What is your process for creating a song start to finish?
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- KVRer
- 8 posts since 6 Jul, 2013
Greetings KVR, I want to write my first song soon, I've got everything I need, and am well read on the subject of electronic music production. My question to you the experienced producer is: what is your routine, process, steps, or whatever you want to call it for making a song start to finish, step by step. I'm not asking for specifics just a more general outline. Thanks.
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- KVRAF
- 5223 posts since 20 Jul, 2010
Vaguely, I like to spend a lot of time in pre-production, polishing and colouring samples, deconstructing and reinforcing beats, getting everything mapped out so I can have as many creative options as possible - usually more than I ever use in the actual track.
Most of my song ideas come from kernels of ideas taken from jam sessions where I just flick through my sound library (all synth sounds made from scratch) and play, until I find a phrase, cadence, rhythm or idea that speaks to me and seems to have 'legs'. Then I'll either sample this or transcribe it into the project and look at filling it out.
I rarely start writing the tune at the beginning, I prefer to start with the exposition of the first theme/idea/section, then as I continue horizontally adding to the track I have more material from which to choose parts for the intro and outro, and/or complex/sensitive bridge sections (less often). I tend to compose in a stream of consciousness style so I'm not making Ibiza hits here
Sound design, mixing, creative FX, arrangement are all done together as and when needed, as dictated by the needs of the song and my ongoing perceptions of it. Not the best way to work but it works for me and the kind of music I'm going for. The proirities in my music are to create music that nobody else would, and I believe this method of working encourages that (as well as happy accidents!).
One pitfall with me is starting off with a beat. I used to work like this, but these days, doing so just tends to produce endless beat-edits and fiddling and experiments with that beat. Which is OK for the odd track, but can soon get old.
Most of my song ideas come from kernels of ideas taken from jam sessions where I just flick through my sound library (all synth sounds made from scratch) and play, until I find a phrase, cadence, rhythm or idea that speaks to me and seems to have 'legs'. Then I'll either sample this or transcribe it into the project and look at filling it out.
I rarely start writing the tune at the beginning, I prefer to start with the exposition of the first theme/idea/section, then as I continue horizontally adding to the track I have more material from which to choose parts for the intro and outro, and/or complex/sensitive bridge sections (less often). I tend to compose in a stream of consciousness style so I'm not making Ibiza hits here
Sound design, mixing, creative FX, arrangement are all done together as and when needed, as dictated by the needs of the song and my ongoing perceptions of it. Not the best way to work but it works for me and the kind of music I'm going for. The proirities in my music are to create music that nobody else would, and I believe this method of working encourages that (as well as happy accidents!).
One pitfall with me is starting off with a beat. I used to work like this, but these days, doing so just tends to produce endless beat-edits and fiddling and experiments with that beat. Which is OK for the odd track, but can soon get old.
http://sendy.bandcamp.com/releases < My new album at Bandcamp! Now pay what you like!
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- KVRAF
- 4589 posts since 7 Jun, 2012 from Warsaw
1. Have the concept - it can be pretty blurred, just the idea for style and title of track.
2. Play some melodies with keyboard, choose right key for the job.
3. Build a basic melody, vocal, motiff.
4. Add bassline and simple percussion to make things alive.
5. Add rest of melodies, pads, important FX.
6. Add all the rest - risers, rolls, misc FX, drops, scratches etc. to get focus on the desired flow of track.
7. Render, listen, master, fix, re-render, listen once again, remaster etc... On my previous track is took me 20 iterations before the mixdown was right. Hard work, but now it should be easy.
Honestly, I'm getting back to steps 2-6 over and over just to assure mixing is good. On the other hand, once I have desired plugin / setup chain, everything I throw at it sounds right and way better than standalone synth.
Also, it's important to listen to favourite tracks in the meantime - how they are build in general and how particular FX or sound is created. Also, it's good to do a reality chekc to make sue the tune actually sounds good and is not muddy or messed up.
General tip: If something can't seem to sound right in the mix, discard it and start over. If something sounds suprisingly good, keep it even if it derails your former concept. Listeners don't care about what you had in mind, just the final outcome.
2. Play some melodies with keyboard, choose right key for the job.
3. Build a basic melody, vocal, motiff.
4. Add bassline and simple percussion to make things alive.
5. Add rest of melodies, pads, important FX.
6. Add all the rest - risers, rolls, misc FX, drops, scratches etc. to get focus on the desired flow of track.
7. Render, listen, master, fix, re-render, listen once again, remaster etc... On my previous track is took me 20 iterations before the mixdown was right. Hard work, but now it should be easy.
Honestly, I'm getting back to steps 2-6 over and over just to assure mixing is good. On the other hand, once I have desired plugin / setup chain, everything I throw at it sounds right and way better than standalone synth.
Also, it's important to listen to favourite tracks in the meantime - how they are build in general and how particular FX or sound is created. Also, it's good to do a reality chekc to make sue the tune actually sounds good and is not muddy or messed up.
General tip: If something can't seem to sound right in the mix, discard it and start over. If something sounds suprisingly good, keep it even if it derails your former concept. Listeners don't care about what you had in mind, just the final outcome.
Blog ------------- YouTube channel
Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
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Aroused by JarJar Aroused by JarJar https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=191505
- KVRian
- 1048 posts since 16 Oct, 2008
I lounge about drinking beer until Opus Dei sends this hot lady in tight black leather with a whip.
She's like, "Make a fat kick!" or "More cowbell!"
I just do what she says.
They say that no one expects the Spanish Inquistion, but believe me, they're wrong.
She's like, "Make a fat kick!" or "More cowbell!"
I just do what she says.
They say that no one expects the Spanish Inquistion, but believe me, they're wrong.
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- KVRAF
- 21348 posts since 26 Jul, 2005 from Gone
It depends. Sometimes I'll write lyrics first, sometimes at the same time as writing music, and sometimes as an afterthought almost.
Either way, it usually starts with sitting down with an instrument and just noodling.
Once I have an idea, I will probably start recording something. I tend to start with something on the keyboard and if I need to record with a mic I'll usually leave that until a little later. Vocals usually don't happen early on, except maybe for a guide track which I'll dispose of later.
I'll just keep arranging until it sounds right, then I'll start thinking about mixing. I've usually done some kind of mixing as I go along, but dedicating time to mixing carefully is worthwhile.
Finally, I might add a few frills, like samples or some small amounts of coloring.
Once it's done, I'll master it.
Either way, it usually starts with sitting down with an instrument and just noodling.
Once I have an idea, I will probably start recording something. I tend to start with something on the keyboard and if I need to record with a mic I'll usually leave that until a little later. Vocals usually don't happen early on, except maybe for a guide track which I'll dispose of later.
I'll just keep arranging until it sounds right, then I'll start thinking about mixing. I've usually done some kind of mixing as I go along, but dedicating time to mixing carefully is worthwhile.
Finally, I might add a few frills, like samples or some small amounts of coloring.
Once it's done, I'll master it.
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- KVRist
- 378 posts since 28 Feb, 2013
It changes from song to song. Generally, my initial goal is to get a complete 16- or 32-bar loop down.
Sometimes I play around on the keyboard till I find a melody to build around. Sometimes I'll start with a nice chord progression. Lately I've been starting off with a basic drum pattern and bassline.
Sometimes I'll gather a palette of sounds before I start writing. Other times, I'll do most of the writing with basic saw waves and do sound design (or preset searching) later.
I don't really have any rules about when to begin mixing. Usually, I'll just high-pass stuff until my main loop is complete, and I'll do the rest of the mixing after.
Sometimes I play around on the keyboard till I find a melody to build around. Sometimes I'll start with a nice chord progression. Lately I've been starting off with a basic drum pattern and bassline.
Sometimes I'll gather a palette of sounds before I start writing. Other times, I'll do most of the writing with basic saw waves and do sound design (or preset searching) later.
I don't really have any rules about when to begin mixing. Usually, I'll just high-pass stuff until my main loop is complete, and I'll do the rest of the mixing after.
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- KVRer
- 24 posts since 20 Jul, 2013 from United States
My process isn't the same each time, but it goes roughly like this, at least when I'm making progressive house.
1) I set my tempo, and work on the rhythm intro, usually 32 bars or so, or around 1 minute. I get my drum pattern in with the kick, then clap, then any other percussion (hihat, shaker, blips and boops and toms or whatever). I often have a simple arpeggio and bass line running during the intro, slowly coming in, or abruptly coming in, depending of course on the track.
2) I then work on a break. I find the sound I want to be the foundation. In my last track, it was a piano chord progression, but sometimes its a pad. It could also be a gnarly bassline or melody. whatever you think would sound cool during a break. Its important to decide before hand whether there will be vocals too. If you have vocals, you'll want to leave room for the vocals by not having any lead parts that would compete with vocals. you could have a lead, but you want it to complement the vocals, rather than compete.
Typically I make my sounds and process each of them while I go. for example, when I put my piano in, I EQ'd it and added some compression and reverb to make it sound the way I wanted to. I often go back and tweak these things after I'm done writing my track, but i like getting most of it done while I go.
3) once I sketch out my break, I go back and put in some transition FX from the rhythm to my break, like some sweeps and swooshes. Transitions will make your track really sound well composed and smooth, kind of like when you're writing a paper, and want to make sure every paragraph flows into each other.
4) After I get a solid transition, I move on and add a build up coming out of the break. This is where the beat comes back in, but you may want to tame the beat slightly, so you can save the full power for the drop. I usually do this by putting a high pass filter on the kick, and cutting of at about 100hz, so you still get the punch, but not all of the power from the sub frequencies. for the build i usually have the drums progressively becoming more busy, for example I can do the classic pattern from quarter notes, then 8ths, to 16ths, getting faster kind of thing, but I often do something different that, for the sake of originality. I make sure to a add a long sweep going up to build tension, and maybe a riser synth, like a sound that progressively goes up in pitch. If I want to get fancy, I can automate reverb and a high pass filter on your master output, so as the build progresses, the reverb and high pass filter go up with the build and cause to get airy and thin, so when the drop comes in it really HITS.
5) After you have crafted an epic build, you of course make your drop. I usually add another layer to my kick, to make it sound HUGE. I usually will have big pads, and a gnarly bass line going all side chain compressed to make kick, to get the classic pumping sound. Then I throw whatever else I want on there, and WA LA.
6) After the drop, I make my transition out with some swooshes into the break again, back to the build (which usually is twice as long the 2nd time, but that depends, like everything else), then back into the drop, then back to the rhythm outro.
7) After I have my arranged track, I go back and generally tweak everything I don't like, swapping certain sounds out for other sounds, tweaking effects, and general mixing things, like EQ, compression, so on and so forth. I throw on a master EQ with conservative boosting where i feel necessary, compression, and a limiter. When I'm the tweaking stage I don't move very systematically, I usually make adjustments one at a time where I feel its necessary. This stage usually takes a while.
that in a very general nutshell is how I make my tracks from start to finish. make sure you have fun doing it, and don't be afraid to do something that sounds different. Maybe you just decide to have only one drop, or maybe you decide you want 17 minute break, Its up to you! there are no set rules in the game of music making. just do what you think will make your track epic, and don't take shortcuts. put in the time to make it sound great, and it will be rewarding.
1) I set my tempo, and work on the rhythm intro, usually 32 bars or so, or around 1 minute. I get my drum pattern in with the kick, then clap, then any other percussion (hihat, shaker, blips and boops and toms or whatever). I often have a simple arpeggio and bass line running during the intro, slowly coming in, or abruptly coming in, depending of course on the track.
2) I then work on a break. I find the sound I want to be the foundation. In my last track, it was a piano chord progression, but sometimes its a pad. It could also be a gnarly bassline or melody. whatever you think would sound cool during a break. Its important to decide before hand whether there will be vocals too. If you have vocals, you'll want to leave room for the vocals by not having any lead parts that would compete with vocals. you could have a lead, but you want it to complement the vocals, rather than compete.
Typically I make my sounds and process each of them while I go. for example, when I put my piano in, I EQ'd it and added some compression and reverb to make it sound the way I wanted to. I often go back and tweak these things after I'm done writing my track, but i like getting most of it done while I go.
3) once I sketch out my break, I go back and put in some transition FX from the rhythm to my break, like some sweeps and swooshes. Transitions will make your track really sound well composed and smooth, kind of like when you're writing a paper, and want to make sure every paragraph flows into each other.
4) After I get a solid transition, I move on and add a build up coming out of the break. This is where the beat comes back in, but you may want to tame the beat slightly, so you can save the full power for the drop. I usually do this by putting a high pass filter on the kick, and cutting of at about 100hz, so you still get the punch, but not all of the power from the sub frequencies. for the build i usually have the drums progressively becoming more busy, for example I can do the classic pattern from quarter notes, then 8ths, to 16ths, getting faster kind of thing, but I often do something different that, for the sake of originality. I make sure to a add a long sweep going up to build tension, and maybe a riser synth, like a sound that progressively goes up in pitch. If I want to get fancy, I can automate reverb and a high pass filter on your master output, so as the build progresses, the reverb and high pass filter go up with the build and cause to get airy and thin, so when the drop comes in it really HITS.
5) After you have crafted an epic build, you of course make your drop. I usually add another layer to my kick, to make it sound HUGE. I usually will have big pads, and a gnarly bass line going all side chain compressed to make kick, to get the classic pumping sound. Then I throw whatever else I want on there, and WA LA.
6) After the drop, I make my transition out with some swooshes into the break again, back to the build (which usually is twice as long the 2nd time, but that depends, like everything else), then back into the drop, then back to the rhythm outro.
7) After I have my arranged track, I go back and generally tweak everything I don't like, swapping certain sounds out for other sounds, tweaking effects, and general mixing things, like EQ, compression, so on and so forth. I throw on a master EQ with conservative boosting where i feel necessary, compression, and a limiter. When I'm the tweaking stage I don't move very systematically, I usually make adjustments one at a time where I feel its necessary. This stage usually takes a while.
that in a very general nutshell is how I make my tracks from start to finish. make sure you have fun doing it, and don't be afraid to do something that sounds different. Maybe you just decide to have only one drop, or maybe you decide you want 17 minute break, Its up to you! there are no set rules in the game of music making. just do what you think will make your track epic, and don't take shortcuts. put in the time to make it sound great, and it will be rewarding.
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- KVRian
- 826 posts since 26 Aug, 2005 from Oregon, USA
...a deadline.
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- KVRist
- 44 posts since 13 Oct, 2013 from Brighton
Usually ill get an idea in my head or be inspired, start writing a melody and then i build on that, add drums, do all my fx throughout the creation of the track and then mix down at the end and master once it sounds good. usually can be a long process but it changes for every track.
Once i start building on a solid idea that i defiantly think will be a track, i go for sometimes 7+ hours straight. However, i dont have a clear idea on how i will create a track. its just a creative process that happens as ideas pop up into my head when producing a track.
Once i start building on a solid idea that i defiantly think will be a track, i go for sometimes 7+ hours straight. However, i dont have a clear idea on how i will create a track. its just a creative process that happens as ideas pop up into my head when producing a track.
A bad workman blames his tools
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srv-musikmaker srv-musikmaker https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=294842
- KVRian
- 686 posts since 23 Dec, 2012
Different ways.
1.Creating a decent beat and bassline and try to make other elements
or
2.Already have a melody; add other patterns necessary.
1.Creating a decent beat and bassline and try to make other elements
or
2.Already have a melody; add other patterns necessary.
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- KVRer
- 3 posts since 11 Oct, 2013
Great tips guys! I really enjoyed reading the thread, it gave me some new ideas.
I usually start with melody though, and then add chords/bass, then a beat after that. Then fill it out. Going from that main theme, I add the intro/outro so that I can make sure it connects to the central idea.
Listening to artists you like and examining their form was a great tip.
I usually start with melody though, and then add chords/bass, then a beat after that. Then fill it out. Going from that main theme, I add the intro/outro so that I can make sure it connects to the central idea.
Listening to artists you like and examining their form was a great tip.
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- KVRAF
- 1724 posts since 31 Dec, 2004 from betwixt
Wake up, make breakfast, get warmed up for guitar practice, get practice done, get inspired to make music, but interrupted by the bureau-fascist BS that constitutes modern life without a golden-rod-up-the-arse birthright.
But I still love being alive, and they can't take that.
But I still love being alive, and they can't take that.
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- KVRian
- 535 posts since 25 Nov, 2010
produce, mix & master..:)
trust analog.... (owner of digital)
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- KVRian
- 645 posts since 4 Nov, 2013 from Vancouver, Canada
Wow! Now how do I sign up for this motivation program?Aroused by JarJar wrote:I lounge about drinking beer until Opus Dei sends this hot lady in tight black leather with a whip.
She's like, "Make a fat kick!" or "More cowbell!"
I just do what she says.
They say that no one expects the Spanish Inquistion, but believe me, they're wrong.
