PHYSICALLY MODELLED emulations of electric guitars and acoustic/electric basses

[BlackWinny]

The project is to be run with the less cost possible for everyone, so with no new hardware material apart what we already have of course.

Sounds like a bunch of arbitrary restrictions for the sake of arbitrary restrictions. If you just want to make noise with what you have around the house, grab some pots and pans. If you want the best that software PM has to offer, then you've probably heard it already. If you want realistic sounding bass and guitar then you'll either need to use sample-based products... or hire a bass/guitar player and do it the old fashioned way.

It's not my decision!
It's a contract made for four years with a producer of documentary DVDs.

The contract says "No sample" so it will be No sample!

If I wanted to use samples, many people here know that I have Sampletank, Amplitube, T-Racks, and some other IK products and with many banks. So I could do all the music for this project with Sampletank... but the contract is "No sample!". Because the decision has been taken to see what these five composers can do without any sample in the reproduction of very accurate sounds and very nice "cosmic" sounds using only keyboards (even no real guitar) and absolutely no samples! And it is a very good idea because it allows to assess the expertise of a musician in his sound managements without the ease of the samples!

So if the contract says "No sample" as I said in the OP it is totally useless to tell me about sample-based products or to try to tell me that I'm wrong to not use samples! I have Sampletank and other products, but the contract says "No samples"! Is it clear?

And when you say that...

If you just want to make noise with what you have around the house, grab some pots and pans. If you want the best that software PM has to offer, then you've probably heard it already. If you want realistic sounding bass and guitar then you'll either need to use sample-based products... or hire a bass/guitar player and do it the old fashioned way.

... you are simply telling that out of the samples all the emulation methods for music is noise! No? What a crappy way to consider the other synthesis methods! And what an awesome respect to all the other musicians...

[BDeep]

The contract says "No sample" so it will be No sample!

Are you sure they didn't mean, samples with non-cleared copyrights? Or complete pieces of music? That would make way more sense than prohibiting the use of instruments based on samples... My 2c

[BlackWinny]

The contract says "No sample" so it will be No sample!

Are you sure they didn't mean, samples with non-cleared copyrights? Or complete pieces of music? That would make way more sense than prohibiting the use of instruments based on samples... My 2c

Once again I repeat:

Because the decision has been taken (by the producers of the DVD collection, not by us) to see what these five composers can do without any sample in the reproduction of very accurate sounds and very nice "cosmic" sounds using only keyboards (even no real guitar) and absolutely no samples! And it is a very good idea because it allows to assess the expertise of a musician in his sound managements without the ease of the samples!

[BlackWinny]

And they don't prohitit the use of samples in their mind. It is only for this project. They have other collections of DVDs where the composers have used samples. For this one it has been stated that it is a good challenge to do it with absolutely no sample at all, and also exclusively with hardware synths or/and software synths.

The contract has been discussed during one full month and with two meetings at their office in the center of Paris. At the first meeting there were 35 candidates. At the last meeting, only five had accepted the challenge to make in respect of these rules several tunes for each 50 minutes DVD of this collection of 16 DVDs. The tunes must have a minimum of 2 minutes and a maximum of 7 minutes. Each of the five musicians will have at least one tune in each of the 16 DVDs. The rest of the time is used by the narrator.

For each collection of their DVDs (they have already half a dozen of very good collections) they place a new challenge to the musicians who accept the contract. For this contract it is "... only hardware/software synths, and not the least sample in these compositions".

I was free to refuse like the thirty who have refused for a reason (the gear to use or to reject) or another reason (no sample).

And the reason they told us ("This challenge allows to assess the expertise of a musician in his sound managements without the ease of the samples") is funny but very good to auto-evaluate oneself in this part of the music composition. So I have accepted. And I have accepted because all my life long I have done challenges, even in my profession when I worked.

So as I said and as I repeat it is totally useless to tell about samples in this thread!

[scook]

AAS Tassman models string instrument too.

[CC4]

Sugar Bytes Guitarist is great but it is technically sample based, quoted from the manual: "You can choose from three Guitars, each one comes in two versions. A Duesenberg Starplayer Special, a Fender Stratocaster and a Fender Telecaster. The guitars have been recorded with lots of effort and care, more than 2200 samples are used for each guitar."

This Reaktor ensemble is physically modelled:
http://www.native-instruments.com/en/co ... show/7523/

[BlackWinny]

Sugar Bytes Guitarist is great but it is technically sample based, quoted from the manual: "You can choose from three Guitars, each one comes in two versions. A Duesenberg Starplayer Special, a Fender Stratocaster and a Fender Telecaster. The guitars have been recorded with lots of effort and care, more than 2200 samples are used for each guitar."

Thanks for the info!
So I move it to the sample-based list.

This Reaktor ensemble is physically modelled:
http://www.native-instruments.com/en/co ... show/7523/

As I don't have Reaktor (from NI I have only FM8), I won't be able to use, but the info is interesting since one of the four other composers has Reaktor, and I'll tell you about this ensemble in the case he has not it yet. So... Thanks!

[BlackWinny]

AAS Tassman models string instrument too.

Yes. As I love all the AAS products that I already own, I would probably used it or tried to use it. The only problem is that I haven't it yet and it is too expensive to get it now (my maximum price is fixed at €150/$200 because I have also other things to buy for the same project). My purchase of Tassman in addition to StrumAcouSess, LoungLizSess, VA-2 and VS-2 is planed for the end of the year but in the meanwhile two of the 16 DVD composition will have to be finished and it would be acoustically odd to change the instruments I'll use during the four years for the project, so for coherence of the sounds I'll have to continue until the end with all the instruments chosen from the very beginning of the project. That's why I must make the right choice by now, the project beginning in early September.

But yes, the suggestion was good, but too expensive to be purchased by now to be used from the very start of the project.

[WOK]

 
Not exactly guitar/bass, but plucked string:
http://music.service-1.de/html/phymo_xs ... k_-_s.html
(Needs an amp sim)

 

[Kevin Deas]

There seem to be a lot of choices for strum/rhythm guitar, but I've yet to find anything I could afford that does lead/solo guitar (electric). Could be I just suck at this sh*t.

[BlackWinny]

 
Not exactly guitar/bass, but plucked string:
http://music.service-1.de/html/phymo_xs ... k_-_s.html
(Needs an amp sim)

 

Hello!

Glad to see you here!

I've not been convinced by Phymo concerning the guitars (except some quite nice "bluesy" sounds), even with a good amp and good effects. But for medieval and ethnic plucked string instruments... WOW!!!

I have managed to approach quite closely the sounds of the turkish baglama (the saz), the greek baglama (not at all the same instrument as in Turkey, the greek baglama is a high-pitch bouzouki and almost all the occidental people confuse them), the balalaika, the çeng (a turkish harp), the spanish and celtic harps (not the classical harp), the medieval lute, the oud, the pipa, the ruba, the sanxian, the sarod, the shamisen, the tampura, the tanbur, the zithers (american and european zithers but also kanun, guzheng, guqin, koto, dan tranh...)

... but never the guitars in a convincing way. Nor the bowed string instruments. But I'm sure WOK is able to create one day a very good emulation of bowed string instruments to emulate many bowed instruments of the world as complement to these plucked string ethnic intruments!

For these ethnic plucked string instruments this quite recent Phymo has quickly become one of my favorites in the physically modelled synthesis (with some of xoxos and some of Simple-Media). In the sampled-based instruments I use a lot EMM-Knagalis and the "World instruments" bank of Sampletank, and the full bundle "Tao Series" from Samplesphere.

Who said a few posts above that I don't like the samples ? Hmmm??? Some people should keep the silence instead of show their disdain always a bit quickly and criticize without knowing!

[Tricky-Loops]

AAS Strum Electric GS-1 sounds...meh...not pretty realistic...

...but then when you switch off the onboard amp & all the other onboard effects (using the guitar emulation only) and when you connect it with a professional guitar amp simulation suite like SHRED or AmpLion...

...it is DA BOMB!!!

Once I tried to imitate the guitars of an AC/DC song and it sounded perfectly!

[Kevin Deas]

AAS Strum Electric GS-1 sounds...meh...not pretty realistic...

...but then when you switch off the onboard amp & all the other onboard effects (using the guitar emulation only) and when you connect it with a professional guitar amp simulation suite like SHRED or AmpLion...

...it is DA BOMB!!!

Once I tried to imitate the guitars of an AC/DC song and it sounded perfectly!

I own AAS Strum Electric, thanks for the tip.

[BlackWinny]

AAS Strum Electric GS-1 sounds...meh...not pretty realistic...

...but then when you switch off the onboard amp & all the other onboard effects (using the guitar emulation only) and when you connect it with a professional guitar amp simulation suite like SHRED or AmpLion...

...it is DA BOMB!!!

Once I tried to imitate the guitars of an AC/DC song and it sounded perfectly!

With Strum Electric GS-1? Nice!

To give you a better idea of the purity of sound that I try to reach with the emulation that I have to purchase, listen to this wonderful tune from Tino Izzo (also known as ONE) that I mention in my OP:

[Kevin Deas]

Nice Tune. Good Luck! To get that level you will need fret noises, string buzz, and finger slides, changes in pick position too. Aww what do I know? Probably should mind my own business.