KVR Audio

Meffy · Post by **Meffy** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:13 pm

TheoM wrote:
bluedad wrote:
why? this is quite a civil discussion.. You can't accept a hot topic like this to be 100% smooth sailing.. no one is getting abusive, there is no profanity anywhere..

Not much, but things have been heating up pretty quickly:

TheoM wrote:Hopefully ilok transfer fees become illegal and so do shitty re registration fees like that greedy corporation sonnox.

For the record, I had next to nothing to do with the recently stated KVR policy on reselling software. Ben makes policies, we mods do what we can to implement them.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:19 pm

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Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:21 pm

My stance on this is that everything I buy I should be able to resell.

The problem with digital items which can be replicated in their exact form should always be compensated by a reasonable transfer fee which would cover the administrative work, offset any potentiel lost sale and compensate the developer for any dodgy customers.
If the developer choses to do this for free, then it's all the better.

IMO, the support issue is irrelevant. Only support customers in your database and the problem is sorted.

This thread has made me think quite a bit and I have changed the policy on licence transfers for my soundsets. They can now be transfered for the flat fee of 3 euros.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:24 pm

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Meffy · Post by **Meffy** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:26 pm

No need to go back and edit, just please (you and everyone else involved) try to keep from increasing the heat level.

Yet again, there's no point trying to convince me of one side of the dispute or the other side. I have no legal expertise. I have practically no knowledge of European business practices. My opinion carries no "official" weight, it's just a personal opinion. I had no say in Ben's decision. None. I just asked Ben to clarify policy. That's all. If someone were suddenly to convince me one way or another it would make no difference because I'm not the building owner, just a janitor; not a judge, just a cop on the street.

Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:29 pm

TheoM wrote:@ Ghostwave, i have a question.. do you think the fee Andy of cytomic proposed to me was fair? He said his set of skills gets him $300 per hour.. it takes ten minutes to complete a transfer from a-z, so the fee should be $50

do you think $50 is fair for a $99 product? just curious

I'm on your side here. $50 is plain ridiculous as it doesn't take the same level of skill to program DSP code and transfer a licence.
If his time is so precious, he could hire someone to deal with the transfers for a much cheaper fee.
For a $99 product, anything up to $10 is acceptable to me.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:33 pm

I wonder what a transfer fee would change about this thing at all. The way i see it these fees only get stacked up onto the price people sell their plugins for, so why even bother, it is pointless.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:54 pm

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rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:17 pm

I think some developers may need to face a nice class action suit so they can test how fair their EULA's are.

And expend some money on lawyers and stop copyng their EULA's from some big corp.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:21 pm

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chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:22 pm

rod_zero wrote:I think some developers may need to face a nice class action suit so they can test how fair their EULA's are.

And expend some money on lawyers and stop copyng their EULA's from some big corp.

I wonder if you, as a customer, are aware of all the things a license agreement of a required software license brings with it. To be honest i haven't met many people who exposed themselves with all the points such an agreement brings with it. On the other hand they can always complain well about companies using them as play ball for their "half legal" business practices.

rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:25 pm

TheoM wrote: This might be why they don't care.. the devs i mean.. and get away with it.. cause no one bothers to challenge.. that's why i say it WILL happen one day, and it will change everything, and that's the day i am waiting for

Completely, they know nobody will expend money on a lawyer because the price of the plugs doesn't make it cost effective.

I was just checking around it seems to me the biggest companies ( NI, camel, spectrasonics, waves, uad) allow it, some with a fee. Possibly because as big companies they have lawyers and possibly deal with other big companies.

rod_zero · Post by **rod_zero** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:27 pm

chk071 wrote:
rod_zero wrote:I think some developers may need to face a nice class action suit so they can test how fair their EULA's are.

And expend some money on lawyers and stop copyng their EULA's from some big corp.
I wonder if you, as a customer, are aware of all the things a license agreement of a required software license brings with it. To be honest i haven't met many people who exposed themselves with all the points such an agreement brings with it. On the other hand they can always complain well about companies using them as play ball for their "half legal" business practices.

Yeah, and I also know my customer rights.

To be clear, I have no need or intend anything, in fact I have never been afected by this. It only pisses me off when companies ignore laws, big or small.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:31 pm

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chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:34 pm

rod_zero wrote:
Yeah, and I also know my customer rights.

No offence, but i doubt that. You might remember this Adobe thing where Adobe allegedly gave keys and downloads away for free for their old products of which the registration servers were shut down. There never was an official word from Adobe about whether these are really legally downloadable and usable for everyone, yet everyone took the law in their hands and had no problem downloading and using this software. Not putting you into the same boat as these people, yet i am pretty sure that the vast majority of people have no idea about their rights and their responsibilities as a license owner, or, even worse, they interpretate it the way they want it to be.

I am very surprised.