Chord Progression Confusion

[aquar]

Hi all,

Hoping someone could clear a few things up for me.

Below is a basic chord progression (a very weak bad progression I admit)
but I think it helps highlight the confusion.

8 Bar Sequence.

i,III,v,IV,III,i,IV,VII

Am (Root Position)
C Major (Root Position)
E Minor (Second Inversion)
D Major (1st Inversion)

C Major (Root Position)
Am (Root Position)
D Major (1st Inversion)
G Major (1st Inversion)

As you can see I've tried to convert it into the numeral system but looking at the chords in general I've noticed that they belong to the Key of G Major/E minor.

With that in mind and assuming a chord progression doesn't have to begin on the 1 chord is it better for me to express it as?

ii,IV,vi,V,IV,ii,V,I

Am (is the 2 chord in G major)
C Major (is the the 4 chord in G Major)
etc.

Or would it depend on the melody or bassline?

The chord sequence sounds a bit boring but okish even though it doesn't make much use of the tonic dominant relationship.


To add further to the confusion I could also write it another way.
Lets say for example I wanted to express it as a tune based in A natural minor that occasionally borrows from other keys.

i,III,v,IV,III,i,IV,VII


Could someone please help straighten out the confusion
Cheers.

[JumpingJackFlash]

is it better for me to express it as?

ii,IV,vi,V,IV,ii,V,I

Probably. That way you have an imperfect cadence halfway through and a perfect cadence at the end.

Incidentally, have you thought about changing the inversions so it ends with Am (1st Inversion), D Major (Root Position), G major (Root Position)?

Lets say for example I wanted to express it as a tune based in A natural minor that occasionally borrows from other keys.
i,III,v,IV,III,i,IV,VII

Just looking at the chords, this doesn't make as much sense.

However, what you need to be asking is what what note feels like home? Does it feel like it comes to rest on G? (Or, if A does indeed feel like home, then it could be modal.)

There's no law that says you have to use functional harmony of course (unless this is for a school exam where this is a requirement).

[aquar]

Probably. That way you have an imperfect cadence halfway through and a perfect cadence at the end.

Incidentally, have you thought about changing the inversions so it ends with Am (1st Inversion), D Major (Root Position), G major (Root Position)?

To be honest the progression was initially just scribbled on a piece of paper on a train, a random selection if you like.
It was only when I got home and plugged in the chords those nagging doubts crept in.

It occurred to me if I had to communicate the progression (transpose) I'd be in trouble.

I will try your suggestions just to see what happens, I normally wouldn't bother to try to force such a progression but its worth experimenting.

However, what you need to be asking is what what note feels like home? Does it feel like it comes to rest on G? (Or, if A does indeed feel like home, then it could be modal.)

There's no law that says you have to use functional harmony of course (unless this is for a school exam where this is a requirement).

Yeah that makes sense. I'll try to develop a couple of melodies when I get time and listen to what feels like the resting point.

Thanks for the help its appreciated.

[jancivil]

NM, redundant point.

[Nystul]

It will probably depend on the melody or bass line. If I were to make a song with that progression it would be A minor. The G major idea looks much easier to explain on paper, but by the time you get to the one G chord after 8 measures it sounds like a dominant chord to me.

[aquar]

It will probably depend on the melody or bass line. If I were to make a song with that progression it would be A minor. The G major idea looks much easier to explain on paper, but by the time you get to the one G chord after 8 measures it sounds like a dominant chord to me.

Yeah A minor does feel right.
I am glad about that because when I made the progression that was my intent.
As you say on paper G major is easier to explain.

The odd thing about this progression is if I walk way and leave the chords
running and come back its hard to hear which chord is the home key.
I suppose that's the trouble with weak contrived progressions they don't seem to have much identity.

Thanks for the help Nystul appreciated.

[jancivil]

at first glance I was tempted to assume A as center and a Dorian sort of affect. But there is your ii-V-I in G, which illustrates the problem of chords in a mode perfectly, hence your ambiguity.

[aquar]

at first glance I was tempted to assume A as center and a Dorian sort of affect. But there is your ii-V-I in G, which illustrates the problem of chords in a mode perfectly, hence your ambiguity.

Yeah right Jancivil,
The A Dorian mode plays over this just fine but when it hits the ii-V-I
the progression seems to shift away and starts to feel disjointed.
Any melodies I try to play over the top are as weak as the chord progression.
Nothing satisfying ever seems to come of this.

I am glad I posted it here though because you guys helped cleared up a few things in my mind.

Thanks for responding your knowledge is appreciated.

[jancivil]

well, with no rhythmic movement, every chord has equal weight so the nature of ii V I in G might come to the fore.

if you went Am Am D G | (Am)
in four beats... that's actually kind of typical and would work.


as a general principles, I'll say a modal flavor is obscured by use of too many chords.

[aquar]

Yeah as always good advice.
Thanks.

[NKF]

not sure what the point is but given the rhythmic scheme and assuming the strong beats have more weight, i hear this in A minor. Although you don't get a dominant resolution so perhaps Aeolian is more apt.

To answer your question, i would not use letters because the chords don't really follow a tonal paradigm. I mean they could if you used the right inversions but since they don't ...

[jancivil]

how is A Aeolian 'apt' with a D major which appears to be one of the basic chords. the sixth degree is apparently F#.

what's wrong with using roman numbers to indicate the relationship again? it's meaningful. Must the major/minor paradigm own our minds to the extent that you're discouraging meaningful use of numbers? Jesus.

[NKF]

how is A Aeolian 'apt' with a D major which appears to be one of the basic chords. the sixth degree is apparently F#.

secondary dominant that acts adds colour but structurally not necessary. Ya , i'm mixing tonality and modality; The only reason i did not say A minor was because there is no dominant but considering the progression was admittedly lacking in logic, I think the compromise is warranted.

Anyways, tonal harmony and the concept of functionality is merely a framework in your mind. YOu can call it whatever you want as long that makes sense to you and you can apply it to different pitch centres.