Please can we get a new forum for

[Tricky-Loops]

Well, as boring as the copycats may be, your advanced sound design with complicated sequencers with mathematic functions, aren't everybody's taste, either...

But I wouldn't have anything against a newbie sub forum and an advanced sub forum.

What I don't understand is, though, why so many people want to sound like somebody else. I rather prefer being unique than copying Avicii, Alessi, Benassi and Garrixi leads...

[Gamma-UT]

What I don't understand is, though, why so many people want to sound like somebody else. I rather prefer being unique than copying Avicii, Alessi, Benassi and Garrixi leads...

They don't. They want stuff that "sounds good" to an audience. They know their friends like it or they've seen the crowd go wild in a club when a certain sound comes in and think "it must be the sound to make people go wild. I must have a sound like it to do the same thing", not realising context and arrangement, the effects layered on top, what's played around it are the things that make the gimmick work. It won't work the same way in a different context. But without the experience to make other good sounds, they just glom onto what's gone before. That's the sad futility of the whole exercise.

[Sendy]

Well, as boring as the copycats may be, your advanced sound design with complicated sequencers with mathematic functions, aren't everybody's taste, either...

But I wouldn't have anything against a newbie sub forum and an advanced sub forum.

What I don't understand is, though, why so many people want to sound like somebody else. I rather prefer being unique than copying Avicii, Alessi, Benassi and Garrixi leads...

This isn't a stand against simple discussions, or newbies, or anything like that. It's the attitude, and the copycat mentality, and the sheer VOLUME of this stuff.

Some people might be bored by a post of mine, but they can skip over it. There's only one person making posts like me. There's only one person making posts like you. But you can't skip over 500 posts all asking more or less the same thing. These things are undergoing mitosis.

Believe it or not, I don't even have a problem with EDM, in principle. House music in the 90's was great fun, and it was made by people with, by and large, an infectious and positive attitude. The cult of celebrity and greed has polluted those waters.

[nasenmann]

Just don't bother, or if you wanna help out, find like 3 tutorials for generic techno/trance/wub sound design, and just post them without comment.
Myself, i just ignore any "how to make x" threads 'cause it's already too easy to sound like others. I'd rather try to imitate patches myself, fail, and come up with something different that's nice.

[The_Hidden_Goose]

It's always possible that they're young and interests haven't been broadened yet. They may get put off the whole thing if everyone who they turn to for guidance tells them to politely f-off.

The first things I made were awful. Diabolically so. The dumbest, 2-dimensional, badly mixed/balanced techno that even the most avid glow-stick-swinging, dummy-gnawing, glitter-faced technohead at the height of their mda-peak would've hated (but trying to emulate other hard techno at the time, as that was what I was digging in clubs and raves and festivals). I wonder how I'd have reacted if the people I turned to for advice and info gave me the same attitude that I have for this kinda thing. There would've probably be some hand gestures and profanity involved, but who knows - maybe it would've knocked my confidence so much that I gave up altogether...

I don't know if I have a problem with EDM, because I'm still not sure what it is and what various electronic dance-ish music it covers. I do have a problem with the likes of Aviici, but only in the same way I have a problem with any music I don't like. I hope that people get bored of it as soon as possible, and don't really want to encourage people to make it. If others do, then that's fine. It's their scene not mine.

It annoys me more that their focus of leanring is so narrow, and not liekly to take them in new and interesting directions. When dubstep came along it was the wobble - which just learning basic synthesis with the most basic synth gives you, along with a load of other tools that you can re-use and twist to your own ends (why just THAT bit of it and none of the rest I always wondered). Now it's that fat supersaw thing, which is also dead easy and for the synths that can do it, it's just one of many useful tools they offer - even for that kidn of EDM. It'll be something else eventually.

[Tricky-Loops]

I'm one of these crazy individualists who tries to avoid sounding like others principally. The last weeks I thought "Maybe I should make wobble dubstep basses because everybody makes them." And of course I could make them, there are enough tutorials out there and with some pitch envelope LFOs or/and vibrato, and a bit volume LFO/automation and bitch bend, I wouldn't have any problem to imitate them.

But then I always think: "NO - just because everybody makes them, *I* don't have to!" Because I hate them. I don't like bass lines who sound like a damaged lawn mower. And I don't like leads who sound like rubber ducks, either. Furthermore, I prefer real natural vocals instead of all that Melodyno-Autotuna stuff...

Maybe I'm too oldskool...

[Tricky-Loops]

Now it's that fat supersaw thing...

Supersaw again? I thought Supersaw would have died many years ago when Unisono came into play...

[standalone]

Suggested forum names on the back of a postcard please. I'll go first

EDM n00bs

Don't Get Me Started (AKA What is the best...)

[elxsound]

I'd say make it an offense. If they do it three times, ban them. But then you run the risk of scaring off genuine newcomers who want to learn and are interested in a dialog, perhaps?

I don't know. We're seeing a similar thing in the Music Theory forums. In fact, it seems to be happening with everything. I don't know how much dumbing down and casualization culture at large can take... It's like looking for the point when an infinitessimal becomes zero.

It has lots to do with a couple things... 1. Music Production is very accessible and 2. You've learned something, which makes the n00b 101 stuff painful to see over and over (which can be expected because there will always be someone just starting out).

[Sendy]

Now it's that fat supersaw thing...

Supersaw again? I thought Supersaw would have died many years ago when Unisono came into play...

The supersaw is back, only this time it's more detuned and sadistically bright than ever! Just when you thought it was safe to go into the club..... DZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ! *blood explodes from your ears as you collapse to your knees*

[Sendy]

I'd say make it an offense. If they do it three times, ban them. But then you run the risk of scaring off genuine newcomers who want to learn and are interested in a dialog, perhaps?

I don't know. We're seeing a similar thing in the Music Theory forums. In fact, it seems to be happening with everything. I don't know how much dumbing down and casualization culture at large can take... It's like looking for the point when an infinitessimal becomes zero.

It has lots to do with a couple things... 1. Music Production is very accessible and 2. You've learned something, which makes the n00b 101 stuff painful to see over and over (which can be expected because there will always be someone just starting out).

I actually like to see noobs asking questions. How many times have I stopped what I'm doing to explain how sync or PWM works, or give advice to people asking questions who seem willing to put some effort in on their end? Young people getting into synthesis, asking questions and experimenting is what I want to see in the Sound Design forums.

In fact I'd be so bold as to say these annoying posts aren't people starting out, they have no intention of starting anything, they'll get help making their preset - and consequently learn nothing, then fall at the next challenge when people get fed up holding their hand. Of course, knowing when people have a good attitude and when they don't isn't an exact science. If it was, we could just label this stuff as straight up spam.

Learning synthesis and sound processing isn't about knowing what exact settings to use (which is all these people are interested in). It's about having a model of the synth in your bonce and being able to predict which controls will do what and why.

[Tricky-Loops]

Now it's that fat supersaw thing...

Supersaw again? I thought Supersaw would have died many years ago when Unisono came into play...

The supersaw is back, only this time it's more detuned and sadistically bright than ever! Just when you thought it was safe to go into the club..... DZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!

OMD, then I have to bring my chainsaw into the club to stop the DJ...

[The_Hidden_Goose]

I hate it, but give me that supersaw over the farty, nasal (or "damaged lawnmower" as Tricky-Loops put it) kind of bass that does more to rattle my teeth than rumble in my belly (which is how I like my bass - even wobbly bass, which I like, just the more sine-based sub sort)

[elxsound]

I'd say make it an offense. If they do it three times, ban them. But then you run the risk of scaring off genuine newcomers who want to learn and are interested in a dialog, perhaps?

I don't know. We're seeing a similar thing in the Music Theory forums. In fact, it seems to be happening with everything. I don't know how much dumbing down and casualization culture at large can take... It's like looking for the point when an infinitessimal becomes zero.

It has lots to do with a couple things... 1. Music Production is very accessible and 2. You've learned something, which makes the n00b 101 stuff painful to see over and over (which can be expected because there will always be someone just starting out).

I actually like to see noobs asking questions. How many times have I stopped what I'm doing to explain how sync or PWM works, or give advice to people asking questions who seem willing to put some effort in on their end? Young people getting into synthesis, asking questions and experimenting is what I want to see in the Sound Design forums.

It is good, but you can't separate one for the other. There always has been and always will be those that want to sound like "x" and those that want to actually learn to do for themselves. Anyway, just pointing out that it becomes easier to group things together and make statements that "it seems to be happening with everything" when we learn more. Nothing has changed, we just notice it more and more.

[Sendy]

I agree. It's not cut and dry, and there's no surefire way of deciding what's spam and what isn't in these cases.

However, I disagree that it's because we're getting cleverer (or more knowledgable is perhaps a better way of putting it) - that may be a small factor, but ultimately it's the casualisation of music production, the absurd amounts of fame and money garnished on the 1% in electronic music stardom, and a general dumbing down of everything under the sun, causing a sort of "zombie apocalypse".

And I predict the torrent of spam will continue to grow exponentially, until all the knowledgable voices are drowned out, unless a stand is made and having actual standards comes back into fashion.