u-he Satin or Slate VTM?

[kmonkey]

+2

Yes Tapes - are - imperfect. Period - not a problem with that but if we are in plugin world, why not having this feature as on off/ - it's only a suggestion - at least from my mouth

[kvaca]

Even if you dial back the hiss, wow&flutter and the crosstalk, it is still there to a certain extend (example: noisefloor of usually -60dB RMS down to -80dB RMS, Crosstalk to -90dBFS instead of -70dBFS).

Tapes - are - imperfect. Period.


If you want a technical system, get stuff like Variety of Sound. Then again, nobody cares if a plugin introduces unnecessary crosstalk, or has a noise floor of -80dBFS already - since it's part of the "effect" or a "good modeling" (certain tape machines, certain compressors, certain channel strips, etc).

But suddenly it is an issue with a tape simulation like Satin?

well,for me...digital - is - perfect. Period.

on the other side - Ive used tapes half of my life and liked that slightly surrealistic "sound"...but sametime DISLIKED all these artifacts /like noise,crosstalk etc../, and also all that inconvinience...in fact - tape noise was one of the the main reasons Ive switched to digital...and Im preety sure that theres NO need to add hiss to ANY analog or tape simulation plugin /f.i.look at that Masssey Tape head - no added hiss and still sounds perfect/ and if some people prefer that noise and other artifacts - OK, but lets give other people possibility to remove it COMPLETELY without the need of using additional denoiser plugins /which is crazy idea btw/

[electro]

Really, nobody made an issue out of it as Waves released the REDD console (which is noisy as hell), nobody made an issue out of VCC/NLS, nobody had issues with former tape machines, heck even TAL Dub has a certain consistent noise floor, the Roland Space Echo clones have a noise floor. Modern "emulations" do not only have a sometimes humonous floor but also mostly the unwanted high crosstalk (compressors, EQ, channel strips, preamps, etc). Here - it's totally fine!

But with Satin, it is not. I really, really don't get it!.

Wouldn't you all like to see something like REDD from U-he?

[Urs]

Why so serious?

This is a 1.0 and if it's a big deal for so many people then I'm sure a 1.1 will have an option to remove the hiss completely. In the same vein we also notice the requests for more lofi sounding options.

This - after all - is why we do introduction offers: Because we all know it's not perfect yet, and we want to give back to early adopters. That feedback is important to us.

Cheers,

- Urs

[electro]

Overdriving Satin is doing nice things to Raw Drums!

One request is to make the output gain range the same as on the input Knob. (+/-20db)

[momalle3]

Just want to reiterate I had earlier posted that I that the hiss was too pronounced, but I was mistaken--the hiss I was hearing was on the original track. I hadn't expected it, didn't listen for it, and assumed it was Satin.

I'm finding satin to be just fine and dandy as it is

[Burillo]

i can dial out the hiss completely. unless you're hitting the tape too low (e.g. have a low input volume and gain makeup turned on), it shouldn't be pronounced. same with Reelbus, actually - gain compensation and lowering input levels turns up the hiss even if it's on minimum.

[@l3x!5]

Urs, no big deal here, I think people know you are kindly listening - and since Satin offers so much in tweakability already, plus! given the very high quality of your products… They foresee Satin, with a few additions, as being able to cover everything from realistic to creative, beautiful hi-fi to crappy lo-fi, all of which other contenders don't offer in a single package, at least not in the same league - but that's my personal opinion.

A potential all-rounder indeed! Can't wait to buy mine

[medienhexer]

Right, people, have some fun already!

I put one instance of Satin on the Master bus and... it sounded like the early recordings I made with my dad's Revox. Well, minus the extreme effects due to bad tape and the break belt sticking to the reel.

But I used to copy music from CD to reel to bring out some details of the music for pure listening pleasure. I had hoped for something similar from Roundtone and Kramer Master Tape.. didn't work out so well.. Now with Satin, I can get a very similar effect without the drawbacks of that old (t)rusty Revox. Me happy!

If only I had more processing power...

As to the noise levels... correct me if I'm wrong but to me, it sounds like those of you who experience the loud hiss may be running their tracks / busses very hot. Let's say you have a drum bus, guitar bus, vocal bus - what's your typical track levels and bus levels?

Could you try bringing down everything pretty low so that without anything on the Master bus and without lowering the Master fader, your Master peaks are around -10dB? Try and bring down the tracks first, then busses just for balance.

I may be completely off but that noise floor from Satin should mostly vanish in the summing of your DAW's audio engine, right?

[kvaca]

i can dial out the hiss completely. unless you're hitting the tape too low (e.g. have a low input volume and gain makeup turned on), it shouldn't be pronounced. same with Reelbus, actually - gain compensation and lowering input levels turns up the hiss even if it's on minimum.

no, you cannot /completely/...
you can only lower it, thats all you can do for now

[Burillo]

i can dial out the hiss completely. unless you're hitting the tape too low (e.g. have a low input volume and gain makeup turned on), it shouldn't be pronounced. same with Reelbus, actually - gain compensation and lowering input levels turns up the hiss even if it's on minimum.

no, you cannot /completely/...
you can only lower it, thats all you can do for now

well, "completely" in terms of making it inaudible.

[Ch00rD]

i can dial out the hiss completely. unless you're hitting the tape too low (e.g. have a low input volume and gain makeup turned on), it shouldn't be pronounced. same with Reelbus, actually - gain compensation and lowering input levels turns up the hiss even if it's on minimum.

no, you cannot /completely/...
you can only lower it, thats all you can do for now

Yeah, in Satin you can't get rid of it completely (yet).

But that's not all that you can do for now. As I suggested before, you can of course simply use a noise gate - that's what they were designed for in the first place, not to side-chain hi-hats to create gated trance chords. I've been doing that for ages with noisy analog devices, and a whole bunch of analog device emulation plug-ins that produce more or less authentic noise levels.

[#rob]

you can of course simply use a noise gate - that's what they were designed for in the first place,

Or you could just use the Companders in Satin, because... that's what they're for.

[Ch00rD]

Overdriving Satin is doing nice things to Raw Drums!

One request is to make the output gain range the same as on the input Knob. (+/-20db)

Yeah, their looks do suggest that they have the same range, but then they don't. However, do note that when using Makeup, the effective range of the Output level value is actually as big as its own range PLUS the range of the Input level (i.e.-/+32.00dB).

Another nitpick: the markings on the panel around the Input/Output knobs are very pretty, but make absolutely no sense to me. Why have a 'thick' marking at -/+13.33 / -/+6.67 dB on the input level? Why use 9 'thin' marks between the 'thick' ones? (Was the range perhaps ±21.00 dB in some previous version?)

[Ch00rD]

you can of course simply use a noise gate - that's what they were designed for in the first place,

Or you could just use the Companders in Satin, because... that's what they're for.

Indeed. But that only lowers the noise level, it doesn't completely cut it. So we'd still have the same discussion about noise, only on an even lower level. To get rid of the cumulative noise on a large number of silent tracks, I'd still recommend using noise gates.

Perhaps a noise gate would be an interesting feature to add to Satin? I guess that's more or less what Slate VTM does with it's auto-mute feature, too? Satin is arguably in a better position to 'know' what its signal / noise levels are, so perhaps it could automatically set a gate threshold level just above the noise level, saving us some work.