What would make you switch to Linux?

[T-CM11]

the supermarket vs farmers market thing, speaks to the 'localvore' movement, moving back to buying food sourced as close to their homes, and sourced as close as possible from it's natural habitat. you get to know the farmers, so can choose to give money to farmers who take care to give theri animals the best lives, best nutrition etc, and that the food hasn't sat in a fridge for months before being shipped halfway across the world

I live in the centre of one of the major cities... no farmers nearby. I do have some edible plants growing on my patio however. (various berries, tomatoes, zucchinis, radiches, letuce, peppers)

but religious nonsense is just so hard to ignore

It's pretty easy when you live in a secular West-European country (no " nation under god" nonsense over here ).

have both ios and android in tablet, and will likely end up going android for mobile

If I wanted a tablet for anything other than music, I'd probably pick Android too... but I don't need a tablet (for anything other than music).

[briandc]

Since my last post (yesterday) there's been quite a discussion here, lots more to respond than I have time at the moment. However, I will quickly say this:

those who are saying "linux doesn't do X, Y and Z, and so I'm not interested" are missing the boat entirely. Linux exists because people PARTICIPATE. Not that you have to be a coder. You don't. But what makes linux so great is that it's grassroots. It's up to you and I, not the whims of a corporation.

So if you're happy with where you're at using Windows or Mac, I completely understand. It's comfortable. Linux however, exists because people get involved, even if your involvement is only making synth patches or writing a line on a forum to say, "hey, why doesn't app do X or Z?" or "I had this problem, what should I do to solve it?"

And there's no point in saying that linux has bugs in one place or another. Windows and Mac have their own problems too. The advantage is, YOU can be a useful part of the build. Or, you can just go along for the ride. But whereas if you're not happy with linux, you can change it. If you're not happy with a for-profit OS, most likely you can do little about it.

And since most of us here are computer users, I think we know how important that difference is.


brian

Do you work for IK? If not - you should. They brush aside user logic too

The benefits you see are of no use to most people on KVR. As a computer user, I can tell you that the number one important thing for all here is compatibility with existing audio standards, from either Windows or OSX That's where Linux fails. If your community influence is so strong, get it changed. Being able to run Cubase and vstis/au will be a major. That will make a huge impact.

As I don't use Cubase, it hasn't been something I've been pushing for. But I've been encouraging developers of several linux-based synths to add features, etc, and it's been a positive experience, and I'm willing to bet that there's someone out there right now working on what you are asking for. (It's just that we don't usually hear about it until it's "born.")
If I ever stop spending time on forums and the like, I'd like to just sit down and learn to code, maybe something like C or C++. I'd love to be able to take a synth and fork it.
I've never used Reaktor or Kontact or any other big non-free synths that are Windows-based, I've only tried Reaper and found that it does a very fine job indeed of porting VST instruments to linux. LMMS is a very useful DAW in linux that imports most VST instruments as well, and I've recently been helping to test performance a variety of them, 90% with good results.

The linux community is big. I have a lot of faith in it, because it's all over the world. I'm working on an open-source audio production website at the moment, with 2 guys from Sweden and another from Ireland. Lots of talent, lots of donating time for a passion, and realizing big projects. Despite popular opinion, people do actually do things for free. Not everything is done because someone is paying them to do it. Fortunately!

I also look at the free VST instruments that are out there, many which I have discovered through KVR. Lots of projects made by people with a passion (and talent). And it's great to think that what used to be available only for those who could afford expensive hardware equipment, is now available in free applications online. For everyone and anyone who likes to make music. There's a lot of undiscovered musical talent out there, and we're able to learn of it now more than ever before.


brian

[jancivil]

So we see that Linux is in the venue of idealism and a beautiful dream. A couple of people are so idealistic they'll *never use Kontakt or Reaktor.

None of these values help someone that's into having access to the highest quality tools.

"linux doesn't do X, Y and Z, and so I'm not interested" are missing the boat entirely.

The OP, on an audio plugins forum, is "what would make you switch to Linux". You can sail away on that boat to your heart's content. Why are you selling it to someone like me? Or ghettosynth who fully groks it but won't be using it for audio? *You're missing boats yourself.

Linux however, exists because people get involved, even if your involvement is only making synth patches or writing a line on a forum to say, "hey, why doesn't app do X or Z?" or "I had this problem, what should I do to solve it?"

I made a bunch of patches available to, eg., Native Instruments Community, User Libraries and had at least one problem I presented to NI Forums and a couple of others I presented solutions to. What are you on about? Since that thing exists because of money, it's a different quality of contribution?

Windows and Mac have their own problems too. The advantage is, YOU can be a useful part of the build.

Windows and Mac do not have the problem of being unable to support Cubase. I use that thing for very specific reasons, a couple of which are absolutely not replacable. Why do you feature people trade the advantage of a no-brainer OS for the 'advantage' above? Which unless you're interested in a lower level of operating system, as you state it, is not more than what is available normally? You have, because of these stated ethics which come to political beliefs. And here is some sophistry, these gestures make perfect sense, you think, but really not so much.
How come people haven't changed it to where people more interested in what I'm interested in can use it? I don't care about Reaper's plugins. I need Vienna Ensemble Pro 5 and latest build of Kontakt 5; if there is a bug I speak up, I'm not {and you lot are not} coding it. Or anything remotely resembling it, and you never will {nor will COCKOS}. If we're going to go for the politics, the very reason these things exist is because people can make a living at it, at what they love. Thanks but no thanks, Comrade. I'm in computers for the music first.

There is really some condescending stuff here, is the thing. Glokraw wants us to prove eg., Reaktor has better approaches to what are some things we take for granted but 'Linux' - an Operating System, through itself - does it all. Come on.

[Numanoid]

So, what plugins, apps or whatever else would you need under Linux before you could switch?

To be able to install stuff I want to use while offline.

Trying to install something on a Linux distro while offline, led to me being told that "x-pack" was missing, so I went to a machine I have on internet and download that and installed on the Linux machine, which led to me being told "y-pack" is missing, repeat process, then "z-pack" is missing, etc, etc

On Windows I just install a VST, fire it up with Herman Seib VST host, and that's that, I can use it.

[trimph1]

I think this whole thing is about raising converts....thereby improving market share.

Territorial marking as it were....

[trimph1]

Listen to the end user. Don't just fluff it off...

[ghettosynth]

All OS have Malware - its a myth that Linux / OSX are immune. Its not a fail of Windows technically but more to do with popularity :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_malware

Thanks for the link. Now I now that "There has not yet been a widespread Linux malware infection of the type that Microsoft Windows software has; this is attributable generally to the malware's lack of root access and fast updates to most Linux vulnerabilities."

you have blinkered vision. Windows has an administrator account which is the same as Root. How well does Nuendo run on Linux?

You missed the essence of the statement. The point is that malware on linux generally has LESS root access than on Windows. One of the common solutions to running certain USER applications on Windows is to run as administrator, this is generally not something that one does on linux. I work on my own system for days at a time without ever having to function as root.

[UltraJv]

All OS have Malware - its a myth that Linux / OSX are immune. Its not a fail of Windows technically but more to do with popularity :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_malware

Thanks for the link. Now I now that "There has not yet been a widespread Linux malware infection of the type that Microsoft Windows software has; this is attributable generally to the malware's lack of root access and fast updates to most Linux vulnerabilities."

you have blinkered vision. Windows has an administrator account which is the same as Root. How well does Nuendo run on Linux?

You missed the essence of the statement. The point is that malware on linux generally has LESS root access than on Windows. One of the common solutions to running certain USER applications on Windows is to run as administrator, this is generally not something that one does on linux. I work on my own system for days at a time without ever having to function as root.

That's nice for you. I bet Linux users don't run malware protection because they assume they've never had malware. Without software telling you - how do you know? Windows 8 now come with malware protection built in. OSX has Malware protection built in, its called Gateway. What does Linux have off the shelf?

[briandc]

So we see that Linux is in the venue of idealism and a beautiful dream. A couple of people are so idealistic they'll *never use Kontakt or Reaktor.

None of these values help someone that's into having access to the highest quality tools.

Incorrect. Ever heard of Zynaddsubfx? It's not idealism. It's actually reality. And anyone who isn't satisfied with it can help to make it better.

The OP, on an audio plugins forum, is "what would make you switch to Linux". You can sail away on that boat to your heart's content. Why are you selling it to someone like me? Or ghettosynth who fully groks it but won't be using it for audio? *You're missing boats yourself.

Well, it's hard to sell something that's already free. But it is I think useful to at least clarify people's misconceptions about a IT platform that is there and available for anyone and everyone who would like to make it into the best OS available.

I made a bunch of patches available to, eg., Native Instruments Community, User Libraries and had at least one problem I presented to NI Forums and a couple of others I presented solutions to. What are you on about? Since that thing exists because of money, it's a different quality of contribution?

No. I am happy to hear about your collaboration, it's the exact thing I'm talking about here.

Windows and Mac do not have the problem of being unable to support Cubase. I use that thing for very specific reasons, a couple of which are absolutely not replacable. Why do you feature people trade the advantage of a no-brainer OS for the 'advantage' above? Which unless you're interested in a lower level of operating system, as you state it, is not more than what is available normally? You have, because of these stated ethics which come to political beliefs. And here is some sophistry, these gestures make perfect sense, you think, but really not so much.
How come people haven't changed it to where people more interested in what I'm interested in can use it? I don't care about Reaper's plugins. I need Vienna Ensemble Pro 5 and latest build of Kontakt 5; if there is a bug I speak up, I'm not {and you lot are not} coding it. Or anything remotely resembling it, and you never will {nor will COCKOS}. If we're going to go for the politics, the very reason these things exist is because people can make a living at it, at what they love. Thanks but no thanks, Comrade. I'm in computers for the music first.

There is really some condescending stuff here, is the thing. Glokraw wants us to prove eg., Reaktor has better approaches to what are some things we take for granted but 'Linux' - an Operating System, through itself - does it all. Come on.

Personally, I'm of the idea that at some point we will have a comparible app to that of Reaktor, etc. Believe me, if I were a programmer, I'd love to have a go at it. There are people all over the world who do program and do it for the fun of it. Look at Synth1. A quality synth, that some people say is better than non-free synths. Same thing for Zynaddsubfx. Which is also a native linux synth.

For now, we don't have synths or DAWs comparible perhaps to the ones you cited. But I think it won't be long before we do. (I don't know if they are already useable in linux with Wine, as I don't have a need for them, but perhaps they are.)


brian

[briandc]

Listen to the end user. Don't just fluff it off...

Hi trimph1,
my opinion may not be that of the OP, I don't know. I agree that the enduser is important. I'm also an enduser of linux. And just as Microsoft listens to its users, the linux community listens to its users. They listen to me, I can assure you.

The difference is, a corporation may or may not have interest or time in the enduser's requests. They have a budget.
The linux community is worldwide, and there are many many people out there willing to help, and even to improve their apps for you and me. And of course, the community encourages active participation too, if you are able!
In other words, you and I "are linux."


brian

[briandc]

All OS have Malware - its a myth that Linux / OSX are immune. Its not a fail of Windows technically but more to do with popularity :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_malware

Thanks for the link. Now I now that "There has not yet been a widespread Linux malware infection of the type that Microsoft Windows software has; this is attributable generally to the malware's lack of root access and fast updates to most Linux vulnerabilities."

you have blinkered vision. Windows has an administrator account which is the same as Root. How well does Nuendo run on Linux?

You missed the essence of the statement. The point is that malware on linux generally has LESS root access than on Windows. One of the common solutions to running certain USER applications on Windows is to run as administrator, this is generally not something that one does on linux. I work on my own system for days at a time without ever having to function as root.

That's nice for you. I bet you Linux users don't run malware protection because they assume they've never had malware. Without software telling you - how do you know? Windows 8 now come with malware protection built in. OSX has Malware protection built in, its called Gateway. What does Linux have off the shelf?

UFW. (unix firewall) Just install and type "sudo ufw enable" in the terminal (confirmed with password, of course).

It's the only thing I've ever used. There are other apps, such as Clam. There is also an app called "watchdog" if you feel like installing it.

brian

[el-bo (formerly ebow)]

the supermarket vs farmers market thing, speaks to the 'localvore' movement, moving back to buying food sourced as close to their homes, and sourced as close as possible from it's natural habitat. you get to know the farmers, so can choose to give money to farmers who take care to give theri animals the best lives, best nutrition etc, and that the food hasn't sat in a fridge for months before being shipped halfway across the world

I live in the centre of one of the major cities... no farmers nearby. I do have some edible plants growing on my patio however. (various berries, tomatoes, zucchinis, radiches, letuce, peppers)

but religious nonsense is just so hard to ignore

It's pretty easy when you live in a secular West-European country (no " nation under god" nonsense over here ).

have both ios and android in tablet, and will likely end up going android for mobile

If I wanted a tablet for anything other than music, I'd probably pick Android too... but I don't need a tablet (for anything other than music).

nice one on the mini garden

as for android and ios, i don't mind android at all )except for music apps). i do have some annoyances with ios (which, by my limited understanding, might change from ios , but it would make more sense for me to go iphone for better integration with the mac, and with my current ios apps etc.

it's a shame i cannot afford an iphone, as i much prefer the size. i have no interest in a phone that has wants-to-be-a-tablet syndrome

[jancivil]

So we see that Linux is in the venue of idealism and a beautiful dream. A couple of people are so idealistic they'll *never use Kontakt or Reaktor.

None of these values help someone that's into having access to the highest quality tools.

Incorrect. Ever heard of Zynaddsubfx? It's not idealism. It's actually reality. And anyone who isn't satisfied with it can help to make it better.

Nope, never heard of it. Now you're taking statements and repurposing them. I said that your values do nothing through themselves to change reality. You want to talk about Reaktor but you've never used it!

For now, we don't have synths or DAWs comparible perhaps to the ones you cited. But I think it won't be long before we do. (I don't know if they are already useable in linux with Wine, as I don't have a need for them, but perhaps they are.)

You 'think' this and you 'think' that, but you don't really know what these things are. You don't understand, you don't need to understand. But a lot of people need high performance and cannot afford to run things under Wine and all this. I totally acknowledge your POV but you want to vacate what people tell you. It's not enough to state what it's good for, you're pretending it 'does it all', or will in future, even as you have no experience with the things it doesn't do.

Why are you selling it...

Well, it's hard to sell something that's already free. But it is I think useful to at least clarify people's misconceptions about a IT platform that is there and available for anyone and everyone who would like to make it into the best OS available.

Come on, that 'sell' means persuade. The best OS available for what? The thing you're selling is ideology. I don't think anyone believes it isn't there and available for the sort of person that's interested in the OS at the lower level. It isn't going to replace the capitalized systems or software purposed more directly just through the beauty of intention. Linux is you and me. Great, but I want software made by competitive professionals that don't do anything else. The people that make the things I'm going to use are porting to Windows and OSX. Full stop.

So this is a political argument essentially, I don't believe what you believe to the extent of things being magically true in this realm of professional quality audio software is all.

[T-CM11]

it's a shame i cannot afford an iphone, as i much prefer the size. i have no interest in a phone that has wants-to-be-a-tablet syndrome

I love my Motorola Moto G, it's 4.5" (.5 bigger than the iPhone), but I can operate it with one hand. And it's plenty fast... and cheap!

[T-CM11]

UFW. (unix firewall) Just install and type "sudo ufw enable" in the terminal (confirmed with password, of course).

Does it have a GUI? If not, how do you know that command? It could've been "run ufw enable" or "start ufw activate" or "go ufw on"... or whatever. I think command line for basic functions is just "bad UI design" (=no interface design). And even for more "advanced" configuration, why not put a button and a screen with options.
But that's just me, I have better things to memorize than a million commands and their parameters.