KVR Audio

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:47 pm

Hello everyone. I'm trying to recreate or approximate the sound of Stewart Copeland's drums in the songs "Message in a Bottle" and/or "Don't Stand so Close to Me." Has anyone made any presets for NI Studio Drummer or Abbey Road 60s/70s Drummer that he or she would be willing to share with me here? I would appreciate it very much.

If no one has created any presets, I'd be willing to learn how to make them myself if someone were to give me some instructions for how to achieve the desired effect.

Here are the examples:

Thanks!

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Sun Jun 09, 2013 12:42 pm

That's some quality engineering on those earlier albums. Copeland had a really distinctive high and tight snare sound, so that's the biggest hurdle probably. Other than that, a tasteful amount of verb/delay on those old mixes. I have AR 60 and 70 but not SD... I'll play around a bit this morning and see if I can come up with something...

fedexnman · Post by **fedexnman** » Sun Jun 09, 2013 1:19 pm

Before the Police broke it off I heard that Sting got all pissy with Stew about all the hihats that he played lol , hes got a unique style , almost a reggae , ska type thing going on too . Walking on the Moon , is probably my favorite drum work by him .

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Sun Jun 09, 2013 1:51 pm

Thanks, kbaccki!

Yes, the Snare and Hi-Hats are the most difficult parts, but making all the pieces of the drumkit fit together is bound to be the toughest process.
Also, I'm sure that you already know this, but there is convolution reverb built-into the instruments. I can't believe that it took me so long to realize this.

Let me know how everything goes!

*too bad NI didn't sample a TAMA kit*

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Sun Jun 09, 2013 2:24 pm

Actually, I just have the original 70's Drums on this new machine, haven't upgraded to Drummer yet... I guess I could get drummer installed and do NKI's for both... the 70's Tight Kit is actually a good start, I think. Been playing around with it for a few minutes. The snare is pretty close, with just a minor pitch tweak and some mic balancing. The toms are similar in tone and resonance with the right mic balancing (the default is very dry). I'm actually having trouble getting the close, dry, thumpy kick. It's just a low thump, which is hard to do without the right mic'ing to begin with, right?! The hats are actually pretty loud and present, so that's the first step there... still need the right ambient spread on those. Anyway, may need to install drummer anyway to get more mix options for kick, hihat, and cross stick...

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Sun Jun 09, 2013 2:26 pm

It sounds as though everything's going pretty well. I WOULD recommend installing Drummer since it does have more mixing options that its predecessor, and also because 70s Drums is kept as a separate sample library. (You wouldn't lose anything.)

Thanks for keeping me updated on your progress.

EDIT: Don't forget to try the second Tight Kit snare.

theodore_whitmore · Post by **theodore_whitmore** » Sun Jun 09, 2013 4:04 pm

There are some little nuggets in this Sound On Sound article that you might find useful:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/mar04/a ... tracks.htm

I found the notion of recording drums quietly to tape interesting in this era of saturating everything to death.

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:29 pm

kbaccki, have you made any progress?

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Thu Jun 13, 2013 4:34 pm

Sorry didn't get back sooner. I actually never had the drummer installers to begin with, so had to send a request to NI... finally heard back and got them installed last night. Had some work to finish up yesterday and today, but will circle back today... I'm finding getting the kick right on the 70's kit is the hardest part, so need to play around a bit more..

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Thu Jun 13, 2013 4:52 pm

Here's a preview of what I'm writing: (and the current drum sound)

http://db.tt/eZlLE2an

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:30 pm

Give this a try...

https://co.native-instruments.com/index ... chid=12959

First pass, but all the basic elements are there I think... his snare has a certain "chuck" that's hard to get just right with the EQ... and I think I need some harder compression on the snare to bring it forward a bit more...
gonna read that SOS article posted above by theodore_whitmore, see what the engineer has to say...

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:57 pm

I have no idea what my password is, and there's no reset password button.

EDIT: Never mind, I somehow remembered it. I'll try the drum preset now.

EDIT 2: It's nice so far, but the snare definitely needs a louder crack.

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Fri Jun 14, 2013 5:58 pm

More work, less play...

... Some of the police mixes, esp. the older ones have a more subdued drum mix, while others have much more upfront drums. The two tunes you posted are good examples. The NKI is pretty neutral in that regard, I think, so you could add the necessary bus compressor, add'l verb, filter etc. to get the desired sound.

I played around a bit last night and hacked together a quick demo of the NKI out of the box... I think the drum output channel was maybe -0.8 or so with just barricade on the master catching a couple of overs...

http://www.hepcat.biz/songs/half-time.mp3

The snare mix out of the box is pretty up front at high velocities... Anyway, hope you find it useful... would love to ghear your tune when it's done!

synchronizer · Post by **synchronizer** » Fri Jun 14, 2013 7:18 pm

Thank you so much for your help! I'll probably combine some of the mixing settings that you've created with those that I've set in my current drum preset.

As for my music, I don't know how soon I'll finish it, but I'll certainly share it when it's done. I just wish that I had proper headphones though. Because I listen to my music through macbook pro speakers, I have an incredibly hard time mixing.

Here's something that I composed a few months ago:

http://db.tt/Y2aTn0vY

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:39 pm

Sounds good... what strings do you use? Definitely recommend at least a decent pair of headphones for mixing, perhaps combined with a tool like TB Isone, if necessary. Among others, I even still use an old pair of Sony MDR-7502 for putzing around, and they sound great... I think you can get those for like $50... not exactly ruler flat frequency response, but whatever your mixing tools are, you need to know those tools inside and out, esp. mixing on phones... the headband came apart after like 12 years, but that's what duct tape is for...

Looking for "The Police" Kontakt Drum Presets for (Studio Drummer, 70s/60s Drummer)+ good headphones