Misa Digital is back... (Kitara is dead, long live the Tri-Bass)

[wasi]

http://misa-digital.myshopify.com/

The Kitara is now officially discontinued (my understanding is the old Misa Digital was dissolved) but Michael is back on his own with a bass-style controller-only design. Wood neck but only three 'strings'. Still the old touchscreen but with a rather special layout and a frame now.

http://misa-digital.myshopify.com/products/tri-bass



Not sure what I should make of it yet. Doesn't blow me away quite like the Kitara did, the large touch screen especially seems a somewhat arguable design choice considering how rather limited the current control options are. The Kitara just seemed to make a lot more of it.

Kudos to Michael for the rebound though. I'll be watching.

[RunBeerRun]

Price is still going to isolate it, bassists are going to want strings, so who's to say where the market is on this, but if it's a limited run then it would be successful.

I wonder if it's still got the Pentium3 touchpad w/Linux. He used to have a forum then when people started asking questions he shut it down.

[wasi]

Well, I missed the forums completely, but I can understand that when you're a one man show there's no way you can run manufacturing, distribution, marketing and reply to people who may or may not really be interested in your product. I was surprised that after all the buzz they created, they just disappeared, totally incommunicado, for what, a year now?

Price seems reasonable to me for a non-industrially produced instrument, the shipping cost kind of tips it over the edge from a consumer perspective. But most other comparably manufactured devices cost several times that (Soundplane comes to mind).

My main gripe at this point would be that you can't map anything on the controller, you have to do it all software-side. Going by the website, not even midi channels are assignable (at this point at least), which basically means you have to redesign your setup starting from the controller instead of just plugging it in. With all due respect to keeping it simple, that's bordering on crude. But who knows, the Kitara got some impressive software updates. We'll see.

[tapper mike]

Starr labs pulls out a bass model once in a blue moon then discontinues it for lack of interest. At least the starr labs version has four strings.

I think if I get another controller it will be a z board. 12x24 grid though they can make a 24x24 board as well.

[wasi]

Starr labs pulls out a bass model once in a blue moon then discontinues it for lack of interest. At least the starr labs version has four strings.

I don't think he's aiming for what Starr Labs is aiming for. Starr Labs try to emulate the original instrument but as a MIDI controller. He's just borrowing certain elements to create something new. Besides, starr labs prices are calculated in multiples of what this costs. In the Starr Labs price range I feel an Eigenharp is a far better choice, both technically and as far as potential. Starr Labs are largely stuck in the 90s, both technically and price-wise, IMO. Not that it matters in this context, but a Tau costs about 2.5k and wipes the floor with anything Starr labs has to offer, it's just that there are no strings there to strum so it's more intimidating.

Part of the goal of this Tri-Bass design supposedly is so people don't go "yeah but it's still not a bass", something you read often with the Kitara, even though it wasn't supposed to be a "midi guitar", just a synth in a guitar form factor. I can certainly see how distancing your self a bit more from a bass design can avoid that confusion.

[tapper mike]

Re pricing, No not really The American made starr labs products are indeed American made and custom made to order. It's not like they have an endless supply of preformatted parts waiting to be slapped into a unit or slave labor an robotics. The price reflects the actual costs it takes to produce the products.

Starr labs does produce a moderately priced 6 string 17 fret instrument for $600 plus shipping.
http://www.starrlabs.com/index.php?rout ... duct_id=50

I have one of these (the first one every built) and it's a fine controller once you get adjusted to tapping on the tightly spaced string triggers.

[wasi]

Yeah, the lunchbox with a fretboard. That's what I mean with stuck in the 90s. The tech in there would fit in a watch these days probably, but who would buy their other stuff if the cheapest product was super ergonomic at half an inch thick and already did it all...

I know their product line, and the 15% 'restocking fee' on returns (must be a huge warehouse). And the no returns on 'customized' instruments (which means just about any instrument you order, because they all need some 'upgrade' or other). That whole sales mentality strikes me as a bit off, certainly in that price range. Compare that to Eigenlabs rent before you buy, for example. Try it out, if you buy it you already paid for part of it, if you don't you only lost the shipping (well, and the rental fees, but you got to use the instrument). That projects both a solid service mentality and high confidence in your product.

But anyway, that's all pretty OT. Like I said, my understanding is the Tri-bass is aiming for something quite different from a 'Bass Midi controller'. He's thought about what is required to play synth bass (not midi-bass) and this is his pitch.

I've been thinking about the three 'strings' thing and IMO for most modern synth patches, especially bass, three is probably plenty. It allows for power chords on its own and six note chords with two handed tapping, leaving one finger on each hand for note leading. It's not like you do barré chords on bass.

[tapper mike]

No, I'm sorr'y but you are failing at your own arguments.

First you claim that it shouldn't look like a guitar even though the Kitara clearly has the outline of a guitar. And the babyz doesn't. There are other ztars that are 'less guitar looking if your statement is that it should not "appear" like a guitar. Namely the miniZ and the zboard which is a 12x14 grid desktop instrument. Niether "look" like guitars. If you are interested in something that "looks" like a guitar Z5's and Z6's look like guitars. I'm sure Harvey would build you a nice diamond shaped bass if you paid him enough.

So now that we are past "Looks like a guitar" or doesn't look like a guitar. Lets get into some features like ...zones/layers.
A zone is any rectangle you can draw on a fretboard. Aside from Z55's all ztars have 32 zones. You can layer zones to your hearts content. With a zone you can set midi channel, fret (for strumming/picking) tap (set to either poly with multiple notes per "string" for tight chord clusters not possible on guitars or even keys, or set to guitar for hammer ons and pull offs. You can also assign chords to the "button keys" like pads or assign cc values to name but a short few.

You may have also noticed on the video that there are 9 pots. 8 of which are bi-directional fully assignable with up to 8 events per pot which brings a level of control one cannot attain via a simple xy or even xyz surface can offer. The list of features boggles the mind.

And unlike flash in the pan misa digital which has already gone out of business Starr labs has been making midi devices for well over 20 years.

So go ahead and complain that it's too expensive or too cheap or has too many features or does look like a guitar or doesn't look like a guitar. Or has been in business too long, or understands that synth users like to be able to control synths. or has to wide a harmonic range. Or that it's not limited to Linux based synth sounds.

[polaris20]

The Baby-Z is a pretty friggin' good value now at $600. While I like my Fishman FTP, I still want a Baby-Z, since there's stuff you can do on an electronic-only device you simply can't do on pitch to MIDI, and vice versa.

[wasi]

Are the '6 expression pads' velocity/pressure sensitive, because the neck clearly isn't. It's basically a 'boutique' YouRockGuitar. I just can't get excited about their stuff.

Anybody else have a product they want to talk about?

[polaris20]

Are the '6 expression pads' velocity/pressure sensitive, because the neck clearly isn't. It's basically a 'boutique' YouRockGuitar. I just can't get excited about their stuff.

Anybody else have a product they want to talk about?

On the Baby-Z? The neck is velocity sensitive, as are the expression pads. It couldn't be more different than the toy YRG.

[wasi]

Are the '6 expression pads' velocity/pressure sensitive, because the neck clearly isn't. It's basically a 'boutique' YouRockGuitar. I just can't get excited about their stuff.

Anybody else have a product they want to talk about?

On the Baby-Z? The neck is velocity sensitive, as are the expression pads. It couldn't be more different than the toy YRG.

Are you sure? It only says 'touch sensitive' as opposed to 'velocity sensitive' and 'pressure sensitive' elsewhere. I kind of assumed there was some thought behind the terminology. I know they have any shape and number of upgrades, but are they velocity sensitive by default?

That would mean all they have to do is boil down the size of that Osborne II of a body and that would easily be their sexiest product.

[10Dot4]

Seems pretty interesting. I wonder how much would it cost? I will be getting one in the future

[wasi]

Yeah, it's U$649.-- .

The downer is the $180 shipping to US. Since they're based in Australia it's a safe guess that's the cost to pretty much anywhere but Australia itself.

[10Dot4]

Yeah, it's U$649.-- .

The downer is the $180 shipping to US. Since they're based in Australia it's a safe guess that's the cost to pretty much anywhere but Australia itself.

The Tri-bass MIDI controller is interesting. What I do not like is the price especially the shipping to USA which makes a total of $829 (price+shipping).

I may need to save some money to afford it. But besides that, I like the way you can use the touchscreen. It's awesome