Your opinions on Cakewalk Dimension Pro

[planetearth]

Finally quality wise Kontakt is certainly better though most of its sounds fall well below the top instruments out there. Dimension Pro is a really a mix of synth and sampler while Kontakt is more sampler. It shows in the sounds, with the Expansion Packs Dim Pro has a touch under 4 gigs of sounds most of them compressed. Kontakt has 25 gigs with their new compression scheme. This means in general Dimpro is working with much smaller or more lightly sample instruments. To counteract this they use synth very aggressively on most instruments. The guitars (650 samples, 215 megs), strings (1.2 gigs 2k samples), brass (85, 250 samples) and sax (67 megs, 300 samples) all sound quite reasonable, but most other instruments especially the GPO sound very synthy.

Categorically

Pianos edge to Kontakt but neither is going to satify anyone.
Organs solid edge to Kontakt.
Synth huge edge to Dim Pro. However...
Vintage Synth is all Kontakt.
Guitars edge to Dim Pro.
Bass is a draw.
Drums are just confusing but an edge to Kontakt.
Slight Edge to Kontakt.
Orchestra to Kontakt in a rout.
Choir Kontakt in another rout.
World non-percussion is a huge edge to Kontakt.
Loops are all Dim Pro. But sadly I doubt any of us care about loops.
The file system is orders of magnitude better on Kontakt.
Third party support is almost entirely Kontakt.

So overall Dimpro wins for synthers and loopers, comes quite close as a band instrument. Kontakt wins utterly in Orchestra, Choir, World and Vintage as well as interface, file system and third party support.

I'd agree with most of this, and would like to add a few points:

• ● DimPro comes "free" with some versions of SONAR (or $20 on sale), while Kontakt's full version (with all libraries) can be quite expensive.
  
  ● DimPro uses Garritan's "Pocket Orchestra", while Kontakt uses Vienna Symphonic Library. Apples and oranges there.
  
  ● DimPro hasn't really been "updated" in quite a while, but Kontakt gets a new version with new features almost every year--whether you need any of it or not.
  
  ● Kontakt's guitars don't sound too great out of the box, but you can do a lot more with them, thanks to Kontakt's scripting features. Add an amp/cab sim, and you're good to go.
  
  ● DimPro's guitars sound nice and processed, but as HaganeSteel pointed out, the have some problems with the samples.

I'm a pretty big DimPro fan, and I use it more than Kontakt, but they both have their uses, I think.

Steve

[bigcat1969]

It should be noted that I'm a totally newbie, so my opinion's should be taken with a taste of salt. Thanks for the input. It clarifies a few things for me esp about the guitars. I have had some fun with Elektric, just don't know what I'm doing with it yet.
Oddly from my comparison, I really like Dim Pro. I was disappointed in my own opinion after I typed it. Sadly I don't care at all for GPO so that shaded my opinion a lot. I'm an amateur so this is all a big toy / hopefully musical learning experience and DimPro is a lovely toy for $20 which I was lucky enough to buy it for. It's fun just plugging sounds into midis I find on the net and listening to what happens or playing my little keyboard with odd synth sounds.
This is my first version of each, though I was mad they took the good pianos out for version 4, so I don't have any knowledge/opinion of the upgrade policies.

[HaganeSteel]

It should be noted that I'm a totally newbie, so my opinion's should be taken with a taste of salt. Thanks for the input. It clarifies a few things for me esp about the guitars. I have had some fun with Elektric, just don't know what I'm doing with it yet.
Oddly from my comparison, I really like Dim Pro. I was disappointed in my own opinion after I typed it. Sadly I don't care at all for GPO so that shaded my opinion a lot. I'm an amateur so this is all a big toy / hopefully musical learning experience and DimPro is a lovely toy for $20 which I was lucky enough to buy it for. It's fun just plugging sounds into midis I find on the net and listening to what happens or playing my little keyboard with odd synth sounds.
This is my first version of each, though I was mad they took the good pianos out for version 4, so I don't have any knowledge/opinion of the upgrade policies.

Both you and planetearth were pretty spot on.

I don't like GPO's sound either. Oddly enough, I like Pocket Orchestra more than Personal Orchestra. I'm not sure why, but Personal Orchestra just sounds like everything was recorded at a lower quality to me, and Pocket Orchestra doesn't. I don't think it has anything to do with the samples so much as their programming. Whatever I run through Dimension Pro seems to sound beautiful and clean.

You guys who bought this for $20 dollars are really lucky. For that price, it's truly amazing, even with all my bitching. I bitch about it because I bought it for $99 back before all the updates, so not only did I have to deal with the poor sample editing, but also all the tuning problems.

I do a lot of orchestral stuff, but it's easy enough to avoid the bad samples if you don't.

I still think Dimension Pro was worth the money solely because of Digital Sound Factory. It's a really cheap, low CPU way of getting some fantastic sounds. When I can afford to buy the Studio Orchestra soundset, I will.

[BBFG#]

Funny thing about Dimension is I get to a point where I rarely consider it when thinking of the next instrument to add in a midi sequence, but everytime I go to it after not finding something in my other synths, it usually has the instrument that does the job. I've notice too, like others, the sample quality is different in Dimension than the same samples made for other players. Sometime that makes it better and sometimes it doesn't.

I've downloaded the demo pack for Kontakt from DSF just to hear the difference. But haven't got it to load yet. We'll see.

[HaganeSteel]

I've notice too, like others, the sample quality is different in Dimension than the same samples made for other players. Sometime that makes it better and sometimes it doesn't.

Yes! I've no idea what it is, and wanted to avoid outright saying that because I didn't want people to think I was nuts, but it's true.

I don't know what Dimension Pro does to the samples, but I like it.

It must have this magical line of code that says make_stuff_sound_good.

Weirdly, the WAVs sound identical to me as they do in Dimension Pro, but it's like Dimension Pro ups the quality. It is a noticeable difference from soundfonts.

Am I crazy?

[Sounddigger]

I've notice too, like others, the sample quality is different in Dimension than the same samples made for other players. Sometime that makes it better and sometimes it doesn't.

Yes! I've no idea what it is, and wanted to avoid outright saying that because I didn't want people to think I was nuts, but it's true.

I don't know what Dimension Pro does to the samples, but I like it.

It must have this magical line of code that says make_stuff_sound_good.

Weirdly, the WAVs sound identical to me as they do in Dimension Pro, but it's like Dimension Pro ups the quality. It is a noticeable difference from soundfonts.

Am I crazy?

Although I haven't been looking at this closely yet, the first thing that comes to mind is that I remember reading DP has a special technology to deal with the aliasing of samples. That could be it

[lotus2035]

I'm really glad I picked up Dimension Pro for peanuts recently. Sound quality is more important to me than features and I was surprised just how good it sounds.

[bill45]

Is the $20 price still available?

[HaganeSteel]

I've notice too, like others, the sample quality is different in Dimension than the same samples made for other players. Sometime that makes it better and sometimes it doesn't.

Yes! I've no idea what it is, and wanted to avoid outright saying that because I didn't want people to think I was nuts, but it's true.

I don't know what Dimension Pro does to the samples, but I like it.

It must have this magical line of code that says make_stuff_sound_good.

Weirdly, the WAVs sound identical to me as they do in Dimension Pro, but it's like Dimension Pro ups the quality. It is a noticeable difference from soundfonts.

Am I crazy?

Although I haven't been looking at this closely yet, the first thing that comes to mind is that I remember reading DP has a special technology to deal with the aliasing of samples. That could be it

Okay, so it is magic.

No, seriously, it's why I fawn all over the DSF Proteus stuff.

The Proteus sounds don't have the Z-Plane, but the acoustics sound like a Proteus on steroids. Nice and crisp - they sound way better than the Proteus VX.

Is the $20 price still available?

Nope. Sorry.

[sjm]

Is the $20 price still available?

Cakewalk have been doing pretty regular $20 sales, so unless you need it ASAP, you're better off waiting until it goes on sale again. Ditto for Rapture.

[bigcat1969]

I've spent the last few days messing about with pianos. On sunday I messed with a real Baldwin grand and then tried remembering that sound as I played with Dim Pro, Kontakt and other piano VSTs.

Here are some samples of different pianos playing excerpts from a nice Ain't Misbehavin' midi I found on the net.


Dimension Pro Factory Instruments Grand Pianos

1V 4th


3v 3m sim


3v 4th rt sim


3v 4th


3v m3 rt


The naming system is confusing as are many names in Dim Pro. They sourced the sounds from many places and didn't seem to rename them according to any in house scheme. The V stands for velocity.
To me all these sound very 'synthy' and won't really fly in a mix of realistic sounding instruments. Since I got dim Pro for 20 bucks, they are pretty good for dirt cheap instruments that are basically toys.


Kontakt Factory Instruments Grand Pianos

Grand Piano


Concert Grand


August Forster


If I understand correctly, NI pulled all the high class pianos out of Kontakt 4. These ran 2 gigs each in samples and replaced them with stripped down versions. These do sound significantly inferior as I have heard both versions.
The stripped Steinway New York is the Concert Grand.
The stripped Bösendorfer Vienna is the Grand Piano.
If anyone has, the first Akoustic Pianos, Kontakt 3 or the current versions of these pianos from NI, please post some samples for comparison.
These sound like neutered pianos. I suspect everyone replaces them almost immediately. This was a huge disappointment for me as they sound pretty bad for the flagship instrument collection of NI. They seem, as had been noted by others, to be trying to emulate Microsoft, a base product that is mediocre but required to run all the products you really want. These pianos define mediocre.


Dimension Pro DSF Expansion 1 Grand Pianos

Dimension Grand Piano


Dark Grand KU


Mellow Grand KU


These Pianos seem to have a problem when too many notes are played simultaneously, so they have limited usefulness. Every other piano including free ones could handle this and other classical pieces fine. This had many audio drops and odd effects through out. Sadly this must go down as an utter waste of 20 bucks. When used in very simple melodies with few notes, it sounds better than the base DP pianos, but not as good a the Kontact ones.


Free VSTs that can plug straight into your DAW

DSK AkoustiK KeyZ Grand Piano

DSK makes fine free vsts, this is not one of the best. It also has two Concert Pianos and you can toy with many settings.

Magix Independence Free Grand Piano

Another nothing great but the price is right. Independence comes with a whole slew of instruments mostly band and percussion. None particularly good, but all free so good for starting out.

Alchemy 2

Another free vst with lots of OK sorts of instruments.

Sonatina Symphonic Orchestra Grand Piano

An SFZ orchestra for free that can be played with Cakewalk's Free SFZ player. While not top flight, hats of to someone for creating an entire free orchestra using public domain samples. This was some serious work.

I would include SampleTank free, but I could never get it to work.

Piano 1 Version 2

The nicest of these Free VSTs. Sounds better than the DP pianos and on par with the basic Kontakt ones.

Soundfont (Remember them) Pianos player with DSK SF2. All free, but veery old.

SGM V2 Piano

This was the piano from a GM soundfont. Bellatrix Orchestra and SGM have tons of instruments for that old soundfont sound.

FluidR3 Piano

Very old school

Equinox Grand Pianos
Steinway D

Yamaha C7

The best of the soundfont pianos, but that is not saying too much.


Free Piano Instruments for Kontakt (must own full Kontakt to use)

Total Composure Orchestra Grand Piano

Like Sonatina TCO is a totally free Orchestra, save for the fact that you need Kontakt to run it. It is newer (2012 for KVR contest) and IMO sounds significantly better likely because of extensive scripting. The piano is decent, but not great.

Amore V2 Grand Piano

Another solid free piano. It has a small footprint and lots of nobs to twiddle with, plus it comes with a rose.

Maestro Concert Grand

Maestro Concert Grand B

If memory serves had to be converted from Giga which Kontakt did flawlessly. This is not only the best sounding free piano IMO but also the best sounding of any piano up to this point. If you have Kontakt and no other pianos get this one. It is a bit of work, but it is an order of magnitude better than your standard Kontakt Factory Pianos.

Finally of course you can buy stuff for Kontakt

SampleTekk
Black Grand Ambient

The Emperor

B290

Old Lady


A good comparison of what a higher end piano sounds like versus Dim Pro and Kontakt factory, I believe.
I don't own but I have heard the pianos from K3 and that are now sold separately, they are of roughly the same quality as the these, though I prefer these. There are of course many excellent pianos out there, Ivory, Imperfect, EW and many more. If any one wants to put up some samples of them please do.

[SODDI]

I think I may end up using Dimension Pro a lot for layers - not the front voice, but beefing up thin sections of front voices.

[Acolyte91]

When I still used primarily cakewalk, the only thing I could remember was always being disappointed with most of the acoustic material, I thought it was horrible, pianos were convincing enough for a place filler but I wouldn't have ever used them or the guitars in a finished track. Its processing is kind of neat, but has a very distinct dim pro sound with the fx and filters, which is alright.

I remember mostly liking some of the pads it came with and was able to process them with some nice results. Overall with its couple of quirks I did like I knew I had to move on to something else eventually for my sampler needs.

[Spiritos]

When I still used primarily cakewalk, the only thing I could remember was always being disappointed with most of the acoustic material, I thought it was horrible, pianos were convincing enough for a place filler but I wouldn't have ever used them or the guitars in a finished track. Its processing is kind of neat, but has a very distinct dim pro sound with the fx and filters, which is alright.

I remember mostly liking some of the pads it came with and was able to process them with some nice results. Overall with its couple of quirks I did like I knew I had to move on to something else eventually for my sampler needs.

I beg to differ on the acoustic instruments where it comes to the 3rd expansion pack which is all about basses. Especially the fretless standing basses are incredible.

[HaganeSteel]

When I still used primarily cakewalk, the only thing I could remember was always being disappointed with most of the acoustic material, I thought it was horrible, pianos were convincing enough for a place filler but I wouldn't have ever used them or the guitars in a finished track. Its processing is kind of neat, but has a very distinct dim pro sound with the fx and filters, which is alright.

I remember mostly liking some of the pads it came with and was able to process them with some nice results. Overall with its couple of quirks I did like I knew I had to move on to something else eventually for my sampler needs.

I beg to differ on the acoustic instruments where it comes to the 3rd expansion pack which is all about basses. Especially the fretless standing basses are incredible.

I kind of agree with you both, really.

Dimension Pro is this strange mix of extreme high quality and extreme low quality. It really depends on what you're using it for.

The stock stuff is completely unusable to me, but it sounds good.

DimPro as a synth does have a very characteristic "sound" to it, though, that I really, really, REALLY like, and I feel it directly follows the tradition of Roland hardware and philosophy, and it's kind of ironic that Cakewalk got absorbed by Roland.

I bought the Virtuoso 2000 and Planet Earth today and I am very impressed with both of them. I love running Emu sounds through Dimension Pro's synth engine. It just sounds so high quality.