New Roland "DANCE" hardware- AIRA TR-8, TB-3, VT-3, SYSTEM-1

[VitaminD]

I find it interesting that Roland designed a bunch of hardware for purposes at which they largely failed and people loved them (hardware).

I've heard how flawed the 808 303 etc were designed.. but now they are some of the aural cornerstones of a multibillion dollar industry. 'Legendary' some even call them. Crappy backing percussion units and a crappy backing bassline unit.. when you add overdrive or compression and push them to the front, they instantly become thousand dollar products that are recreated, sampled, and copied over and over.

No wonder Roland are confused!

They are trying to purposely give us what they think we want.. What they need to do is give us what we don't want.. it will, in turn actually be what we want.. or something..

[ChiTown24]

another reason I was hoping for a genuine analogue drum-machine from Roland, if not an outright re-issue, was in the hope that it would help the prices of the classic 808 take a dip.

lol you know it wouldn't go down like that. People would say it doesn't sound right and the prices would go up

also the 1/1 (aside from size) recreation of the korg ms20 had absolutely no effect on the price of the originals

that is totally incorrect.

I've been following ms20 ebay auctions religiously for about 3 yrs, and casually before that.
While you'll still get people listing with Buy-It-Now prices that matched the months and even years before ms20 mini, a lot of them don't sell at that price. Buy-it-Now prices that actually sell have come down to about 1,200... compared to the average of about 1,500+ pre ms20mini. where you notice the most significant drop however is in the auctions. the last one went for just over 800 euro. there's also more auctions, presumably because the buy-it-nows aren't selling as reliably/quickly as they once did.

so ya. the re-issues do effect value for the better {depending on your pov}

I also expect it to take even more of a dip {though I don't see it getting too much cheaper than about 735, if you're patient} when the ms20mini is more prevalent... it's on back-order in lots of stores still.

[vurt]

ok, ill add the within the uk the prices havent changed.
odd fluctuations, but not enough that id say they have gone down because of the reissue, theres always been those fluctuations in price.

[ChiTown24]

Like I said, I've been watching for 3 yrs, plus it's most obvious in the auctions. Time after time they're selling for the high 700s or 800s in auctions. This is the going rate right now. No fluctuation, it's steady and it hasn't steadily dipped like this before the re-issue. I guess it's like the climate change debate - I argue it's the re-issue that's causing this, you think it's just happening all on it's own. And so the world keeps turning

[dcfac73]

Just on the whole Analogue Vs Sftware (VA) debate...how many of you could actually tell if a real 808 was used in a commercial recording or not? Maybe the difference could be heard with a genuine machine and VA or samples side by side, but , at least for me, I couldn't tell the difference...nor do I care. The sound of VA/Sampled 808s is fine for me. If Roland can bring out an 808 with similar sounds, and the ability to sequence and synthesise sounds in meaningful and creative ways..then I'll be saving my bikkies.

[dcfac73]

I find it interesting that Roland designed a bunch of hardware for purposes at which they largely failed and people loved them (hardware).

I've heard how flawed the 808 303 etc were designed.. but now they are some of the aural cornerstones of a multibillion dollar industry. 'Legendary' some even call them. Crappy backing percussion units and a crappy backing bassline unit.. when you add overdrive or compression and push them to the front, they instantly become thousand dollar products that are recreated, sampled, and copied over and over.

No wonder Roland are confused!

They are trying to purposely give us what they think we want.. What they need to do is give us what we don't want.. it will, in turn actually be what we want.. or something..

I actually Do want this. I love the 808. I can't get enough of it. I kinda collect 808 sounds, samples, vsts. The only thing I don't have is a real one
If Roland can bring something out which approximates the sound ( al la Arturia) then I'm all for it. The box looks sexy as too. Drool factor. Porn for gear whores.

[stimresp]

The hardware looks nice and solid, but it would need to go well beyond 808/909 sound to interest me. I think it would be a waste to develop a VA machine - no matter how sexy - that only tries to sound like an 808. Surely they will have editing software and a decent synthesis engine. I fear this could involve an ipad and the 'supernatural' thingy which doesn't sound convincing to my ears.

Props to Roland for having a go though. The devil's in the detail (price vs flexibility and sound). It will have to offer something different to get my attention.

I'm now going to go bug Yamaha for an FM drumsynth. Now THAT would float my boat.

[dcfac73]

The hardware looks nice and solid, but it would need to go well beyond 808/909 sound to interest me. I think it would be a waste to develop a VA machine - no matter how sexy - that only tries to sound like an 808. Surely they will have editing software and a decent synthesis engine. I fear this could involve an ipad and the 'supernatural' thingy which doesn't sound convincing to my ears.

Props to Roland for having a go though. The devil's in the detail (price vs flexibility and sound). It will have to offer something different to get my attention.

I'm now going to go bug Yamaha for an FM drumsynth. Now THAT would float my boat.

I concur. This is where I feel Arturia haven't gone far enough. They've tried too hard to emulate. The Origin Synth seems like a great idea though. All their software products seem quite boring. Even Spark is just like a drum module rather than a synth.

[foosnark]

Just on the whole Analogue Vs Sftware (VA) debate...how many of you could actually tell if a real 808 was used in a commercial recording or not?

I agree. It's really just fetishism.

I can't even tell you how many 808 samples I have, of varying character and quality, and of course a dozen different plugins that emulate it decently as well. I don't see what a ZOMG REAL ANALOG!!!! remake of an 808 would bring to the table.

[Mutant]

Few instances of Synth1 (every instance making the different part of the drum hit) into any good parametric EQ into any good tube saturation = way more electronic (or even real sounding) drum creation possibilities than any single 808 can give you.
Really.
That combo can easily do what 808 can do while 808 can not do some of what the combo can do.

BTW Originally no one wanted to buy any 303 and 808, later they got so popular not because they sound good but because whole new music genres came to existence and as soon as it happened every home musician wanted to copy the sound easily... and now these old originals costs an arm and a leg because only small quantities were produced.

[chk071]

Just on the whole Analogue Vs Sftware (VA) debate...how many of you could actually tell if a real 808 was used in a commercial recording or not?

It is still being used? Don't think i heard it in a commercial production in the last 10 years. I'm sure they will have implemented loads of stuff which will make it more than justa 808 emulation.

[breakmixer]

Few instances of Synth1 (every instance making the different part of the drum hit) into any good parametric EQ into any good tube saturation = way more electronic (or even real sounding) drum creation possibilities than any single 808 can give you.
Really.
That combo can easily do what 808 can do while 808 can not do some of what the combo can do.

BTW Originally no one wanted to buy any 303 and 808, later they got so popular not because they sound good but because whole new music genres came to existence and as soon as it happened every home musician wanted to copy the sound easily... and now these old originals costs an arm and a leg because only small quantities were produced.

I do not agree with your 'not because the sound good' comment, why as a lad was I drawn to Cybotron - Clear, Tyrone Brunson - the Smurf, Man Parrish - Hip Hop Be Bop, Afrika Bambaataa - Planet Rock/Looking For The Perfect Beat, Freeez - IOU etc, what did all those tracks that got me into electronic music have in common? Analogue Synths over a funky 808, to this day the 808 is my favourite drum sound, However I would not pay £2,000 for one, that's why reissues/clones interest me, twiddling knobs with a mouse on a screen kinda bores me now - I have the D16 clones etc, horses for courses I suppose, I want what I want and you want what you want.

[damoog]

303,909,808....303,909'808...303,909'808...303,909,808...you get the idea

Roland gave birth to dance music drum sounds and acid house for sure,they are timeless boxes that we all respect and love the sound of but an emulation of these boxes(again-mc303) in hardware form would be stupid

I would be totally up for a modern real analog emulation of all of the xox's but roland can't see the light of day on this ?...financially it would be huge?

One thing I would like to see in this new box is something NEW that could form some new music form like the original boxes did all those years ago,although highly doubtful that would be great to see

[breakmixer]

303,909,808....303,909'808...303,909'808...303,909,808...you get the idea

Roland gave birth to dance music drum sounds and acid house for sure,they are timeless boxes that we all respect and love the sound of but an emulation of these boxes(again-mc303) in hardware form would be stupid

I would be totally up for a modern real analog emulation of all of the xox's but roland can't see the light of day on this ?...financially it would be huge?

One thing I would like to see in this new box is something NEW that could form some new music form like the original boxes did all those years ago,although highly doubtful that would be great to see

I would be happy with a one for one emulation that was possible to achieve the original timbres but also if it went beyond and done new sounds that would be cool too, It's all leaning towards VA in all the comments/leaked info, but that doesn't concern me, what concerns me is the sound, I want to hear the thing before I make any judgements on it though.

[damoog]

Just on the whole Analogue Vs Sftware (VA) debate...how many of you could actually tell if a real 808 was used in a commercial recording or not? Maybe the difference could be heard with a genuine machine and VA or samples side by side, but , at least for me, I couldn't tell the difference...nor do I care. The sound of VA/Sampled 808s is fine for me. If Roland can bring out an 808 with similar sounds, and the ability to sequence and synthesise sounds in meaningful and creative ways..then I'll be saving my bikkies.

Yeah,good point to be fair.

I love analog,I own 3 real analog synths but if you asked my if liam howletts bass sounds on 'invaders must die' are all analog then I wouldn't be able to tell a plug from real analog on record,I also don't really care as long as it sounds good

,you stil can't beat the hand on of analog though