KVR Audio

SWAN808 · Post by **SWAN808** » Tue May 27, 2014 1:48 pm

Im expecting the answer to be no - but Im wondering considering that Pianoteq uses synthesis - is it possible to sell samples of pianoteq as part of a pack? Im not talking about doing massive sample sets but just using the sounds for sound design...

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Tue May 27, 2014 2:03 pm

I think it would be best to ask Modartt themselves. Perhaps it's also mentioned in the EULA...

SampleScience · Post by **SampleScience** » Tue May 27, 2014 4:06 pm

It's legal since it's physical modeling, which is a kind of synthesis. But you'd have to create your own patches to be fair, otherwise it wouldn't be very ethical and respectful to Modartt.

SWAN808 · Post by **SWAN808** » Wed May 28, 2014 1:01 am

"Sound produced by Pianoteq can only be distributed within a musical context, and not in forms that allow the sounds to be used as sample based instruments or sample libraries."

Modartt EULA

SampleScience · Post by **SampleScience** » Wed May 28, 2014 4:36 am

analoguesamples909 wrote:"Sound produced by Pianoteq can only be distributed within a musical context, and not in forms that allow the sounds to be used as sample based instruments or sample libraries."

Modartt EULA

They obviously protect their product in their EULA...

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Wed May 28, 2014 6:16 am

analoguesamples909 wrote:"Sound produced by Pianoteq can only be distributed within a musical context, and not in forms that allow the sounds to be used as sample based instruments or sample libraries."

I don't see how they can legally enforce that.

With that said, from a practical standpoint, I can't imagine why you would want to sample Pianoteq. Pianoteq Stage is cheap and its add-ons are cheap. Plus, I'd use the real thing just to avoid the multi-GB sample library.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Wed May 28, 2014 9:51 am

Uncle E wrote:I don't see how they can legally enforce that.

Pianoteq's modeling is patented (patent No. US 7,915,515 B2). I guess that's how.

Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Wed May 28, 2014 10:03 am

EvilDragon wrote:
Uncle E wrote:I don't see how they can legally enforce that.
Pianoteq's modeling is patented (patent No. US 7,915,515 B2). I guess that's how.

But just like most synths architectures. Pianoteq does not use samples so, technically, they can't prevent you from sampling it, just like Moog can't prevent from sampling your precious Minimoog and make a Kontakt library with it.
They can patent the engine but cannot patent its output sound. In the end, Pianoteq is just a very specialised and complex synth.
However, I agree that considering the price of Stage, sampling it would be a little lame and probably just not worth it.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Wed May 28, 2014 10:15 am

Actually Pianoteq uses some samples for pedal and key noises. And that's a part of piano sound.

In any case, what's said in EULA is what should be followed. If they restrict sampling of it for any usage other than musical performance, then that's that.

Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Wed May 28, 2014 10:26 am

EvilDragon wrote:Actually Pianoteq uses some samples for pedal and key noises. And that's a part of piano sound.

I didn't know that (though I use it). In that case, sampling it is a big no, regardless of the EULA.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Wed May 28, 2014 10:34 am

I think modeling the noises would be extremely inefficient on CPU, that's why they used samples there. They do process them in realtime, too, for variation.

Alex Cremers · Post by **Alex Cremers** » Wed May 28, 2014 6:33 pm

What if someone made his own 'unique' sounds with Pianoteq? I wouldn't be surprised if some sound developers are using Pianoteq as a sound generator for many years now.

Alex

bigcat1969 · Post by **bigcat1969** » Wed May 28, 2014 7:28 pm

I'm the guy making Kontakt wrappers, not instruments, for Philharmonia samples to make an end run around their restrictions on distributing their samples, so you know I'll stretch a point pretty far, but this is just wrong. EvilDragon is right, they do use certain samples and they own those samples, so this would be a complete violation both legally and ethically.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Wed May 28, 2014 8:27 pm

Alex Cremers wrote:What if someone made his own 'unique' sounds with Pianoteq? I wouldn't be surprised if some sound developers are using Pianoteq as a sound generator for many years now.

Those "unique" sounds still contain key and pedal noise samples (even if you made them quieter). Hence it is illegal to sample Pianoteq's output.

Sampling Pianoteq?