Cubase SXXL ?

[Phaedo]

Actually, it's worse than just a lack of financial clout. The truth is, the products aren't as good. Cubase SX is a top-flight sequencer, but like-for-like, Logic beats it on synths and effects all the way. Even if Steinberg offered a bundle comparable to Logic Pro, it would only suffer by comparison.

Now, if they'd bought Sonitus, the market might look different. Still, there's always Blue Tubes and Voxengo...

[ericj23]

logics synths/fx are better

but delay compenation - 5.1 mixing and routing - midi fx - friad they are worse - and there are more

all the major sequencers have their benefits - which one works for you depends on what you want to do

personally im glad i left logic behind and i dont think a few fx will change that opinion

[Phaedo]

Agreed. That's why I use Cubase. I'd still like Logic's secondary stuff, though.

[christianmusicmaker]

I really think emagic have the upperhand at the minute, not only because of their attractive Logic Pro package but now they are Mac only they only have two products to maintain (express and pro). Hence we get quick and regular updates for everything.

Steinberg may streamline their offerings as well, as it stands now for Mac users, pound for pound there is no contest with Logic Pro.Steinberg don't appear that bothered yet

I don't care much about any of those things in the bundle. I do like Monologue, though, so I can appreciate Steinberg for giving us existing SX2 users that.

I have heard that it's not bad but I am sure most users will trade a synth for thier most pressing bug fix.

Actually, it's worse than just a lack of financial clout. The truth is, the products aren't as good. Cubase SX is a top-flight sequencer, but like-for-like, Logic beats it on synths and effects all the way. Even if Steinberg offered a bundle comparable to Logic Pro, it would only suffer by comparison.

Good point and that could be the reason why Steinberg on the Mac have yet to really answer the Logic Pro package...because they can't.

logics synths/fx are better

but delay compenation - 5.1 mixing and routing - midi fx - friad they are worse - and there are more

all the major sequencers have their benefits - which one works for you depends on what you want to do

personally im glad i left logic behind and i dont think a few fx will change that opinion

So what do you use...?

[machinesworking]

The saddest part of the bundle to me is that right now you can pick up the Waldorf Edition for 79$, and at one point it was 49$.
As far as midi FX in Logic, nothing comes close, but you have to delve into the environment.

Funny part about all this competition for my money is that I've yet to buy the Logic Pro upgrade, I bought the Waldorf edition, and Native Instruments Komplete 2 instead. I'll buy it eventually, but in the meantime I could easily end up getting the next competitor to Pro.

[stale bread]

I know I might get kicked for this but isn't this more like a response to all of the hooplah over Live 4 maybe?

[christianmusicmaker]

Funny part about all this competition for my money is that I've yet to buy the Logic Pro upgrade, I bought the Waldorf edition, and Native Instruments Komplete 2 instead. I'll buy it eventually, but in the meantime I could easily end up getting the next competitor to Pro.

You may even be better off waiting at least for Summer NAMM (I think ) and see what is announced then. I hear Acid 5 will make an appearance so my guess is, there just might be some mention of Logic 7..maybe just maybe.

[christianmusicmaker]

I know I might get kicked for this but isn't this more like a response to all of the hooplah over Live 4 maybe?

I never really saw it that way but you may have a point. The timing is interesting, but I think most people have made their minds up about Live 4 already.Unless Steinberg suddenly develops a patch that provide's the speed of workflow available in Live 4...neither Cubase SX2 or even the new Cubase SXXL will have any impact on Live 4.

Either they have really lost their way (Steinberg) or the just do not see any other sequencer as a threat.

You are right though, the timing suggests Steinberg are getting a bit concerned. Wait till Tracktion 2 comes out!

[gmstudio]

Man, the Cubase.net forums are ALWAYS 'down for maintenance' during these product announcement times.

[Phaedo]

Okay, all of this has a big "IMHO".

Of the big three, Cubase probably has the best sequencer as sequencer right now. Logic hasn't had a major upgrade since v5 and one of Sonar's big improvements in 3 was to stop ripping sounds when you moved notes.

Feature for feature, Sonar's probably winning. For sound quality (in terms of the bundle), Logic's probably still got the edge, and it's easily the best value for money. Problem is, Logic is due an upgrade. If it's as serious as Logic 5, Steinberg should be very afraid.

[christianmusicmaker]

Here is a a link to the SXXL package finally...http://www.arbitermt.co.uk/index_steinberg.htm

Also Computer music magazine now have a short write up and picture on page 9 of issue 75. Told you it was no hoax!

Even Computer Music magazine did not think it was quite as good as the Logic Pro package.

[christianmusicmaker]

Feature for feature, Sonar's probably winning. For sound quality (in terms of the bundle), Logic's probably still got the edge, and it's easily the best value for money. Problem is, Logic is due an upgrade. If it's as serious as Logic 5, Steinberg should be very afraid.

I certainly think that Logic 7 may well be the best Sequencer on the market by a long way when it comes out.It has to be to better than the excellent Logic Pro.

It will probably have a garage band front end (ease of use ) with new synths, PDC and some new heavyweight and revised effects.

I don't think SX3 will have anything major in it as SXXL has shown that Steinberg are prepared to compete with Logic only to a certain degree.

Maybe Steinberg have accepted that they cannot really take on Logic head on and will simply now settle for a place somewhere below the features and value for money that Logic Pro now gives.

Lets face it to compete, Steinberg will have to combine almost all of their product line in one package (d'cota, plex e.t.c + SXXL)...SXXL has shown that is highly unlikely.Steinberg do not appear to be able to afford it.

I would not be surprised if Steinberg pulled out of the Mac altogether especially after Logic 7. I think SX3 has to be something really special indeed to halt the advance of programmes like Tracktion, EXT and especially Live 4.

[ericj23]

I am a logic PC user who ditched it for cubase

"As far as midi FX in Logic, nothing comes close, but you have to delve into the environment. "

having tried both you are sadly mistaken - OK you can do much of the cubase stuff in the environment if youve got the time to waste - but even then the arpeggaitor is a joke - but with cubase its click and choose your options - same with sonar - logic needs mfx plugs cos there are some great things out there

only one instrument to be used at once when not in play mode - very annoying - yes there is a work round - but why does it need one ?

pdc - traktion at $80 has this - logic does not - my powercore does not miss logic

feature for feature (except fx) as it stands logic is the least powerful package of the big 3 - and i have tried them all. now i liked the layout of logic and many aspects of how it worked appealed to me but you learn how to use other packages - and i get on fine with cubase

the trick is to find the one that has the features you need - logic needs a very large upgrade before it has those - i do hope it gets it tho cos i would consider going back (macs are almost well priced these days - still dual core athlons by next year - so macs will be underpowered overpriced puters again by then )but logic pro strikes me as the work of a company who know their software is not up to it trying to get users to stay - ala acid

sx 3 on the other hand will have the sidechaining thing put in (The one feature i really miss from logic) - full freeze for multi out instruments - cos lets face it logics freeze as is is as useless as cubases - you can only freeze a multiple out drum kit by having an individual plug in for every peice of the kit - useless - and sx is still cheaper than logic pro by a good distance

the sxxxl thing is not an effort to challenge apple bt a way of getting rid of some old software disks (xphrase, waldorf edition) that are not selling as part of a bargain package - pretty much the same as logic pro or NI komplete

it does not mean they fear logics dominance - thats comes from the underlying notion that somehow businesses fight each other - they are obviously aware of each other but what each business does is whatever it needs to do to make money - what NI, steinberg and apple are doing is bundling old stuff thats sales have dried up on together so they can still generate some revenue - getting rid of the last few disks they have makes space to get some more in stock

I may add i am playing devils advocate here cos i really object to steinberg bashing coming from a company who are even worse corporate nazis than charlie and crew

[Lunch Money]

My vote is only based on loyalty and enjoyment... obviously an SXXL package offers far more raw power than I'm accustomed to. Or that I need, mind you. Or that I WANT, most importantly.

[eternia]

Steinberg, who this year celebrate their 20th anniversary, have released a limited Cubase SXXL bundle as a 'thank you to all our customers'.

I just got the above in an email from Arbiter. Okay, maybe I'm stupid or something, but doesn't customer sort of imply than we already bought the products? Okay, so I'm really talking about existing customers, but why would you want celebrate your 20 years by thanking the people who haven't bought your products?

I'm not bitter or complaining, just intrigued at the marketing logic in use here. Maybe they've hired the marketing brains from Coke who said "We've got faucets, and empty bottles...let's go for it!"

D