KVR Audio

Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 9:27 am

trusampler wrote:Where can I find the soundtrack/audio demo?

bosone · Post by **bosone** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:25 am

IMHO IK multimedia should offer a (payed) player only, without the sounds, with the possibility to just use the old ST2 sound/expansions.
I feel that they will not give away a free player with this capability because they know that in this way a lot of old ST2 users will just downoad the new player, use the old sounds and maybe never upgrade.

i I am interesting in upgrading my old st2 because (as is) the interface is almost unusable and I could not be really interested in the new sounds.
So I will happily give IK money to be able to use the sound i bought for ST2 with a new, usable, interface... but I would also not like to pay for 30GB of new, unnecessary, sounds.

i think that IK has very wide ST2 user base (with all the group buy of the past...) that will be glad to be able to just use the old sounds in a new interface. what do you think?

Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:50 am

bosone wrote:I feel that they will not give away a free player with this capability because they know that in this way a lot of old ST2 users will just downoad the new player, use the old sounds and maybe never upgrade.

IMO, there's something IK rates higher than customers' satisfaction: customers' money.
With the refusal to update ST2.5 to 64-bit and the endless delay for ST3, a free player and a cheap (99€) upgrade path to ST3 full is the least they could do.

I fear that many musicians have moved on and are now happy with the likes of Kontakt / Halion 5 or (Sonic 2) / MachFive which are in a similar price range but have a lot more to offer.

gamecat666 · Post by **gamecat666** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:03 am

bosone wrote:IMHO IK multimedia should offer a (payed) player only, without the sounds, with the possibility to just use the old ST2 sound/expansions.
I feel that they will not give away a free player with this capability because they know that in this way a lot of old ST2 users will just downoad the new player, use the old sounds and maybe never upgrade.

i think that IK has very wide ST2 user base (with all the group buy of the past...) that will be glad to be able to just use the old sounds in a new interface. what do you think?

yep, im not at all interested in the new fluff.
I just want a working player for the things I bought, and are still on sale.

if it turns out I have to pay for what amounts to an essential bugfix (windows security issues) then it isnt going to happen.

basslinemaster · Post by **basslinemaster** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:35 am

Karten wrote:IMO, there's something IK rates higher than customers' satisfaction: customers' money.

LOL. I went on the IK forum and asked why you have to pay something like 7 euros to 'unlock' Sampletank expansions which you'd bought in the past (only two or three years ago), when they only cost 15 euros in the first place - and my post was just deleted! I have about ten expansions which I paid good money for, but because of 'bandwidth' costs (utter nonsense) they claim they have to charge you another 70 euros to redownload them! (I've got them all backed up anyway, so it doesn't matter to me, but the policy is plain and simply trying to screw more money out of customers.)

They think they are going to make more money by making their customers dislike them, it's not going to happen. I know how much it costs to rent a server for a month, I know how much it costs to provide 'bandwidth' so that previous customers can redownload libraries they've already paid for - it's a miniscule amount. 99.9% of your customers are NOT going to be redownloading their libraries in any given month, so it's just a nasty attempt to screw more money out of people - but it has the reverse effect - I will never buy another IK product again. It's amazing that these people think they can just keep doing what their customers can't stand, and somehow make more money that way - they won't.

ST3 doesn't interest nor impress me in the slightest - it doesn't seem to do anything ST2 doesn't! Looking at the video, I didn't see an arpeggiator, no new synth capabilities at all (but if I missed them, please let me know).

And as for charging ST2 owners for the upgrade - I agree with bosone - I just want a 64 bit engine, don't need their new sounds, I've got tens of gigabytes of old ST2 sounds which I still want to use.

basslinemaster · Post by **basslinemaster** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:39 am

gamecat666 wrote: yep, im not at all interested in the new fluff.
I just want a working player for the things I bought, and are still on sale.

if it turns out I have to pay for what amounts to an essential bugfix (windows security issues) then it isnt going to happen.

Same here, I'm not paying them for what is a bugfix for windows security issues. They don't seem to understand the simple concept of 'customer loyalty' - give your customers a free upgrade to the ST3 engine (not the new sounds), and then give them the ability to buy whichever of the new sounds they want, at a discounted price.

These companies act as if there is a fixed number of customers who will never be replaced - i.e. as if everybody who has bought an IK product in the past is IT - the entire customer base, and nobody new will ever buy an IK product. That is how they are acting. They are price gouging and trying to get their existing customers to pay AGAIN for a product, rather than understanding that every year millions of people start using their computers to make music with, and are potential customers, just as hundreds of thousands of people stop using their computers to make music (probably) every year, due to lack of interest, family and work commitments leading to no time, lack of money, etc. The market is constantly being renewed by new customers, but it's all lost on IK.

Burillo · Post by **Burillo** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:41 am

are these download fees a new thing? i mean, it might have had sense back in 2003 when bandwidth was more expensive than a barrel of oil, but it certainly doesn't make any sense now, given the size of IK as a company (it might have been understandable if IK was a one-man show). even FXpansion (which i believe are an orders of magnitude smaller company) don't charge for downloads - you can download gigabytes and gigabytes of BFD stuff literally every day, they'll never say a word. when were these download fees introduced?

murnau · Post by **murnau** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 12:50 pm

hey! stop ranting! i fully understand the decision not to give out a free player (without any lib etc.) good IK!!!

i mean i fully understand after listening to this mediocre ST3 track. who need such average boring sounds?

Selfik · Post by **Selfik** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 1:38 pm

How about (loyal customers only)...Upgrade to ST3 NOW and get a FREE iRing

This will sell like crazy!

Just noticed that Arturia is gifting a free Spark 2 update...what a nice gesture

IKM could do the same with a free ST3 player...but no...what a bad marketing strategy...

basslinemaster · Post by **basslinemaster** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 3:15 pm

Burillo wrote:are these download fees a new thing? i mean, it might have had sense back in 2003 when bandwidth was more expensive than a barrel of oil, but it certainly doesn't make any sense now, given the size of IK as a company (it might have been understandable if IK was a one-man show). even FXpansion (which i believe are an orders of magnitude smaller company) don't charge for downloads - you can download gigabytes and gigabytes of BFD stuff literally every day, they'll never say a word. when were these download fees introduced?

I don't know when they were introduced, they are called "Download Reactivation Credits"... They cost 7.99 euros. The shop doesn't make it clear whether you need one per item that you want to re-download - I suspect you do, which means it's an outrageous ripoff. I have nine expansions. ST 2.5 and Sonik Synth, that's 11 x 7.99 euros just to download stuff I already own, and it's only 30GB or something like that.

So obviously I will never buy anything from them ever again, because clearly they are charging for a service that almost all other companies offer for free. And you can't even ask a simple question on their forum (I just wanted to know if one Reactivation Credit was needed for each expansion you wanted to re-download) without them deleting it!

paterpeter · Post by **paterpeter** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:33 pm

basslinemaster wrote: I don't know when they were introduced, they are called "Download Reactivation Credits"... They cost 7.99 euros.

Plus VAT for European customers

In this day and age, it's a ridiculous amount of money to ask for a download of maybe a gigabyte or two.

cain · Post by **cain** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:50 pm

the funny thing even thought with all the negitive remarks( mine included) in this and many other threads over the last couple of years they will still end up selling st3 and people will buy or upgrade.

if it were not true we would not be having all this bashing years later right before its release

D-Fusion · Post by **D-Fusion** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 7:12 pm

basslinemaster wrote:
Burillo wrote:are these download fees a new thing? i mean, it might have had sense back in 2003 when bandwidth was more expensive than a barrel of oil, but it certainly doesn't make any sense now, given the size of IK as a company (it might have been understandable if IK was a one-man show). even FXpansion (which i believe are an orders of magnitude smaller company) don't charge for downloads - you can download gigabytes and gigabytes of BFD stuff literally every day, they'll never say a word. when were these download fees introduced?
I don't know when they were introduced, they are called "Download Reactivation Credits"... They cost 7.99 euros. The shop doesn't make it clear whether you need one per item that you want to re-download - I suspect you do, which means it's an outrageous ripoff. I have nine expansions. ST 2.5 and Sonik Synth, that's 11 x 7.99 euros just to download stuff I already own, and it's only 30GB or something like that.

So obviously I will never buy anything from them ever again, because clearly they are charging for a service that almost all other companies offer for free. And you can't even ask a simple question on their forum (I just wanted to know if one Reactivation Credit was needed for each expansion you wanted to re-download) without them deleting it!

The reactivation is for each download :/
I had to download a few when my system broke down and i still haven't got all of my expansion and never will. I got angry and frustrated since i thought that it was one fee for all.

gamecat666 · Post by **gamecat666** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:33 pm

surely someone on here could help you out there.

danbroad · Post by **danbroad** » Sat Jan 25, 2014 8:36 pm

Good luck to IK, but I've moved on.

Countdown to Sample Tank 3, with 64 bit support