How much do you use presets? [Poll]

[Torchlight]

But the F1 mechanic will drive a car. He just won't be as good at it as he is at fixing them and tuning them.

[Ingonator]

But the F1 mechanic will drive a car. He just won't be as good at it as he is at fixing them and tuning them.

Still the comparison makes no sense for me. There is simply no strict separation of being a sound designer and a musician.

BTW he'll drive "a" car or a F1 car?


Ingo

[Torchlight]

That's my point. He'll drive a car but not be good enough to drive an F1 car. Just as there are very good sound designers who are no more than average musicians. And very good musicians who are average sound designers or even can't do it at all. They are different roles.

[spirit]

I always tweak presets, sometimes a lot, sometimes not so much. If it's a basic sound I may not do much, after all, there's no point reinventing a spoon.

[Frantz]

So in your opinion that song sounded exactly like the Blade Runner score? Yes, that preset was BL inspired - which was precisely why I used it in the first place - but the song was as different from BL music as it can be. That is the whole point - same sounds & textures, different results.

I didn't think it sounded exactly like Blade Runner but was derivative of it. The problem for me was using the distinctive arp pattern unchanged which goes beyond just using a preset sound.

[olikana]

the whole argument of people here saying they use presets to save time is absolutely laughable.
cos if you really know how to use a synth making most of the the sounds you need is actually faster than browsing through tons of presets and synths and trying to squeeze someone elses preset into your music.

-the time it takes to make a bass on a synth to your exact specification : select oscillators, adjust filter and resonance, adjust modulations. total 5-15 minutes
-time it takes a preset junki to make a bass: look for preset threads, input credit card , wait for the sounds to arrive, browse through presets, select a a sound and try to squeeze it in your muusic with eq and compression or try and tweak it somehow cos u don't understand how the sound was made. total: hours

obviously learning a synth well takes time (and yes presets can be useful for learning)....but ultimately an elctronic musician should strive to know how to use at least one synth inside out (the synth is one of the core instruments of an electronic musician) ...unless he plans to make shitty generalistic edm ala avcii or just be a keayboard player.
someone who just plays back presets is using the synth as a rompler...not as a synth.
in the history of electronic music "sound design" was always integral part of the music making process. an electronic musician who doesn't try and push boundaries synthwise is not worth listening .

btw all these preset threads in instruments i'm not sure are really the result of high demand...but more the result of these so called "sound designers" spamming. they open preset threads and bump them no end . the actual majority of kvr in a recent poll voted to not even have preset threads in this main section. that says it all.
the kvr "sound designer" is a very strange phenomenon (probably the result of difficult financial times). they are generally musicians who are not yet good enough to produce music but as soon as they vaguely learn how to use a synth to make basic sounds they feel entitled to spam kvr with presets hoping to make some money from newbies and wannabes or find some sort of status among peers.
and most of them just copy sounds from popular music productions . hence they are copying sounds which were actually made by musicians and producers first. which shows that the really good musicians/producers don't actually need sounds from these "sound designers" and ironically it's exactly the other way round.

You can't make it to MTV without presets.
If you tweak your own, you'll get a mention in Sound on Sound for a squeaky demo, at best.

j/k

daft punk, depeche mode, chromeo, la roux etc manage just fine.
infact i don't know any existing good electronic musician which relies on presets.

btw i used "sound designer" in quotes throughout my post cos a true sound designer is actually someone who makes sounds for tv , movies or videogames (anything but music!).
the job descriptor "sound designer" was specifically introduced to indicate someone who used synths and instruments catering to other mediums but music.
someone who made sounds with synths for music related purposes was either a musician or a producer (or "synth programmer" was used too occasionally when dealing with the dx7 or huge modulars)
the term "sound designer" got raped since the late 90s when rob papen started using the term inappropriately to describe himself when releasing his virus soundsets (copying popular trance and pop productions sounds) and others soon followed suit like the guy from vengeance sound (who would release exact copies of the sounds he heard in other dance productions).then it caught on quickly on kvr.

now the situation is this:
basically the person who comes up with the original sound is simply an electronic musician/producer.
then one who tries to copy those sounds or anyone who spams forums selling presets "a sound designer"
and the ones using the presets wannabes looking for a shortcut to sound like the stuff they hear on tv (and these are the majority and unfortunately the reason why there's so much shitty unexciting music nowadays )

sorry if this offends anyone but i'm very passionate about music, and imo preset culture is the cancer of modern electronic music .

[zvenx]

@olikana, I am curious. What percentage of your income would you say you earn from your music?

rsp

[Wormhelmet]

I like using both. I have no issues with finding a sound someone else made and using it if it fits what I'm trying to play. The same goes for samples. I do like sound creation though. As much as song composition and almost as much as spontaneous improv jam sessions. In fact, I spend 50% of my time on synths doing preset creations and exploring sound potential. I have bought some amazing sound sets from people here on KVR and gotten some amazing free ones from great designers. Why not use them?

I don't look at people's way of making music, but just listen and see if I like it or don't. If they have made an entire song from entirely presets or samples, and I like it, they have accomplished much. To take a collection of sounds and turn it into something worth listening to is quite an achievement. Luckily there are quite a few that do this very well.

[Wormhelmet]

the whole argument of people here saying they use presets to save time is absolutely laughable.
cos if you really know how to use a synth making most of the the sounds you need is actually faster than browsing through tons of presets and synths and trying to squeeze someone elses preset into your music.

-the time it takes to make a bass on a synth to your exact specification : select oscillators, adjust filter and resonance, adjust modulations. total 5-15 minutes
-time it takes a preset junki to make a bass: look for preset threads, input credit card , wait for the sounds to arrive, browse through presets, select a a sound and try to squeeze it in your muusic with eq and compression or try and tweak it somehow cos u don't understand how the sound was made. total: hours

obviously learning a synth well takes time (and yes presets can be useful for learning)....but ultimately an elctronic musician should strive to know how to use at least one synth inside out (the synth is one of the core instruments of an electronic musician) ...unless he plans to make shitty generalistic edm ala avcii or just be a keayboard player.
someone who just plays back presets is using the synth as a rompler...not as a synth.
in the history of electronic music "sound design" was always integral part of the music making process. an electronic musician who doesn't try and push boundaries synthwise is not worth listening .

btw all these preset threads in instruments i'm not sure are really the result of high demand...but more the result of these so called "sound designers" spamming. they open preset threads and bump them no end . the actual majority of kvr in a recent poll voted to not even have preset threads in this main section. that says it all.
the kvr "sound designer" is a very strange phenomenon (probably the result of difficult financial times). they are generally musicians who are not yet good enough to produce music but as soon as they vaguely learn how to use a synth to make basic sounds they feel entitled to spam kvr with presets hoping to make some money from newbies and wannabes or find some sort of status among peers.
and most of them just copy sounds from popular music productions . hence they are copying sounds which were actually made by musicians and producers first. which shows that the really good musicians/producers don't actually need sounds from these "sound designers" and ironically it's exactly the other way round.

You can't make it to MTV without presets.
If you tweak your own, you'll get a mention in Sound on Sound for a squeaky demo, at best.

j/k

daft punk, depeche mode, chromeo, la roux etc manage just fine.
infact i don't know any existing good electronic musician which relies on presets.

btw i used "sound designer" in quotes throughout my post cos a true sound designer is actually someone who makes sounds for tv , movies or videogames (anything but music!).
the job descriptor "sound designer" was specifically introduced to indicate someone who used synths and instruments catering to other mediums but music.
someone who made sounds with synths for music related purposes was either a musician or a producer (or "synth programmer" was used too occasionally when dealing with the dx7 or huge modulars)
the term "sound designer" got raped since the late 90s when rob papen started using the term inappropriately to describe himself when releasing his virus soundsets (copying popular trance and pop productions sounds) and others soon followed suit like the guy from vengeance sound (who would release exact copies of the sounds he heard in other dance productions).then it caught on quickly on kvr.

now the situation is this:
basically the person who comes up with the original sound is simply an electronic musician/producer.
then one who tries to copy those sounds or anyone who spams forums selling presets "a sound designer"
and the ones using the presets wannabes looking for a shortcut to sound like the stuff they hear on tv (and these are the majority and unfortunately the reason why there's so much shitty unexciting music nowadays )

sorry if this offends anyone but i'm very passionate about music, and imo preset culture is the cancer of modern electronic music .

What an odd outlook on things. Particularly because everyone is borrowing or adding on established music ideas in the first place. to be entirely original would put someone making an entirely new genre of music. Sounds very elitist to me, but horses for courses. Everyone has their own opinions on what is a real musician or sound designer. If this works for you, great, but I would find it limiting on my music enjoyment.

Carry on!

[Crackbaby]

Dare i say i agree much with olikana? I know a lot of people here at kvr that i like use presets and i absolutely do not look down on them for doing so. Not at all.
People are different. What i do with music to feel good is different from anyone else. If you suffer from pain maybe you can't focus enough to tweak your own sounds.
For me tweaking a synth or drummachine is like sex where you try to touch the right buttons in order to climax. If you don't feel the same way it's probably hard to motivate yourself to tweak.
On my machindrum im playing a pattern. I've done everything from start. I loaded initialized machines and i've tweaked every sound, step and pattern myself. So i know that i've done 100% of this sound.
If you use some arpeggiated synthriff from nexus along with some processed drumloops and make a track out of it, how much did you really do of that composition?
In my heart, i wouldn't feel true to me if i did that. Each to his own.

I would say that if you want to call yourself a talented or gifted musician, then you better make your own sounds.
The things about presets and loops that really annoys me is when i hear these generic psytrance tracks with the same bassline, kick, sound effects and random vocal sample like the previous track. Aliens this, drugs that. Or the progressive house or whatever it has evolved to today. I think around year 2000 the trance was pretty inventive. Now it's all sounding the same. Maybe i need to dig deeper in order to find a mix giving the right feeling.

I got a mail about this today http://www.zenhiser.com/studio-essentia ... f-36753517

You get
Progressive Trance Basslines - 50
Progressive Trance Drum Beats - 200
Progressive Trance Drums - Hi Hats - 25
Progressive Trance Drums - Kicks - 25
Progressive Trance Drums - Percussion - 25
Progressive Trance Drums - Snares & Claps - 25
Progressive Trance FX - 25
Progressive Trance Prog Lines (Includes midi parts) - 100
Progressive Trance Synth Loops - 50

Included is midi tracks for synths! I think this is aimed at wannabe suckers. Now where's the talent or gift in this? Just like Olikana said, listen to the riffs and sounds. It's just what's on radio, nothing inventive or new.

Making your own sounds with software is different from hardware. It's MUCH easier on hardware. You can't focus on the sound enough when you have to keep your eyes on the screen. Brain can't do both at the same time.

I hope i didn't offend anyone love you all

[mcnoone]

the whole argument

is closed minded, elitist, anti-mumbojumbo.
KVR audio is a place where developers and their plugins are first and foremost the main focus of the forum.
The sounds "designed" or presets made for those plugins do make a difference on many plugin users perception of what said plugin is capable of doing. What it's potential is.
This can also be said of the music done using said plugin, and the musicians that create that music.
To say to one group out of those three.
Developer, musician, and "sound designer" (which is a term used way before Rob Pappen btw)
...are all part of a whole, which helps to make this a great field to be in.
The spamming, and copying of others, as you refer to in your elitist attitude, could be said also for developers and musicians here as well then.
It's very fortunate that most here don't take your hypocritical attitude toward what is an established form of expression. The one we did, and now do call "sound design".
Apparently you've never read any keyboard magazines from the 80's, where they called it sound design back then. Where the many ads, articles, and interviews, concerning synth sounds, clearly showed an established business. Where ads for audio schools could teach one "sound design".

Sorry if this offends you, but it needs to be said.

[Crackbaby]

What an odd outlook on things. Particularly because everyone is borrowing or adding on established music ideas in the first place. to be entirely original would put someone making an entirely new genre of music. Sounds very elitist to me, but horses for courses. Everyone has their own opinions on what is a real musician or sound designer. If this works for you, great, but I would find it limiting on my music enjoyment.

Carry on!

I've always had this idea that everything i create should be original. If i've heard something like it, i change. I want to make what hasn't been made yet. Inventing a new genre, yes please.
I can't see how that would be elitist, at least not in a bad way. Maybe it's just having high demands on yourself?

[BERFAB]

I love presets. I really appreciate the talent that goes into creating the sounds that inspire me to play. I personally don't have the time or inclination to do it myself. I prefer to spend my time playing and composing.

Typical of the way I work: Currently, I'm having fun using Synthmaster 2. Lots of good stuff there, and it has a great sound. Last night, I thought a nice B3 voice would sound good over a project I was working on. I recall that Synthmaster does an excellent B3 (and other organs) emulation. I know this because I've been through all the presets.

As an aside, I have NI's organ product for Kontakt, but I prefer the playability of a convincing synth to using samples.

So I dial in the various organ patches, and stick with one that I really like for this particular project. I think the Leslie emulation with the mod wheel could use a bit of tweaking, so I do that. Then, I add just a touch of 'verb, and, done!

No matter what sound is in my head, I know somewhere in the thousands of presets for instruments I own, SOMEONE has come up with something to match it, or at least get close to it.

Cheers
-B

[ferez21]

I will say that 30% of my sounds i program from scratch, another 30% are presets which i use as a base and heavily modify them, and the remaining 40% are pre-made presets that i liked and usually modify them a little to suit my needs.

I see no point in trying to build from scratch a preset you can easily have access to - at the end of the day, no one who hear your music give a sh*t if you programmed it yourself or not. Music is so much more than sound design.
It's like playing rock music and building *yourself* a new guitar every gig.

That said, i will never rely solely on pre-made presets, as i enjoy the sense of acheivment programming some cool sounds myself, and it emotionally better connects me to my own art (art...or crap, whatever).

I do think every electronic musician should know how to make sounds himself and again, not just go out and buy all the popular synth patches and never tweak a synth's parameters again.

[Crackbaby]

One thing that i think is different and sets people a part which maybe could explain why some like presets and others dont: I don't hear sounds in my head. When i create a patch i don't go after a certain sound that i have in my head. I go after a feeling. I don't even make up my mind if it should be a pad or a bass. The journey will take me were it takes me and somehow the sound will end up in a track.