sound i made for example of "Punch":
http://soundcloud.com/tests-1/syl-bass-1
I just don't know how anyone can use Lush for that kind of sound after that... And this is just simple bass...
Try at least to come close to Sylenth's dynamic of sound and punch.

[damoog]

Just checked this synth...
Nice sound, BUT...
BUT, BUT...

The evenlopes ARE WEAK, because of that sound lack "balls"...
Evenlopes very, VERY WEAK!
Only because of that - this synth goes in trash can... Just not usable...
Because of weak evenlopes any sound lacks punch, especially basses...

And miserable abilities of modulation routing...
...And MONO supersaw osc... WTF?
This synth needs improvement, then i will buy it. But not in current condition.

what are some examples of "non weak" envelopes?

can you provide a sound clip?

thanks.

Weak envelopes?...dumbest post I have ever heard of to!..filters on an instrument can be weak but envelopes are quiite simply envelopes,nothing more and nothing less

[SoulState]

Weak envelopes?...dumbest post I have ever heard of to!..filters on an instrument can be weak but envelopes are quiite simply envelopes,nothing more and nothing less

Do you know that means "exponential"?
Really in Lush attack envelope curve are quite simple and weak.
RTFM

[PAK]

Just checked this synth...
Nice sound, BUT...
BUT, BUT...

The evenlopes ARE WEAK, because of that sound lack "balls"...

Weak envelopes?...dumbest post I have ever heard of to!..filters on an instrument can be weak but envelopes are quiite simply envelopes,nothing more and nothing less

Whilst I think his post is a bit ridiculous, in suggesting Lush isn't of any use, I disagree with you about the importance of envelopes. Our ears are super-sensitive to the attack portions of sound (Basis of the Roland D50 etc.. yadda yadda). This matters for particular types of sound more than others (some bass sounds, percussion, blippy laser zap sounds, other obnoxious click sounds) and less for sounds with slower attacks (pads). Whatever the reason, some might perceive emulations as a bit less punchy than what they might expect from some analogue hardware.

However it's overly simplistic to discuss such differences purely in terms of envelopes and "clicky noises". It seems like it relates to other components and their interaction with the envelopes - it's not just the envelopes themselves. The Vadim Zero Delay Feedback stuff (even if it wasn't the first writing on the subject) helped bring a wider awareness about methods of calculation mattering, and that seems to have paid off - if the resonance of some filters is anything to go by.

I can only hope more devs now do the same sort of thing in relation to envelopes and transient perceptions, because I have a strong feeling that the sorts of envelope differences mentioned here are also partly related to the methods of calculation. With that, and some more advancements in VCA / output stage distortion subtleties, it'll go a way to closing differences some might perceive with certain pieces of old hardware. If they don't matter to you then that's ok too ..but he's not imagining things, I think