M Audio Keystation Pro 88....Anyone got one yet?

[Har]

Well if you think about it, a weighted keyboard action shouldn't really have aftertouch - after all an acoustic piano has no aftertouch. If aftertouch is important to you, then i suggest a semi/non-weighted keyboard.

Well, that might be correct if you assume that the weighted keyboard action controller was going to be used specifically for pure acoustic piano sounds only and you wanted to do nothing but simulate the pure, 100% accurate realities of that instrument.

However, there are those of us who are trained/classically trained on real pianos and would like to transfer some of the same playing techniques to totally different sounds...with the additional functionality of aftertouch, pitchbend, modulation, etc made available that other synth controllers have as well. There's no rule/law anywhere that states you must use piano-weighted controllers for nothing but accuratly mimicing piano sounds.

I already have a 76-key non-weighted keyboard which is just fine for when I want a non-weighted action for certain playing styles (i.e. organ, certain synth-playing techniques, etc)...but I'd like to suppliment that with an 88-key wooden-weighted controller for those other times when I want to be able to articulate notes in a playing style that just feels more natural on a real piano action...but not necessarily just for simulating real piano sounds.

[kuniklo]

Is there a similar controller in that price range that does have aftertouch? I haven't been able to find one.

Not exactly in that range, but the Studiologic SL880 Pro 88-key has channel aftertouch and both pitch and mod wheels, going for $599 at Musician's Friend (doesn't have all the ginchy MIDI sliders, knobs and buttons the M-Audio does, though, if that's important to you too).

I've already got a SL-161 with aftertouch, but it's only 61 keys. The main reason I'm considering getting another controller is that I really want something with knobs for automating VSTs. I think I'm going to go with the Keystation unless I can find a synth that works as well.

[Phaedo]

I'm with Har on this, a master keyboard should do everything.

Doing everything well, that'd be harder...

[McLilith]

I'm with Har on this, a master keyboard should do everything.

That would ultimately mean keyboards that could change their "feel" on demand. Want a Steinway feel? No problem, just change a front-panel setting and it's yours. Want to switch to a Prophet 5, MiniMoog, Rhodes Piano, Wurlitzer piano, a Buchla touch keyboard (no moving parts), or even a tracker-style pipe organ feel? Just change some settings on the front panel.

You might laugh, but I think it's probably possible. The next question is, how expensive would it be? That one's followed by how far into the future do we have to time travel, in order to get one?

More seriously, I have to wonder why I can't think of a musical keyboard that an end user can easily adjust the feel of its action. I don't mean to extremes like I first spoke of, but more modest adjustments. It would certainly be possible to arrange for a feature like this. Just some basic control over things like stiffness and depth of key travel would be very nice. Am I the only one who would appreciate the ability to fine-tune the feel of my keyboard to match my own personal tastes?


later,
McLilith

[Phaedo]

Quite a cool idea, actually.

A problem is weight. The feel of weight is very different from stiffness, there's no sensible way (yet?) of simulating it.

However, on the realms of the near-future achievable, I see no reason a piano-weighted keyboard couldn't have polyphonic aftertouch.

[McLilith]

Quite a cool idea, actually.

A problem is weight. The feel of weight is very different from stiffness, there's no sensible way (yet?) of simulating it.

One might not have to simulate as much as what it might first appear. It's certainly possible to have some adjustments for the weighting of the keys. It would probably make the keys much more intricate, but it should be possible.

As for simulation, there is probably technology developed for automotive active suspension systems, virtual reality systems, and force-feedback controllers on simulators which could be adapted to help simulate different aspects of a keyboard's response. (I'm certainly not saying this technology could simply be "bolted into" a typical commercial keyboard, mind you. I'm sure it would take a lot of refinement and modification to before it could be applied to a musical keyboard.)

However, on the realms of the near-future achievable, I see no reason a piano-weighted keyboard couldn't have polyphonic aftertouch.

Yes, that is absolutely possible with current technology. It's all a matter of cost versus demand I suppose. Perhaps all the keyboard players should petition the major companies to develop more products like this. (Of course, we better back up our demands with an appropriate number of product purchases, so they will take us seriously. I get really disappointed when a breakthrough product comes to the market, and it gets dropped by the manufacturer in the first few year because no one appreciated it enough to make any purchases.)

later,
McLilith

[isdjan]

I, personally, found out that i hardly ever use after touch, but that's a matter of taste certainly.

so this keyboard might very well be my favourite choice.

one question about the additional buttons, right below the faders and knobs:

are these defineable buttons velocity-aware by any chance? would be great to have such a full scale keyboard with drum pads, a grown-up microkontrol

[Manfred]

FYI: I got M-Audio to write me about a shipping date for the elusive Keystation 88.They say it is shipping out this week.Say that Guitar Central is their first order to fill since they ordered first. .

Anyway, it looks like they really did produce this product.I was beginning to wonder

[Har]

FYI: I got M-Audio to write me about a shipping date for the elusive Keystation 88.They say it is shipping out this week.Say that Guitar Central is their first order to fill since they ordered first. .

Anyway, it looks like they really did produce this product.I was beginning to wonder

Strange how there's still no mention of it at all anywhere on the M-Audio website...

It was starting to make me wonder if the Keystation 88 was going to go the way of that vaporware control-surface they were forever hyping on their old site that was supposed to use some weird, amazing touch-sensitive material developed by "the Canadian Space Agency" or something...and then vanished without a trace.

[pygmallion13]

1st post.

This one caught my eye, because I have been trying really hard to get information on this controller.

Here is all the information I have so far.

The keyboard itself is designed from the ground up. They did not use another company for the keyboard.

I have 3 reports on the keyboard feel.
1. M-Audio specialist whom helped design it, says he LOVES IT(he is a musician as well).
2. A person from Germany whom demo'd the final prototype and said the action was excellent.
3. Another person that played with one here in the states also affirms that it has a very nice action.

I also had confirmed that the weight and rebound speed allows one to play 32nd notes.
This is nice, since I will be doing drum programming from the keyboard.

Next, nearly every knob and button are totally assignable.
The transport buttons above the Modulation and Pitch wheels work very well with mainstream software, and are totally assignable. This is a very nice feature, as I hate having to turn myself around to hit a key on the computer keyboard.

They have tested the keyboard on both an 'X' and 'Z' style stand and there is no 'key rubbing' cause by the keyboard bending, this is also accomplished by it's light weight at under 50lbs(sorry metrics).

The LCD is a very bright(blue), however it is not adjustable, not sure if that means the angle or brightness... oh well..

It can be powered by either the USB or a normal DC Power adapter(so dont worry if you dont have USB) it can still be powered.

The sliders can be 'inverted' in order to control 'hammond' type tonebar softsynths.

What else... thats pretty much it. It is done, and they emailed me a couple weeks ago also confirming that shipment of the 88pro will begin on the last week of May in the States.

I also preordered mine from EastCoast music back at the beginning of April. I am very excited about this controller. I've been using an ASR-10 since 93, and really need a full scale keyboard in my studio. AfterTouch: Since I nearly never use aftertouch, this is a feature that I will not miss.. but of course others may disagree.
Hopefully the wait will be worth it.



-pygmallion13

[Phaedo]

Thanks for the heads up, pyg.

[isdjan]

1st post. [...]

Here is all the information I have so far.

[...]

-pygmallion13

welcome to KvR

so - you didn't mention anything about velocity-aware buttons (apart from the keyboard obviously) - so this product won't fulfill my drum trigger dreams, will it?

[McLilith]

I also had confirmed that the weight and rebound speed allows one to play 32nd notes.

Yes, but at what tempo?

Even my crappiest keyboard will play 32nd, 64th, and even shorter notes--depending on the tempo of the music.

later,
McLilith

[Har]

I also had confirmed that the weight and rebound speed allows one to play 32nd notes.

Yes, but at what tempo?

Even my crappiest keyboard will play 32nd, 64th, and even shorter notes--depending on the tempo of the music.

later,
McLilith

I think I know what pygmallion13 is referring to: how the keys rebound after striking them can effect how quickly you can do things like rapid-fire repeats on notes, such as like the two-handed high speed "thumb drumroll" technique on the intro to Billy Joel's "Angry Young Man"....having the right weight and rebound on the keyboard feel can really help with those kinds of playing techniques.

[Phaedo]

I think McLilith may be trolling...