Are we seeing the decline of the plug-in industry?
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- KVRAF
- 2973 posts since 10 Sep, 2003 from Karlskoga, Stockholm, Sweden
Though Element will probably be on a constant sale somewhere, one way or another 
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- Banned
- 147 posts since 4 Feb, 2012 from Carolina Beach
I'm not going to bother answering point by point, but it's obvious that some of you just can't read what is written in any particular post without twisting the crap out of the person's words. Did I ever say I've been downloading every freeware plugin? Hell no, but some moron just said that I did. I'm beginning to see what a goddam waste of time these forum here are. Further, I'm not seeing the level of maturity I expected find here.
This cracking business -- you've all talked it to death. All of it's old news. Only one or two commenters show they have the intelligence to see things for what they really are. Also obvious is that almost no one here has ever operated their own businesses. Absolutely no understanding of free markets. Nothing. Nada.
Meanwhile, a few of you who are in business, especially in this audio software, run around this forum acting like used car salesmen. It's really shameful to see some of the larger firms and their efforts to pass off rubbish software as top quality. I do realise a fair number of impressionable often younger types fall for it, but soon enough I think most people wise up to these tactics and some will take it out on you every chance they get from there onwards. Good press you have to pay for, but bad press comes completely free. I was telling someone the other day how KVR forum was much like the wild West. Now, as I've been poking about some lately I'm beginning to notice the snake oil salesmen also.
All in all this is more than enough.
This cracking business -- you've all talked it to death. All of it's old news. Only one or two commenters show they have the intelligence to see things for what they really are. Also obvious is that almost no one here has ever operated their own businesses. Absolutely no understanding of free markets. Nothing. Nada.
Meanwhile, a few of you who are in business, especially in this audio software, run around this forum acting like used car salesmen. It's really shameful to see some of the larger firms and their efforts to pass off rubbish software as top quality. I do realise a fair number of impressionable often younger types fall for it, but soon enough I think most people wise up to these tactics and some will take it out on you every chance they get from there onwards. Good press you have to pay for, but bad press comes completely free. I was telling someone the other day how KVR forum was much like the wild West. Now, as I've been poking about some lately I'm beginning to notice the snake oil salesmen also.
All in all this is more than enough.
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- KVRAF
- 5948 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Melbourne, Australia
The Telenator: and in kind, your attitude is generally quite rude.
Have a good day.
Andy.
Have a good day.
Andy.
... space is the place ...
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- addled muppet weed
- 111275 posts since 26 Jan, 2003 from through the looking glass
snake oil is actually good for you. contains omega3, just sayin...
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- KVRAF
- 10260 posts since 19 Feb, 2004 from Paris
KVR is top, because from times to times, we can see some dark messiahs emerging, and daring to share their one and only awsome knowledge of the ultimate truth, and try to educate the poor masses, because they know everything on everything, whats going on behind the scenes, and how masses are exposed to evil consequences if they dont listen to the gnu guru.
These new gurus usually speak of sloppy software, but of course they never completed a single piece of software themselves. They give orders, more than advices, to those stupid real entrepreneurs who do things, who make things happen, but none of their own very successfull business can be seen anywhere.
And they seem to ignore that most standard, average people, like the humble me, have only one thought : What if we did put all these Messiahs together for a 6 months hollydays on a desert island, and then count the survivals ?
These new gurus usually speak of sloppy software, but of course they never completed a single piece of software themselves. They give orders, more than advices, to those stupid real entrepreneurs who do things, who make things happen, but none of their own very successfull business can be seen anywhere.
And they seem to ignore that most standard, average people, like the humble me, have only one thought : What if we did put all these Messiahs together for a 6 months hollydays on a desert island, and then count the survivals ?
http://www.lelotusbleu.fr Synth Presets
77 Exclusive Soundbanks for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there
77 Exclusive Soundbanks for 23 synths, 8 Sound Designers, Hours of audio Demos. The Sound you miss might be there
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- KVRAF
- 5948 posts since 19 Jun, 2008 from Melbourne, Australia
At last! Some recognition of my workLotuzia wrote:KVR is top, because from times to times, we can see some dark messiahs emerging, and daring to share their one and only awsome knowledge of the ultimate truth, and try to educate the poor masses, because they know everything on everything, whats going on behind the scenes, and how masses are exposed to evil consequences if they dont listen to the gnu guru.
joking!!Peace,
Andy.
... space is the place ...
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fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
I don't think more expensive music software is necessarily more reliable. With instrument plugins, the good ones allow you to save your presets outside the DAW, so you can back them up just like any other file.
And with DAWs, it depends on the developer(s). Some are super accessible and responsive, like the guy from Mulab. Others not so. Mixcraft Pro cost me twice as much as Mulab, yet after months they still have not fixed a bug several people reported on their forum.
And the more expensive DAWs are also more complex, which makes them more vulnerable to bugs and glitches.
I guess with many expensive products you pay for the illusion of getting something superior, which will make your music superior. Just like some people will buy a Bentley, when an BMW would do the trick for the fraction of the cost...
And with DAWs, it depends on the developer(s). Some are super accessible and responsive, like the guy from Mulab. Others not so. Mixcraft Pro cost me twice as much as Mulab, yet after months they still have not fixed a bug several people reported on their forum.
And the more expensive DAWs are also more complex, which makes them more vulnerable to bugs and glitches.
I guess with many expensive products you pay for the illusion of getting something superior, which will make your music superior. Just like some people will buy a Bentley, when an BMW would do the trick for the fraction of the cost...
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- KVRAF
- 11162 posts since 16 Mar, 2003 from Porto - Portugal
Wow, you are choosing between a Bentley and a BMW... Lucky you.fluffy_little_something wrote:Just like some people will buy a Bentley, when an BMW would do the trick for the fraction of the cost...
Fernando (FMR)
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- Banned
- 10196 posts since 12 Mar, 2012 from the Bavarian Alps to my feet and the globe around my head
They would eat CRACKED coconuts, and the whole coconut industry would decline...Lotuzia wrote:What if we did put all these Messiahs together for a 6 months hollydays on a desert island, and then count the survivals ?
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fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
Hehe, no, I don't have any car myselffmr wrote:Wow, you are choosing between a Bentley and a BMW... Lucky you.fluffy_little_something wrote:Just like some people will buy a Bentley, when an BMW would do the trick for the fraction of the cost...
BMWs start at 25k euros or so, Bentleys probably at 10x that much...-
- KVRAF
- 26947 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds
I think we can safely say, of the things that are or might be in decline, that this huge head of yours is not one of them...The Telenator wrote:Only one or two commenters show they have the intelligence to see things for what they really are. Also obvious is that almost no one here has ever operated their own businesses. Absolutely no understanding of free markets. Nothing. Nada.
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The_Hidden_Goose The_Hidden_Goose https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=10878 - KVRian
- 945 posts since 8 Dec, 2003 from Birmingham-ish, UK (Tamworth, but shhh!)
As far as I'm concerned, the software instrument world is golden. There's more stuff out there that interests me than ever.
Yes, that's bad for my wallet (bedroom producer, so no incoming money to cover it but the money I get from my day job). And I would be the first to put my hand up and state that I've used warezy things before and possibly still do, although I can't think of anything off the top of my head which I use regularly that I haven't paid for except for freeware.
However, I don't think that $200+ is too much for an instrument. It might be too much for ME to buy regularly (although I can be quite silly with money when I want something), but I don't expect every developer to pore their energy into products that specifically suit ME, price-wise or other.
And I can always save up if I really want it - things are unlikely to become obsolete within a few months, and have probably been updated / made better by the time I get the funds together...we don't have to be so impatient all the time!
If a developer thinks that's a fair price for the work gone into a product and the work expected to support it to the level they want to do so then that's up to them. If nobody buys it, then that tells a story. If people love it and buy accordingly, then that's a valid answer just the same. As per the free market thingy that was mentioned before, the markets will ultimately decide on this.
Great when things are cheap or free. That doesn't mean they're bad plugins or good. I won't buy it if I don't think it'll do what I want, and I suspect that's the policy of most users ultimately.
As for KVR....yes there's some sillyness. But when we're not just all commenting on a "hardware-vs-software" or "dongle" type arguments for which there are so many different opinions and experiences and no definitive answer for everyone, then I've found this place to be fairly friendly, funny, informative, helpful and a pleasure to use.
Yes there are fanboys out there, but there are always detractors too - No one's opinion is absolute truth, and if you're unable to parse useful information from a freely public online forum amidst the flaming, trolling and high-horsing, then public online forums really aren't for you!
A bit of immaturity should be allowed too. Music is a passion for most of us, and passions can bring out the worst and best of us. I'd rather have that than a place full of sterile academia! (not that I'm bashing academics...they tease out the maths that make my sounds possible!)
Yes, that's bad for my wallet (bedroom producer, so no incoming money to cover it but the money I get from my day job). And I would be the first to put my hand up and state that I've used warezy things before and possibly still do, although I can't think of anything off the top of my head which I use regularly that I haven't paid for except for freeware.
However, I don't think that $200+ is too much for an instrument. It might be too much for ME to buy regularly (although I can be quite silly with money when I want something), but I don't expect every developer to pore their energy into products that specifically suit ME, price-wise or other.
And I can always save up if I really want it - things are unlikely to become obsolete within a few months, and have probably been updated / made better by the time I get the funds together...we don't have to be so impatient all the time!
If a developer thinks that's a fair price for the work gone into a product and the work expected to support it to the level they want to do so then that's up to them. If nobody buys it, then that tells a story. If people love it and buy accordingly, then that's a valid answer just the same. As per the free market thingy that was mentioned before, the markets will ultimately decide on this.
Great when things are cheap or free. That doesn't mean they're bad plugins or good. I won't buy it if I don't think it'll do what I want, and I suspect that's the policy of most users ultimately.
As for KVR....yes there's some sillyness. But when we're not just all commenting on a "hardware-vs-software" or "dongle" type arguments for which there are so many different opinions and experiences and no definitive answer for everyone, then I've found this place to be fairly friendly, funny, informative, helpful and a pleasure to use.
Yes there are fanboys out there, but there are always detractors too - No one's opinion is absolute truth, and if you're unable to parse useful information from a freely public online forum amidst the flaming, trolling and high-horsing, then public online forums really aren't for you!
A bit of immaturity should be allowed too. Music is a passion for most of us, and passions can bring out the worst and best of us. I'd rather have that than a place full of sterile academia! (not that I'm bashing academics...they tease out the maths that make my sounds possible!)
Q. Why is a mouse when it spins?
A. The higher the fewer.
A. The higher the fewer.
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- Banned
- 254 posts since 7 Jun, 2008 from On this 1 world!
fluffy_little_something wrote:I don't think more expensive music software is necessarily more reliable. With instrument plugins, the good ones allow you to save your presets outside the DAW, so you can back them up just like any other file....
And the more expensive DAWs are also more complex, which makes them more vulnerable to bugs and glitches.
I guess with many expensive products you pay for the illusion of getting something superior, which will make your music superior. Just like some people will buy a Bentley, when an BMW would do the trick for the fraction of the cost...
Just like many folks out there think that Pro Tools is a 'divine' DAW, only because it titles itself "Industry Standard". LOLLL!!!