New Bitwig Studio video

[Echoes in the Attic]

I realize I have ultimate dick status when it comes to bitwig, so I'll add to it.

TOTALLY uninspired by that viddy. Everything about it is boring, not to mention I can do it in any host I have (except sonar which sucks)

Yeah, the videos never have an anything too terribly inspiring, however I still love to see them as I always catch parts of the gui I've not seen before. In that one I just noticed a channel strip to the side like Logic etc. Nice touch. Also that' the first time I've seenthe proper FM-4 GUI. Looks great.

I'm very excited for bitwig, but not because there's anything I can't do in other DAWs. I'm excited because it's like a new Ableton Live coded more recently with many smart workflow features (it seems) and certain things plug-in sandboxing, the way macros work, proper delay compensation (compared to Live). I think things like this just might make for a more pleasant experience. I'd also like to use built-in devices more but I've never the loved the sound character of many of live's plug-ins. From what I've heard I think I'll like the built-in bitwig devices.

[hibidy]

It's just that I can do that right now. No waiting, and those sounds are nothing short of generic. I know, I know.

[Echoes in the Attic]

It's just that I can do that right now. No waiting, and those sounds are nothing short of generic. I know, I know.

Yeah I can too. As an Ableton user though, it's a question of dealing with crashes, avoiding latency, enjoying the sound of devices etc. (See previous post regarding enjoyable experience vs. being able to do something).

[xNiMiNx]

So... Java Requirement?

[hibidy]

It's just that I can do that right now. No waiting, and those sounds are nothing short of generic. I know, I know.

Yeah I can too. As an Ableton user though, it's a question of dealing with crashes, avoiding latency, enjoying the sound of devices etc. (See previous post regarding enjoyable experience vs. being able to do something).

That sucks. I'm sitting here playing around in live most of the day, no crashes, no problems. It wasn't that long ago that I was mucking around with hosts trying to find one that would work. I don't know what sonar does great for some and not for others or why live works mostly great for me and shit for others. I just have not clue. It's likely not user error too often though because on this SAME computer I can get various things to go right or wrong depending

[VitaminD]

So... Java Requirement?

Nope. Javascript is what BWS uses for the controller support. Java is completely and entirely different.

The only thing that is the same is they are programming languages with the word 'Java' in them. But they are entirely unrelated.

Javascript is also what Ben and other web developers use to code websites.. so you already deal with that daily

[codec_spurt]

I'm sitting here playing around in live most of the day, no crashes, no problems. It wasn't that long ago that I was mucking around with hosts trying to find one that would work. I don't know what sonar does great for some and not for others or why live works mostly great for me and shit for others. I just have not clue. It's likely not user error too often though because on this SAME computer I can get various things to go right or wrong depending

I think we have undoubtedly reached the stage where the amount of permutations has officialy reached 'clusterf***' stage.

Pretty much all my DAWs work quite well for me, except for the nightmare that is UAC, which we won't even talk about, because none of you use it apparently, because if you did, there would be a whole lot of bitchin' going on.

Basically it is not possible to run a DAW with full UAC without running into somewhat frequent hard to diagnose and debug problems. Patch management is a nightmare. Anyway. Enough of that, I've learned my lesson.

I'm still trying to get Tremor (or Trauma as I call it these days) to work after nearly a year. But on the whole I'm pretty lucky considering the number of plugins I have and the amount of security tweaks to my system. I have a pretty much locked down windows 7 system that has half a dozen DAWs on it that work beautifully for the most part. Then again hibidy, I don't run Sonar...



I really look forward to Bitwig when it hits the scene, especially Linux compatibility. But when it does arrive, there will be bugs. And it will take a year or two to iron out. You can't have multi-platform use like that without running into teething problems in the real world, imho. But that's ok, I'll do what I usually do, let everyone else beta test it for a while and if it cuts the mustard, I'll buy into the dream...


But getting back to reality for a moment. And hibidy's original point. Live 8 and 9 has for me been pretty flawlessly rock solid stable. To give you one example - I started making a track in Live about midnight, I finished the track about 7 or 8 in the morning. That is EIGHT HOURS continuous use without one single crash. Not one. I did not take a single break.

How many DAWs do you know that you could start playing about with and 8 hours later the thing would still be working perfectly? Pretty impressive to me. Live 9 is just a masterpiece of software engineering. It is mature technology now. I know the case against it, or rather the few things that always rear their ugly head, but it is what it is - the culmination of years and years of graft by some very clever bods that think further outside the box than anyone else.

I can see why some that bought into the dream earlier on want more bells and whistles, but really, if the audio decompilation feature is not enough for you, well, there's no helping you. This is revolutionary technology as well as mature technology, and to someone just buying the full ticket today, they should prepare to be amazed.

This isn't hyperbole. This is just my opinion and how I feel about the state of play in the world of DAWs today. You know that I use most of the major ones and I love them all. They each have glaring faults and weaknesses though, as you know, and something has just kept me pushing harder and harder to find something that approaces perfection. Ableton Live is the closest I've got.

But, yeah, I do look forward to Bitwig when it comes out. I'll buy it for sure if it works properly. Summer isn't over yet, and if we see it by the end of the year, then they will have done well. It's a very ambitious project, expectations are high...

Sorry for the serious post, I only visited to see some cat pics and was mildly disappointed to see some of you having an actual discussion for a change.

[hibidy]

No but you are right, I've had live on all day (since about 11am) and other than a short doctors visit, I've been running it and futzing (actually trying to work seriously ) on older projects. Everything loads right up.....runs continuously... I don't get it.

@UAC: First thing I ditch on a windows machine

[aaastronomer]

You just can't say: WHEN!

[liquidsound]

I really look forward to Bitwig when it hits the scene, especially Linux compatibility. But when it does arrive, there will be bugs. And it will take a year or two to iron out.

That could be why is taking so long. Beta testing has is limits though.

[trimph1]

[codec_spurt]

No but you are right, I've had live on all day (since about 11am) and other than a short doctors visit, I've been running it and futzing (actually trying to work seriously ) on older projects. Everything loads right up.....runs continuously... I don't get it.

@UAC: First thing I ditch on a windows machine

Well, it only impacts on some programs, Live it seems to leave alone. FLStudio was unaffected by it until they brought out a new version and changed the layout for patch management. Studio One it plays havoc with.

As per my previous example - Trauma - as I said I have been trying to get it to run for nearly a year now, not a whole year, about 60 hours or so. Yup, I have spent sixty hours of my life this year trying to get Tremor to work. No Luck. I don't know if the FXpansion chaps saw this thread, but they said, oh it must be UAC, well it turns out it wasn't and I can prove that. They have been pretty good about it, and in a way, I almost feel sorry for them having to deal with anomalies like this. Trauma is the only piece of software that I have not been able to get to work after a few days. Still, they are on the case and it is just an academic exercise for me now. I don't even want to use it anymore, but I won't sell it either. They have been very good. FXpansion do have some of the best support in the game.

And this just proves the earlier point you were making hibidy, about some things working on some systems for some people, and not for others. This is just one piece of software (Tremor) that I was talking about. And believe me, it gets a whole lot more weirder than that, but I won't say more at this point.

If it was a DAW that would be a different matter. Lot more at stake, lot more invested. I maxed out my credit card to buy Live in the market place here. I got a good deal, so it was worth it. But it's expensive compared to the odd vst that don't work.

I took a flyer. And yes I'm amazed at how compatible the different versions of Live are. Projects load, and when they do they tend to work all the way through, until they crash at the end when closing. I don't know what jiggery pokery Ableton have done to bring this about. Maybe it's just me. But I have maxed my computer, my plugins, my time - everything. Live is super stable, with ALL plugins I have. And no problems with UAC.

Maybe I'm just lucky. Oh and the Ableton support is excellent. They tend to take a day or so to get back to you, but they answer you with a proper reply, not stalling for time shit. I don't mind waiting a day or so for someone to take me seriously. I stopped using Fruity Loops, because they stalled and were asking me clown questions. Over three days to answer a mail? Really? Presonus do this too. Anyone who takes over three days to 'ACKNOWLEDGE' a support request, loses in my book.

Ableton as well as FXpansion are top notch in my book in this regard.



Ok, more cats...

[xNiMiNx]

So... Java Requirement?

Nope. Javascript is what BWS uses for the controller support. Java is completely and entirely different.

The only thing that is the same is they are programming languages with the word 'Java' in them. But they are entirely unrelated.

Javascript is also what Ben and other web developers use to code websites.. so you already deal with that daily

Thanks for the clarification. I have no desire to load Java Runtime on my audio setup, so nice to see its not something mandatory, to even give a demo a try whenever it comes out.

[crashedthecar]

The ol java, java script confusion makes me nostalgic for when I was confused 20 odd years ago

[robogone]

Interesting to see how often I hear the stability of Live come up as a reason to lose interest in Bitwig. I think if Ableton hadn't worked on that and it was unstable in any way I might have held out for Bitwig. But with no release in sight and Live very solid on Windows 8 for me I really don't have any interest in Bitwig anymore.

Wasn't there a guy from Bitwig who signed up and posted here some time back? I'm amazed that he doesn't take the feedback from here and work with whoever is behind the marketing for Bitwig. If he is still reading this, everything that could be taken away from threads like this is being completely ignored.

I wish them well, but I think they have lost a ton of potential customers because of the way they have approached beta testing, marketing and communications.