Setting "Midi Control Change" parameters per Song

[Roelli]

Hello.

Iam thinking about buying/using cantabile and I have one question:

I want to use some Native Kontakt Instruments but I need different plugin settings for different Songs.
(I want to use Prominy V-Metal and GuitarRig as insert)

Can I send initial midi control changes to the plugin when changing a Song?

Thanks!

Roelli.

[pinkcanaru]

Yes!
Each Subsession can load a unique set of parameters for each plugin.

Each Session can host a vast list of Subsessions.
You can decide which plugins are active and what the mix/aux send/plugin settings are for each subsession in that, potentially, vast list.

There are also midi triggers which execute control and/or patch changes to criteria which you set. These could occur when a Session loads/unloads, when a subsession loads/unloads, when the Cantbile transport is played, stopped, paused or resumed or when a controller that you determine is received.

My preferred method is to have all the plugins I require for a live set loaded.
You then enable or disable what you need on each Subsession. This is the fastest way to move between songs.

[pinkcanaru]

One other concept is that you can run a midi file(s) in Cantabile to send a stream of control data which you can nominate any hardware controller to start.
Potentially very powerful, especially as you could program control changes to happen at specific points in a song without even having to tread on a switch.
So, several ways to achieve changes in your rig.

[Roelli]

Thanks for your replies.

I got it working. Subsessions and ControlChanges are working GREAT!

Thanks!!

[Roelli]

Is there a bug?

When I change from song 3 to song 4 in a setlist everything is good.
But if I want to change from song 4 to song 3 there is a popup windows asking my if I want to save changes!?



I can say YES and save the changes (although I did not made any changes) but this doesn't help.

HELP!

[Roelli]

oh... seems like the links aren't visible:
"AUTO-ADMIN: Non-MP3, WAV, OGG, SoundCloud and YouTube links have been disabled
in this post automatically. Once the member reaches 5 posts the links will become clickable."

[Roelli]

posting no 5

[Roelli]

ok - the youtube link is visible now

[pinkcanaru]

You need to set the preferences so that the prompt to save is off.
When you are using the Setlist feature, you can call completely different Sessions. As with any document that you edit, cantabile offers to save changes before it discards the current Session and loads the next one.
That's obviously not what you want if you're running a live set - but you MAY want that while you're setting up your setlist. The options are available to you to set prompts of not.
The other thing you should be very aware of is that, when moving through your subsesion list, cantabile can auto update any changes or not. This is purely a RAM save and not to the disk file. This function is misleadingly called auto save when it should be called auto update. It's a very helpful function when you're setting up but something to be disabled once you've locked in your sounds.

Something else to familiarize yourself with is that each plugin can be set to recall its entire bank. This is great for some plugins but can obviously cause slow downs if you're loading massive sample banks.
You soon get to learn which plugins are best suited for this function.

[pinkcanaru]

Check these out.
Once you've seen how enabling 'entire bank' operates on a plug in, you may well find that you only need to work with one master Session. That provides the fastest possible change between setups.

This shows the autosave mode. Very useful when setting subsessions up but should be turned OFF once you have locked down your sounds.



Familiarise yourself with these settings.


When using different Sessions in a setlist, these settings will determine how you are prompted. This is probably where your current issue is.


Each plug and each rack has a set of parameters which are crucial to getting the desired recall of a subsession.

[Roelli]

Hi again.

I think I tried everything, but it doesn't work.
Well... it does work in general. I can make two subsessions and switch between two different sound-settings (presets) in the plugin (guitar rig).

but:
when I close cantabile and reload the last session again THEN it doesn't work anymore.

Here is a video:



Using "Entire Bank" doesn't help. With this setting it is generally impossible to switch between presets.


Any ideas?

Frank.

[pinkcanaru]

OK - I saw the videos. The first one shows that you have two subsessions which switch the GR preset. You save and then reload. You then have to manually tweak the preset changes to kick it back into action.
That is weird.
Quick question - do you have autosave switched on for the subsessions?
I'm going to be away from my studio computer for the next few days - I have Kontakt and GR installed on that and will try to repro your setup.
In the meantime, I'd suggest seeing if other plugins suffer the same fate on your Rig. Maybe download Scuffham S-Gear which has a two week trial. I use that without issue on my live rig. At least we can pin down where the failure in your rig is happening.

Just for the avoidance of doubt - I have just test with Omnisphere (proprietary browser with no conventional patch changes available) and S-Gear (proprietary browser but with a conventional VST program bank available)
Omnisphere loads Entire Bank perfectly, which is my general experience with all the plugins I use in Cantabile. Omnisphere is not capable of using the program bank.
S-Gear's Program bank allows the user to slot whichever preest is required into its
50 capacity VST bank. It's own browser is far more extensive but can't be used that way. The preset bank works perfectly.

I'll need to test with your plugins to see what's happening in your situation.

Best

[Roelli]

Hi.

I tried any possible configuration with "entire bank" and "auto save" - but it doesn't work at all.

Here is a video:


But... I could a trigger to send a program-change.
This can make it a lot more complicated if I need to use program changes instead of just click on the right sounds.

Here is another question:
How do I have to deal with user-presets? If Iam using only one notebook... no problem. But what if I need to transfer all sounds to another computer?

Thanks!

Frank.

[pinkcanaru]

Hi, i've tested with Kontakt and guitar rig. They both load entire bank perfectly. Kontakt shows the change in the cantabile program field and the plug in itself swaps out the required settings.
Guitar Rig, on the other hand, does not change the cantabile program field - but the plugin itself changes its settings correctly.
This may be something to do with the fact that proprietary browsers may only show the name of the first program in their banks.
I tested this having saved and reloaded. So, at least you know it should be working and there must be some setting at your end which is not quite correct.

[Roelli]

So, at least you know it should be working and there must be some setting at your end which is not quite correct.

Hmm. Okay. Good to know that it works in general.
But iam not sure how to fix this on my computer or find the problem myselfs, without knowing what's wrong.
In the meantime I installed Cantabile, GuitarRig and Kontakt on a notebook and I got the SAME problem again.

Not sure what I can do now!?

Thanks!

Roelli.