Best FM synth?

[PatchAdamz]

With sooo many synths that can do FM it really becomes relative.

It begs the question, are you simply trying to emulate a DX-7, a synth released in 1983 OR more then that, make hybrid sounds.

Or perhaps create something that has not yet been heard.

Well, fortunately, there are over a dozen good synths that can do FM synthesis.

I think we have some to the right place.

[Fraser M]

the majority thought that the earth was flat.

this has never been the case.

So burn me for saying its a sphere

wow, you totally cant read.

Wow! You totally can't punctuate.

[EnGee]

You can get Sytrus for $45 from ImageLine right now.

A great practical advice

My favourites are FM8 and Sytrus.

Sytrus is a very powerful FM synth and sounds very nice but the GUI is small.

FM8 is the best when it comes to ease of use and GUI design (although I prefer the colors of FM7). It has the annoying 'reset' thing in easy/morph page as a minus though.

[aallvor]

My only fm synth is Phantom.

I like it a lot

[do_androids_dream]

If you are after a vsti that has a very similar sonic quality to that of a certain very popular Yamaha synth then (imo) Rhino is the only one that cuts the mustard. Yes it's a bit of a wrestle with that interface but if you can put the time in you will be rewarded with authentic DX goodness. On the other hand... if you are just after a good FM synth generally then there are quite a few, most of which have already been mentioned. My tuppence

[bbow73]

So it seems like the consensus is that FM8 has taken FM the furthest.
What are the innovations that FM8 brought to the table? And do they equate to usable sound shaping?

I don't know what it is but I heard about a synth that could route individual operators through separate fx/filters.
Anyone know what that might be? I thought it started with an M...

[KevWestBeats]

I've used FM8 a few times, I own Operator and I am demoing PX7. For me Operator wins here if you don't mind the gui. PX7 is a great synth and it has great presets, a great gui but its limited to sine waves where as Operator offers multiple waveforms and even custom ones. I have never tried to program sounds on FM 8 and the presets don't do it for me. I don't own FM8 so my experience with it is a bit limited but for me if you have a ton of other synths already then PX7 is worth while. If this is your only synth I would get Operator.

[pdxindy]

I've used FM8 a few times, I own Operator and I am demoing PX7. For me Operator wins here if you don't mind the gui. PX7 is a great synth and it has great presets, a great gui but its limited to sine waves where as Operator offers multiple waveforms and even custom ones. I have never tried to program sounds on FM 8 and the presets don't do it for me. I don't own FM8 so my experience with it is a bit limited but for me if you have a ton of other synths already then PX7 is worth while. If this is your only synth I would get Operator.

+1 for Operator... Since it is specific to Live I don't mention it, but it is an under-rated synth. I'd pick it over FM8 for example...

[EnGee]

So it seems like the consensus is that FM8 has taken FM the furthest.
What are the innovations that FM8 brought to the table? And do they equate to usable sound shaping?

I don't know what it is but I heard about a synth that could route individual operators through separate fx/filters.
Anyone know what that might be? I thought it started with an M...

Do you mean the 'Matrix'?

Both FM8 and Sytrus have such routing.

FM8 has operator X and Z (i think X is like distortion effect and Z is a filter).

Sytrus has 3 filters (f1..f3), fx and PAN. I don't remember really about Octopus and Blue (I guess they have something similar).
Why not download them all and load them in your host? You can compare them side by side
Be careful though, hours will pass like minutes!

here are some links for some of them:
FM8:
http://www.native-instruments.com/#/en/ ... /?page=521

Sytrus:
http://www.image-line.com/documents/sytrus.html

Octopus:
http://www.linplug.com/octopus.html

Blue:
http://www.robpapen.com/blue.html

Rhino:
http://www.bigtickaudio.com/rhino/home

Phantom:
http://www.discodsp.com/phantom/

..
.

[anomandaris1]

For something like FM is the GUI more important than the editing capabilities?
Any of them stand out to you?






I think that it is important - that's why FM8 is so popular. It is one of the easiest to program. Sytrus is hybrid - it also has got waveform drawing and waveshaping. Rhino imports sfz, Blue is a monster synth, Octopus also imports samples. Zebra and Surge also can do fm sounds.

[Mister Natural]

. . . I own Operator and I am demoing PX7. For me Operator wins here if you don't mind the gui . . . If this is your only synth I would get Operator.

BINGO

this is a very powerful synth with unmatched write-your-own program-ability

it's built for those of you who don't want to emulate FM sounds from the 1990s

peace

[Nielzie]

Do not forget to mention Cableguys Curve, which does some excellent FM with its drawable waveform oscillators, and FM modulations through its matrix

[Ingonator]

in the hardware world, isn't the Yamaha FS1R the king of FM ?
Any FS1R ninjas care to comment on this ? They usually sell for a pretty penny on ebay..

i guess i could quite agree to that. I have never owned a real one but i got the sample library from Hollow Sun.
The only hardware FM synth i have owned so far was a Yamaha SY77. The FS1R seems to be ahead of this, except for the sample integration of the SY77 which was more like a "hybrid" synth. From that POV it would be maybe good to have both. I plan to get a second hand DX plugin card for my Yamaha Motif ES 7 which would be comparable (the plugin card is based on the DX7 so it a bit limited compared to the FM in the SY77).
The special feature of the FS1R seems to be more in the "formant sequencing" and not in it's FM engine. Anyway it's one of the few FM synths with 8 operators (personally i already get problems with using just 4...). Additionally there is a resonant filter.

A litte info i have found:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_FS1R

http://www.vintagesynth.com/yamaha/fs1r.php

http://www.amazona.de/index.php?article ... =2&page=26

http://www.planet-groove.com/yamaha/fs1r.html

http://www.hollowsun.com/hs2/products/FS1R/index.htm



I would love to see an emulation of both the SY77 and the FS1R. Much more than another analog emulation i guess.
I would also like to "dig" deeper into FM soon (mostly with FM8) but this is no really easy task.
Theoretically it seems to be almost unlimited in the sonic range. Same could be true for additive synths but a complex additive synth with lots of partials and envelopes does not seem to be really easier to program than FM.

This is one of the reasons why i like new synthesis approaches like in e.g. Rayblaster. Based on a short single cycle waveform (or a bit longer ones) which with e.g. Wave Designer you could even create yourself it's possible to get some interesting and complex sounds quite easy (as long as you are familiar with the interface and features). Same is also true for wavetable synthesis which i like very much too.
Anyway a pure FM synth seems to be more suited to digital and new sounds (i found that "new" is hard to define...) than for analog emulations for which subtractive synths are much more simple to use. Of course it's not possible to always avoid sounds that sound "analog like" while programming sounds on a FM synth. Like with my own sounds for Rayblaster i am not a person that does not do a certain kind of sounds (e.g. analog emulations) because they should be usually done with other kind of synths/synthesis. After all there is nothing that limits the scope of sounds that are "allowed" to be created with a certain synth except our own mind maybe.
I really love Lotuzia's "Gloss Spells" bank for FM8 in that respect.


Just a few thoughts about FM synths, FM synthesis and synthesis in general...



PS:
Like with any longer statement that i have given in the last months my "friends" are free to analyze and dissect all of my sentences...



Ingo

[Lotuzia]

So it seems like the consensus is that FM8 has taken FM the furthest.
What are the innovations that FM8 brought to the table? And do they equate to usable sound shaping?

I don't know what it is but I heard about a synth that could route individual operators through separate fx/filters.
Anyone know what that might be? I thought it started with an M...

First you can freely define your own algorythms and create very complex structures. Note also the two additional "operators", the filter and distorsion ones, that you can place wherever you want in the structure, its very powerfull.

The multi segment envelopes are very powerfull, cleverly implemented, and push one step forward the level/time paradigm of the Dx envelopes. Too bad you cant store more EV templates, this would really speed up the workflow. Keyboard tracking is also very powerfull, and I'd say such an implementation is almost mandatory for well balanced intruments over the KB range with FM. Double Filters are not what I'd call analog, but they are complex and interesting nonetheless. It has complex waveforms than just sine, ie more than the Tx81 or the TG.

The GUI is just a wonder to work with. Obviously a lot of thinking has gone into it, and it makes perfect sense if you work intensively with it. At least it did for me.+

Then it has some great Fx. Some are very specific and have a lot of character, lke the old chorus/delay combination.

Then, the FM8 is definitely not only for Classic Sounds. I've watched a certain number of tutorial showcasing its possibilities in dubstep for example, and what is true for this genre is also true for any other genre. Then it can bring the Classic patches to another level. Lastly, I think that a lot of new things can be done with the FM8. And the same is true for other synths like Blue or Sytrus. Its just that less people program FM.

Always the same : Its not only the machine, its all about the men and women behind it.

LtZ

[Lotuzia]

in the hardware world, isn't the Yamaha FS1R the king of FM ?
Any FS1R ninjas care to comment on this ? They usually sell for a pretty penny on ebay..

i guess i could quite agree to that. I have never owned a real one but i got the sample library from Hollow Sun.
The only hardware FM synth i have owned so far was a Yamaha SY77. The FS1R seems to be ahead of this, except for the sample integration of the SY77 which was more like a "hybrid" synth. From that POV it would be maybe good to have both. I plan to get a second hand DX plugin card for my Yamaha Motif ES 7 which would be comparable (the plugin card is based on the DX7 so it a bit limited compared to the FM in the SY77).
The special feature of the FS1R seems to be more in the "formant sequencing" and not in it's FM engine. Anyway it's one of the few FM synths with 8 operators (personally i already get problems with using just 4...). Additionally there is a resonant filter.

A litte info i have found:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamaha_FS1R

http://www.vintagesynth.com/yamaha/fs1r.php

http://www.amazona.de/index.php?article ... =2&page=26

http://www.planet-groove.com/yamaha/fs1r.html

http://www.hollowsun.com/hs2/products/FS1R/index.htm



I would love to see an emulation of both the SY77 and the FS1R. Much more than another analog emulation i guess.
I would also like to "dig" deeper into FM soon (mostly with FM8) but this is no really easy task.
Theoretically it seems to be almost unlimited in the sonic range. Same could be true for additive synths but a complex additive synth with lots of partials and envelopes does not seem to be really easier to program than FM.

This is one of the reasons why i like new synthesis approaches like in e.g. Rayblaster. Based on a short single cycle waveform (or a bit longer ones) which with e.g. Wave Designer you could even create yourself it's possible to get some interesting and complex sounds quite easy (as long as you are familiar with the interface and features). Same is also true for wavetable synthesis which i like very much too.
Anyway a pure FM synth seems to be more suited to digital and new sounds (i found that "new" is hard to define...) than for analog emulations for which subtractive synths are much more simple to use. Of course it's not possible to always avoid sounds that sound "analog like" while programming sounds on a FM synth. Like with my own sounds for Rayblaster i am not a person that does not do a certain kind of sounds (e.g. analog emulations) because they should be usually done with other kind of synths/synthesis. After all there is nothing that limits the scope of sounds that are "allowed" to be created with a certain synth except our own mind maybe.
I really love Lotuzia's "Gloss Spells" bank for FM8 in that respect.


Just a few thoughts about FM synths, FM synthesis and synthesis in general...



PS:
Like with any longer statement that i have given in the last months my "friends" are free to analyze and dissect all of my sentences...



Ingo

... computing ....... dissecting ...... analysing ---> Result :