I need help choosing what laptop to buy for my new portable setup.
I'm a musician, and I'm currently setting up a new audio system for live performance.
I'm playing in several bands, and my need of several different sounds combined with an increasing need of mobility, now "forces" me to concider a completely software based set of synthesizers, only using MIDI controllers as external devices. It's simply way too heavy to drag around huge master keyboards when I travel as much as I do. I was hoping that you people could help me finding a laptop wich will be the "heart" of my new setup. Most important is that the computer must be able to run several software synthesizers simultaneously, and that's pretty much it.
My goal is to have a good portable system with software synths covering all my "sound needs". I also need a programme to act as a host for all the VSTi's (I think I will go for VST), which easily and fast can switch between different VSTi setups. Preferably I should be able to change setups by the press of a button on one of the MIDI controllers. I don't know if Cubase SX is the right programme for that task.
I've looked through some VST hosts, and there are two that seems usable:
Steinberg V-Stack
Brainspawn Forte
But back to the computer:
There is no need for lots of HD space, as I will not be recording, just playing back live. The system should also have as few cables as possible.
As far as my knowledge goes, I know that a portable DAW must have a fast processor, much memory and a powerful hard drive. I want four USB ports. The graphics and the built-in sound is really of no matter. The price tag should be below $3500.
Presently, my new setup (it's not bought yet; feel free to come with recommendations for other equipment) looks like this (apart from the laptop):
M-Audio Firewire 410 sound card
M-Audio Keystation 88 Pro USB MIDI controller
Evolution MK-461C USB MIDI controller
Thanks in advance for any help.
-Lord Choc Ice-
Laptop for live use
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- KVRer
- 26 posts since 20 Jun, 2004 from Norway
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 26 posts since 20 Jun, 2004 from Norway
I have looked on Alienware's line of portables, and have come up with this setup:
Area-51m Chassis with 15.4" WideSXGA+ 1680x1050 LCD Display - Saucer Silver
Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 3.4 GHz 800MHz FSB w/Hyper-Threading
SiS648FX + SiS963L AGP8X Chipset
1024MB DDR PC-3200 - 2x512 SO-DIMMs
60GB 7200 RPM ATA100 with 8MB Cache - Hitachi
Area-51m ATI Mobility™ Radeon™ 9700 Module with 128MB DDR
Sound-Blaster Pro Compatible 3D Audio
24x10x24 CD-RW / 8x DVD Combo w/Software
Built-In Wireless 802.11a/b/g miniPCI Card
Integrated 10/100Mb Ethernet NIC
56K Modem with V.92 Technology
Microsoft® Windows® XP Home Edition UK
Mobile Keypad - English
Microsoft IntelliMouse Explorer USB 3.0 - Saucer Silver
Aliencare Free Phone 1-Year 24/7 Warranty
Price: Approx. 3 870 USD incl. VAT and shipping
How does it look?
Area-51m Chassis with 15.4" WideSXGA+ 1680x1050 LCD Display - Saucer Silver
Intel® Pentium® 4 Processor 3.4 GHz 800MHz FSB w/Hyper-Threading
SiS648FX + SiS963L AGP8X Chipset
1024MB DDR PC-3200 - 2x512 SO-DIMMs
60GB 7200 RPM ATA100 with 8MB Cache - Hitachi
Area-51m ATI Mobility™ Radeon™ 9700 Module with 128MB DDR
Sound-Blaster Pro Compatible 3D Audio
24x10x24 CD-RW / 8x DVD Combo w/Software
Built-In Wireless 802.11a/b/g miniPCI Card
Integrated 10/100Mb Ethernet NIC
56K Modem with V.92 Technology
Microsoft® Windows® XP Home Edition UK
Mobile Keypad - English
Microsoft IntelliMouse Explorer USB 3.0 - Saucer Silver
Aliencare Free Phone 1-Year 24/7 Warranty
Price: Approx. 3 870 USD incl. VAT and shipping
How does it look?
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- KVRist
- 38 posts since 22 Jun, 2004 from Maine
i am also in the boat for buying a new lap top, i would rather get a pentium M set up over a P-4 with hyper threading, i just dont get how much of a difference not having the HT will make. having a quiter fan, low heat and longer battery life would be a hell of a lot sweeter then a scortching cpu hot rock.
does any one know how well a Pentium M 2.0 with 2mb l2 cache would handle ableton FL and reason with vst's and soft synths galore running? i think it would do well enough, but every one i have talked to doesnt know for shure.
a pentium M 2.0 would be like a p-4 4.0 , it just wouldnt have the HT,
does any one know how well a Pentium M 2.0 with 2mb l2 cache would handle ableton FL and reason with vst's and soft synths galore running? i think it would do well enough, but every one i have talked to doesnt know for shure.
a pentium M 2.0 would be like a p-4 4.0 , it just wouldnt have the HT,
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- jaaathmaster
- 2690 posts since 1 Jun, 2001 from Marlow, S. Bucks, UK
The extra meg of L2 cache seems to add roughly 25% extra performance for number crunching from the benchmarks I've seen. The old P-M seemed to correspond to a P-4 at roughly twice the clockspeed, so the new one (in the BEST case) would roughly correspond to a P-4 at 2.5x times the performance, i.e. 5GhZ... In practice I suspect it's a little slower than that, with the memory bottlenecks (533MhZ FSB etc). Anyone benchmarked the Dothans for audio yet?goodickin wrote:i am also in the boat for buying a new lap top, i would rather get a pentium M set up over a P-4 with hyper threading, i just dont get how much of a difference not having the HT will make. having a quiter fan, low heat and longer battery life would be a hell of a lot sweeter then a scortching cpu hot rock.
does any one know how well a Pentium M 2.0 with 2mb l2 cache would handle ableton FL and reason with vst's and soft synths galore running? i think it would do well enough, but every one i have talked to doesnt know for shure.
a pentium M 2.0 would be like a p-4 4.0 , it just wouldnt have the HT,
Regardless, the machine should still be a worthy desktop replacement in anyones book, especially if equipped with a fast internal hard drive. (2.5" 7200RPM drives are now easy to get hold of).
Music with dinner is an insult both to the cook and the violinist.
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- KVRer
- 5 posts since 16 Jun, 2004
Hi Lord,
finding a good live setup is imho a lot easier than many ppl inhere used to state:
NOTEBOOK
Get a Centrino-Laptop with at least 1,5 Ghz instead of one of the P4 3.2 HT, otherwise you will hear the fan instead of your music. This doesn't matter too much if you want use your setup EXCLUSIVELY for live performances, but if you also plan to use your laptop for homerecording, a silent Laptop is by far the better choice. (I never have more than 65% CPU usage with Sonar 3, several VSTi and some effects).
My recommendation: IBM R40 with SXGA+ screen. Replace the 4200rpm with a Hitachi 60GB 7200rpm, give it 512 MB of RAM and you're fine.
SOUNDCARD
If you only use VSTi and don't need inputs, go with the Echo Indigo. ( http://www.echoaudio.com ).
When you like spending a bit more, the RME HammerfallDSP PCMCIA might the one for you.
The M-Audio Firewire is with no doubt a great interface, but when it comes to live performance, I'd stick with PCMCIA (smaller, no cable you might forget, less driver fuss, more stable).
KEYBOARD
I use the M-AUDIO keyboard for some months and there's nothing bad I could report. I'd recommend one with a built in MIDI-Interface (I think the Keystation has one built-in).
One last advice:
Stay away from Apple, cause many great apps for Live usage (e.g. energyXT) are only available for PC platform and Live from Ableton (the killer!) works a lot better on the PC.
Try Live with Bidule or energyXT and your favorite VSTi. Imho a great setup for live perfomances.
netzer
finding a good live setup is imho a lot easier than many ppl inhere used to state:
NOTEBOOK
Get a Centrino-Laptop with at least 1,5 Ghz instead of one of the P4 3.2 HT, otherwise you will hear the fan instead of your music. This doesn't matter too much if you want use your setup EXCLUSIVELY for live performances, but if you also plan to use your laptop for homerecording, a silent Laptop is by far the better choice. (I never have more than 65% CPU usage with Sonar 3, several VSTi and some effects).
My recommendation: IBM R40 with SXGA+ screen. Replace the 4200rpm with a Hitachi 60GB 7200rpm, give it 512 MB of RAM and you're fine.
SOUNDCARD
If you only use VSTi and don't need inputs, go with the Echo Indigo. ( http://www.echoaudio.com ).
When you like spending a bit more, the RME HammerfallDSP PCMCIA might the one for you.
The M-Audio Firewire is with no doubt a great interface, but when it comes to live performance, I'd stick with PCMCIA (smaller, no cable you might forget, less driver fuss, more stable).
KEYBOARD
I use the M-AUDIO keyboard for some months and there's nothing bad I could report. I'd recommend one with a built in MIDI-Interface (I think the Keystation has one built-in).
One last advice:
Stay away from Apple, cause many great apps for Live usage (e.g. energyXT) are only available for PC platform and Live from Ableton (the killer!) works a lot better on the PC.
Try Live with Bidule or energyXT and your favorite VSTi. Imho a great setup for live perfomances.
netzer
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- KVRist
- 99 posts since 28 Aug, 2002 from Cleveland, Ohio USA
Lord Choc Ice:
I now perform 8 shows/week with a slew of VSTi's (many Reaktor ensembles and Absynth, mostly, but also the new CS-80 and the Moog Modular as of late) and Live and Reason all running along just fine.
I do it on a $1100 iBook.
Never had a single crash or freeze or anything.
I also bring in a line from our guitar player which I warp in Live in real time, and our drummer is midi'd into my iBook to cue some oddball percussion sounds from time to time (I leave an NNXT in Reason running for him the whole show.)
It ain't no toy, that's for sure.
I now perform 8 shows/week with a slew of VSTi's (many Reaktor ensembles and Absynth, mostly, but also the new CS-80 and the Moog Modular as of late) and Live and Reason all running along just fine.
I do it on a $1100 iBook.
Never had a single crash or freeze or anything.
I also bring in a line from our guitar player which I warp in Live in real time, and our drummer is midi'd into my iBook to cue some oddball percussion sounds from time to time (I leave an NNXT in Reason running for him the whole show.)
It ain't no toy, that's for sure.
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- KVRist
- 38 posts since 22 Jun, 2004 from Maine
ah god bless you griels, i have talked to many a people, especialy ignorant teckies.
i just wanted to hear what i thought was right form looking around on the web a bunch, most people dont even have a super awsome tricked out comp.
i was thinking of getting a gate way because they have a 4 year accedental damage plan, so the laptop could get squashed spilled or dropped, just not stolen, eek. but the whole thing is going to cost about 3 grand, but ill have it for a garunteed 4 years and it should be good enough to do what i want with the programs i want, with hopefuly no glitching or drop outs >? right?
it only has 2 usb ports but i can just get a hub, and i dont plan on having too much plugged in any way as im going to get a fire wire audio interface,
or does any one know any good audio set ups? around 500 or 600? that hammers fall pci card is good, but then you still need an interface with it? if you want to plug any thing, that just makes like a super fast connection directly to your comp right?[/quote]
i just wanted to hear what i thought was right form looking around on the web a bunch, most people dont even have a super awsome tricked out comp.
i was thinking of getting a gate way because they have a 4 year accedental damage plan, so the laptop could get squashed spilled or dropped, just not stolen, eek. but the whole thing is going to cost about 3 grand, but ill have it for a garunteed 4 years and it should be good enough to do what i want with the programs i want, with hopefuly no glitching or drop outs >? right?
it only has 2 usb ports but i can just get a hub, and i dont plan on having too much plugged in any way as im going to get a fire wire audio interface,
or does any one know any good audio set ups? around 500 or 600? that hammers fall pci card is good, but then you still need an interface with it? if you want to plug any thing, that just makes like a super fast connection directly to your comp right?[/quote]
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- KVRist
- 31 posts since 12 Apr, 2003
I recommend a Sager Notebook. The manufacturer used to make them for Alienware, and may still.
You can get them from here:
http://pctorque.com/products.php
Outstanding service, guarantee and great components. If you don't like it you can return it after 30 days. I use mine live and use Chainer to mix multiple vsti's. They are not Centrino and have a very loud fan. They are not cheap, but you get quite a bit for the money.
You can get them from here:
http://pctorque.com/products.php
Outstanding service, guarantee and great components. If you don't like it you can return it after 30 days. I use mine live and use Chainer to mix multiple vsti's. They are not Centrino and have a very loud fan. They are not cheap, but you get quite a bit for the money.
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 26 posts since 20 Jun, 2004 from Norway
Since I don't want to make much fuzz around this investment, I try to find producers/webshops who provide all my needs without any later upgrades.
Alienware seems to give me a very reasonable price for a lot of power, and concerning Centrino vs. P4, I like to stick to what I'm used to. The noise will not generate any problem as far as I see it.
Alienware seems to give me a very reasonable price for a lot of power, and concerning Centrino vs. P4, I like to stick to what I'm used to. The noise will not generate any problem as far as I see it.
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 26 posts since 20 Jun, 2004 from Norway
PC Torque's Sager line also looks very interesting, especially model 5690-V.
One thing which is special for the Sagers, is the availability of a norwegian keypad layout!
Nice...
Concerning the firewire soundcards:
Will it be possible to fully bus power a soundcard by a PCMCIA 6-pin firewire card - like the "eMagic CH6000-1"?
One thing which is special for the Sagers, is the availability of a norwegian keypad layout!
Nice...Concerning the firewire soundcards:
Will it be possible to fully bus power a soundcard by a PCMCIA 6-pin firewire card - like the "eMagic CH6000-1"?
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- KVRer
- 5 posts since 16 Jun, 2004
@Lord
keep in my mind that a P4 in a Laptop is completely different from the usage in a Desktop Computer (heat, noisy fan, short battery life.)
No, I'm not a sales representative from Intel, but I had a Thinkpad G40 (P4) before my current MPC Transport T2100 (Centrino) and it's nice to have have my hands in normal temperature and no Fan running for 5 hours of use without AC.
Not to mention that the weight of app. 2,5 kg makes it a REAL portable...
But in the end, it's your choice...
@goodickin
If it MUST be a Firwire Interface, stick with the M-Audio FW410 (350-400$), or if you don't the outs, try the M-Audio Firewire Audiophile (270-300$). Unrivaled driver support for both products makes themby far the best choice.
The RME is also a nice card, but I think the price tag is above what I'd pay for it.
Another nice card if you can spare multiple outs is the Echo Indigo Series, which is currently around $200, super stable and with good driver support. But PCMCIA....
keep in my mind that a P4 in a Laptop is completely different from the usage in a Desktop Computer (heat, noisy fan, short battery life.)
No, I'm not a sales representative from Intel, but I had a Thinkpad G40 (P4) before my current MPC Transport T2100 (Centrino) and it's nice to have have my hands in normal temperature and no Fan running for 5 hours of use without AC.
Not to mention that the weight of app. 2,5 kg makes it a REAL portable...
But in the end, it's your choice...
@goodickin
If it MUST be a Firwire Interface, stick with the M-Audio FW410 (350-400$), or if you don't the outs, try the M-Audio Firewire Audiophile (270-300$). Unrivaled driver support for both products makes themby far the best choice.
The RME is also a nice card, but I think the price tag is above what I'd pay for it.
Another nice card if you can spare multiple outs is the Echo Indigo Series, which is currently around $200, super stable and with good driver support. But PCMCIA....
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 26 posts since 20 Jun, 2004 from Norway
How does the Centrino handle VSTi's compared to the P4 range?
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- KVRer
- 5 posts since 16 Jun, 2004
@Lord
Normally, you can say that a Centrino is as fast a P4 with twice the Ghz.
It's not applicable for all types of usage, but I hadn't any performance issues so far. Compared to my P4, the Laptop seems to be faster (most likely due to a faster HD, which is imho more important for performance than 100-200 Mhz).
If performance is the key, try a Dell Inspiron 8600. I don't like the Dell's design and stick with IBM due to the unrivaled quality and support, but maybe that's the best choice for you....
netzer
Normally, you can say that a Centrino is as fast a P4 with twice the Ghz.
It's not applicable for all types of usage, but I hadn't any performance issues so far. Compared to my P4, the Laptop seems to be faster (most likely due to a faster HD, which is imho more important for performance than 100-200 Mhz).
If performance is the key, try a Dell Inspiron 8600. I don't like the Dell's design and stick with IBM due to the unrivaled quality and support, but maybe that's the best choice for you....
netzer
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- KVRist
- 38 posts since 22 Jun, 2004 from Maine
sick, thanks for the tips, i wanted to hear from some one who made music with a Pm lap top. i talked to a guy from carillon audio in the states, he said that he would look into some of the people in the uk sister co. but he hasnt gotten back to me in a week or so. i dont think he likes selling lap tops 
so thanks for helping me fill in some blocks or peices or what ever
any know if its worth getting accedental damage protection? i think only dell and gateway offer it, im not sure of the chances that i will drop the comp, or have it rained/spilled on but i imagine it is higly possible, thats like an extra 300 bucks, though 4 years of protection is nice
so thanks for helping me fill in some blocks or peices or what ever
any know if its worth getting accedental damage protection? i think only dell and gateway offer it, im not sure of the chances that i will drop the comp, or have it rained/spilled on but i imagine it is higly possible, thats like an extra 300 bucks, though 4 years of protection is nice