KVR Audio

rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:41 am

mutools wrote:Ok so based on all the posts here i see that it is not very 'appreciated' that a user key is not transferrable. Now i have this question for you guys: If i would make user keys transferrable but would charge a fee for transferring it, would that sound more fair to you? If yes, who should pay the fee: The seller of the user key or the buyer?

Yes, a fee is acceptable and it could be pay by the seller (he might chooose to passt the cost on the buyer but that would be his choice).

rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:44 am

mutools wrote:
rod_zero wrote:The whole point of this topic is that courts around the world are saying: NO, it's not different, Costumers can resell. Developers need to understand this. An EULA can't go beyond any law, in fact Nobody can resign to his own rights being them liberties or consumer rights or rights to social services. It's a basic and very important principle in democracies.
I don't agree with this. I don't think it's the essential point of this discussion. The legal aspect is just a format, a package. Imho the essential point is: Is it fair that a user key is marked as personal and thus not transferrable? I think it is fair to do so if you communicate this clearly beforehand.

Well, consumer protection laws intend fair transactions. Also one of the underlying intentions is that the product retains it's original value at some extent.

rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:46 am

t3toooo wrote:
No need for a new law, judges based their decission on existing laws.
this sentence in the current form is not 100% the same as it was 1996.

it's rather difficult for me to understand the english wording but what do i know about the image line statutes?
however this would be particularly important to know,i think there are some exeptions in this judgement,so no it is not clear at all.

since we don't know about il's business model and i think it isn't the business model oracle is using (i guess you can buy and sell oracle software but it will be outdated soon or it is already outdated,so you need to renew the license and pay for the upgrade),
we need to follow the eula assuming it was/is correctly controlled by lawyers at this time.

imagine you bought a copy of fl studio many years ago for a low price,you couldn't hardly sell it for 30$ now but you put it on the marketplace,luckily everything is updated and you point to the current price,not the price you bought it for.
that's what people doing and they are fine with it.

therefore,"breaking the law assaults" and all other "forum opinions" against image line are just speculations.

to undermine the eula is not allowed and i think illegal since i don't know any other word for it.

Then it would be very interesting that IL's and other developers that don't allow transfer explained on what laws and regulations are their EULA's based.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:32 pm

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samsam · Post by **samsam** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:39 pm

^ Why don't you read the rest of the thread where the dev is discussing other options?

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:39 pm

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ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:41 pm

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ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:42 pm

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bluedad · Post by **bluedad** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:46 pm

pquenin · Post by **pquenin** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 12:55 pm

mutools wrote:Ok so based on all the posts here i see that it is not very 'appreciated' that a user key is not transferrable. Now i have this question for you guys: If i would make user keys transferrable but would charge a fee for transferring it, would that sound more fair to you? If yes, who should pay the fee: The seller of the user key or the buyer?

Jo, concerning the transfer fee : how do you see it?
I have a Mulab 3 UL license, a Mulab 4 XT license, what can be the fee for each version/level ? Will it not become a total mess ?

What is sad is that the reality here is :
- Mulab and MUX are wonderfull products,
- and you are a wonderfull guy Jo : a great developper, and your support here in the Muttols forum is incredible !

But I must admit that if I were someone that don't know anything about Mutools and go to their site and see "The license is not tranferable" , or "There is a tranfer fee", I tend to pass my way go looking for something else, because in my mind this is associated with : "these guys are here for the money".

So for me, let the user sells his license if he wants, it will be just a few bucks because the price of Mutools products are already low.
And the way you do it (change the key when a new major version is out) will bring you new customers because if they love the product, they will certainly upgrade the next time !

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:03 pm

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ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:04 pm

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samsam · Post by **samsam** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:08 pm

Theo, then IMVHO, you view things much more black and white than I do. Which is fine.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:08 pm

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ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:11 pm

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I am very surprised.