KVR Audio

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 3:45 pm

Grain Bastard wrote:
xg2 wrote:I'd rather have a free or cheap VST host and three of the Plugsounds packs than Reason, any day. It just proves that marketing and hype are more important than quality...
Is that a new feature in Reason 3? Hijacking threads again because 'you' don't like something - same shit different forum.......

So f**king what, you prefer something else

Nice use of language, Mr.Angry...
Very cogently argued...

Methinks you doth protest too much.

Adding VST support to Reason would not make it 'less stable' - otherwise why aren't all the VST hosts that exist crashing all the time.

Anyway, if you have anything else to get off your chest, Mr.Angry, go on, fill your boots...

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 3:49 pm

Sotiris wrote:Why not release each and every Reason synth/sampler/effect as a separate VST/DX/AU plugin ?
Throw away the sequencer and mixer, and what do we have? Lots of useful machines!

Heretic!
How dare you suggest that Propellerheads resort to common sense and release the synths and samplers (I wouldn't bother with the effects...) as VSTis!
We might be able to use a decent sequencer then! And even use all of our screen space! Ludicrous!

Reason is God! Reason is perfect! I've spent hundreds of pounds on it, so it must be good!

(I see that nobody could point me in the direction of any tracks made with Reason that are better than Hunz's 'Oceans from Rain' or 'Your still here'.
(His spelling.)

I want my sequencer of choice, with my software AND hardware synths PLUS Malstrom,Redrum,RV7000 and maybe the vocoder ....
Why should i pay for the other "machines" which i'll probably never use?

Because enough people have fallen for it...

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 3:49 pm

quincy wrote:
Sotiris wrote:Why not release each and every Reason synth/sampler/effect as a separate VST/DX/AU plugin ?
Throw away the sequencer and mixer, and what do we have? Lots of useful machines!
I want my sequencer of choice, with my software AND hardware synths PLUS Malstrom,Redrum,RV7000 and maybe the vocoder ....
Why should i pay for the other "machines" which i'll probably never use?

But then what you won't have is the modular system which is another of reason's big selling points.

I don't know why people don't get this. You can't have VST's part of the modular system in reason, they won't integrate like the in-built stuff. And likewise, you can't have the modular flexibility with standard VST's outside of reason. The closest you'll get is something like EnergyXT, and it isn't the same.

"Wanker"...

ericj23 · Post by **ericj23** » Mon May 31, 2004 3:55 pm

in the spirit of this playground nonsense

it takes one to know one

wanker !

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 3:59 pm

spaceman wrote:
quincy wrote:
Sotiris wrote:Why not release each and every Reason synth/sampler/effect as a separate VST/DX/AU plugin ?
Throw away the sequencer and mixer, and what do we have? Lots of useful machines!
I want my sequencer of choice, with my software AND hardware synths PLUS Malstrom,Redrum,RV7000 and maybe the vocoder ....
Why should i pay for the other "machines" which i'll probably never use?

But then what you won't have is the modular system which is another of reason's big selling points.

I don't know why people don't get this. You can't have VST's part of the modular system in reason, they won't integrate like the in-built stuff. And likewise, you can't have the modular flexibility with standard VST's outside of reason. The closest you'll get is something like EnergyXT, and it isn't the same.

they only way VSTs can work in Reason is if Propellerheads set up a system where they check the code of potential plugins against a list of high criteria, tested for stability, etc...

Why would that be? Because the Propellerheads are stupider than all the other programmers who've happily (and easily) managed to offer VST support in tens of programs?
Can you say 'cult'?
It's laughable. The idea that VSTs would have to be checked and 'rewritten' for Reason to use them. It's not rocket science. It could EASILY be done. They would then have even bigger market share.

but that will more than likely turn into a rewriting of the whole plug into a new Reason plugin standard (like Muse's Receptor) so that they can be absolutely shure it will run smoothly in Reason.

Yes, "shure" it will.

Why wouldn't a VST run smoothly in Reason, unless it's because the programmers aren't very intelligent (which is obviously not true).

You're making up problems where they don't exist because Reason is like a religion to you. And it's the stupidest name ever, by the way...

This, obviously is a major change in business plan and a very costly change for that matter...

Yes, it cost Arguru all of NOTHING to add VST support to Aodix Pro and all of the other trackers he knocked up in a matter of months. Must be really difficult...

just not economical, not for Propellerheads, nore for the VST developer... and as many people here have mentioned before.. use f**king Rewire

Yes, because you get a FREE COPY of Rewire and Cubase SX with every copy of Reason, don't you...

That stupid comment says it all, and is typical of Reason zealots. "Use f**king Rewire". Genius.

Care to rethink your statement?
Obviously not...

It doesn't mean that, because they make music software they have to support every available standard and add any feature available.

No, just the most COMMON one that has hundreds of synths and effects in its format...

But I guess that's too much to ask...

Still, every year a shedload of newcomers to computer music read the mags., think that Reason looks 'amazing' because they know sod all about soft synths (not their fault, it's the mags' fault), and buy Reason, then tell others how 'amazing' it is, then they buy it, and so on, and so on. It's sickening.

You'll have one big, ugly dog of a software if they did. If you want VST use bloody Cubase or whatever

Why?
You obviously know little about programming.
How difficult is it to add VST support to Renoise? Doesn't it product audio from soft synths? Doesn't it put that audio through soft effects? Hardly different from VSTs, is it?

for f**k's sake.. ram it into your thick skulls for once and for all...

Now we're really getting to the meat....

Reason is not Cubase,etc. just like a sampler is not a granular synth, and a modeled analogue is not a digital bass synth

Yes, Reason is not Cubase. Most of us don't HAVE Cubase. Nor Rewire. Reason is way behind all of the other music applications on the planet that offer VST support, solely because it DOESN'T offer VST support, and Reason zealots have been having to try for so long to make do with Reason's inbuilt synths (not to mention its effects) that they have to hide their heads in their hands when the 'evil' VSTs are mentioned...

Tell me - if I buy Reason, how can I use my three Plugsound plug ins with it, WITHOUT shelling out another £200+ on Rewire and Cubase - and why should I have to open up THREE apps. when any OTHER app. does all of this on its own?

Why you Reason lovers like being restricted in this way, when everybody else has the whole world of VSTs to choose from, is absolutely beyond me. Talk about stubbornness...

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:00 pm

ericj23 wrote:in the spirit of this playground nonsense

it takes one to know one

wanker !

Funny how you didn't say that to the original poster who STARTED it...

But then, I knew this would happen when I QUOTED him. (Notice the speech marks?)

nuffink · Post by **nuffink** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:02 pm

f**k me. If it winds up a c**t like you this much it must be even better than I thought.

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:04 pm

mindless wrote:
xg2 wrote:
Rabid wrote:If they get rid of the toyish look, the cables, and add VSTi support they may be able to finally sell a few copies. Everyone knows that with that hardware rack look and no VSTi support Reason is nothing but a rack of crap.

Robert
Very true...

I can't believe people are still defending its lack of VST support by saying it would make it less 'stable'. I haven't noticed Renoise crashing because of VST support...
It´s not really ´bout VST support, but the idea that you don´t really need VSTs when using reason...don´t like the sequencer? rewire it!

i.e. use another program.
This hardly means that Reason should NOT be upgraded to have VST support, does it?

Or, bounce all tracks as audio and put them in your sequencer of choise and then add whatever fx you want.

In other words, Reason won't do what you want it to, so just use another program instead. Which is exactly what I've been saying all along...

[/quote]

That´s how I do it, I really almost always start a track in Reason and I´m on V 1.01!!
And, the included sound library BLOWS AWAY any included library with any other host...only that is reason (no pun intended...well ok) to by it imo.[/quote]

It doesn't compare to Plugsound. It doesn't compare to many other commercial VSTs out there.

xg2 · Post by **xg2** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:06 pm

nuffink wrote:f**k me. If it winds up a c**t like you this much it must be even better than I thought.

Obviously from the SOS school of manners...

pHz · Post by **pHz** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:10 pm

...

slainte

rob

lucille · Post by **lucille** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:12 pm

Just for the record--rewire is free. Sonar was a
dxi only host that adopted a vsti wrapper with no
stability issues. The "stability" arguement is
nonsense: Logic was always a crap vst host, but it
was always plenty stable without vstis (pc v5.)--
why would vst hosting affect non vst users?
That said--Reason is highly integrated and vsti's
could not work --visually or functionally-- the
same as Reason native synths.

The vst revolution is moving on, it was on thing for
subtractor to stand against pro53--its another to
matchup with albino and imposcar, etc.

Hypertone · Post by **Hypertone** » Mon May 31, 2004 4:51 pm

Just give me Redrum, Dr. Rex, and NNXT vstis.

Who would honestly want to sequence a bunch of vstis in Reason?? Not me, I'd rather have Reason act as a vsti like Fruity or EXT and use it in another host.

Jeremy_NSL · Post by **Jeremy_NSL** » Mon May 31, 2004 5:10 pm

Hypertone wrote:Just give me Redrum, Dr. Rex, and NNXT vstis.

Who would honestly want to sequence a bunch of vstis in Reason?? Not me, I'd rather have Reason act as a vsti like Fruity or EXT and use it in another host.

Yes, 100% agreed. The modular ability is nice, but I would sacrifice it in order to use Reason's devices as vsti. Or I guess the regular modular features would still be there in rewire if needed...

quincy · Post by **quincy** » Mon May 31, 2004 5:18 pm

The funniest thing about all this arguing, is that some of you out there still genuinely believe that Propellerheads will actually implement VST support if you moan about it enough.

They won't

ew · Post by ew » Mon May 31, 2004 5:22 pm

quincy wrote:The funniest thing about all this arguing, is that some of you out there still genuinely believe that Propellerheads will actually implement VST support if you moan about it enough.

They won't

They're also missing the other big point-it's not the tools you use;it's how you use them that matters.
All the plugins in the world aren't going to make crap any better than crap-well,maybe it'll be well produced crap,but...
ew

Reason 3 features!