KVR Audio

cowby · Post by **cowby** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 6:43 am

Hi, still using Reason 5...

May be I didn't deep dive into its new features but the only thing they ‎Emphasize were, UI, workflow and Drop-n-Drop. What are they Wow factors that I've missed ?

Thanks for sharing and cheers!
Cowby

KarmaShaman · Post by **KarmaShaman** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 7:12 am

There's plenty of WOW in the six marketing videos released. You can be TOLD that R8 is the greatest thing since the moon landing; how the workflow improvements will mean R8 almost writes songs itself; how the drag & drop feature is up there with curing cancer as far as technological advancements go....

Or you could read the feedback from the majority of early adopters that suggest:

1. Feature to value ratio is the worst in Propellerhead history

2. The sequencer/rack/mix windows are not easily moved between monitors

3. The browser is affixed to the sequencer only, forcing users to adapt to a single method of working

4. Previewing loops is not synced to project BPM

5. Patch browsing via browser is no longer possible.

I'm sure there are a slew of other 'improvements' and the usual wide eyed and bushy tailed suspects will chime in to tell you how wonderful the release is ( the power of brand loyalty and a slick marketing campaign targets such unfortunates).

Or you could think for yourself and read all about the use reception at the propellerhead forum. Better yet, download the demo and give it a spin.

A warning... in another wise move, the primary selling point in the promos was the softube amps. Inexplicably these cannot be trialled ! So you will have to take their word for it as to how awesome they are.

gamecat666 · Post by **gamecat666** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 9:28 am

since 8 seems to be a very minor release, perhaps the question should be 'what would i get by upgrading 5 to 8'
which would mean all the stuff thats been in 6+7 also.

EnochLight · Post by **EnochLight** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:49 pm

cowby wrote:Hi, still using Reason 5...

May be I didn't deep dive into its new features but the only thing they ‎Emphasize were, UI, workflow and Drop-n-Drop. What are they Wow factors that I've missed ?

Thanks for sharing and cheers!
Cowby

If you're on Reason 5, then the differences would be massive and a huge improvement - if Reason is your primary work environment. If it's not, then I'd stick to 5 and just ReWire.

For anyone working mostly in Reason, from version 5 you get:

Audio recording
New SSL mixer with spectral EQ interface for SSL EQ
Several new plugins (RE's and otherwise), although two of them (Line6) will no longer be included in future versions by 2016
Audio quantize and REX (ReCycle) file creation
Access to (propriety) 3rd party plugins
Updated (and arguably) better GUI in transport and sequencer
MIDI/clip editing improvements
Non-modal browser, drag and drop, etc

All for the same price as the upgrade from the last version.

But yeah, if your main DAW is something you ReWire into, then you already have access to the majority of this stuff.

Tronam · Post by **Tronam** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 6:18 pm

KarmaShaman wrote: A warning... in another wise move, the primary selling point in the promos was the softube amps. Inexplicably these cannot be trialled ! So you will have to take their word for it as to how awesome they are.

Anyone running R6 or later can though. Have you trialled the Softube amps yet? If so, what do you think so far?

JonSolo · Post by **JonSolo** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 7:05 pm

Wow that it was not a free upgrade from 7.1. Or even a $49.95 upgrade (which I would have gladly paid).

Jon

Edit- I am sorry that was not helpful. If you are coming from 5, and as mentioned, Reason is your principle DAW, get it. Don't even ask. Just get it. The changes in the three version since make it worth $129.

trimph1 · Post by **trimph1** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 7:38 pm

Tronam wrote:
KarmaShaman wrote: A warning... in another wise move, the primary selling point in the promos was the softube amps. Inexplicably these cannot be trialled ! So you will have to take their word for it as to how awesome they are.
Anyone running R6 or later can though. Have you trialled the Softube amps yet? If so, what do you think so far?

I have them here, I have ended up getting R8 and they are pretty good. Mind, I still need to dig into them more

KarmaShaman · Post by **KarmaShaman** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 7:56 pm

Tronam wrote:
KarmaShaman wrote: A warning... in another wise move, the primary selling point in the promos was the softube amps. Inexplicably these cannot be trialled ! So you will have to take their word for it as to how awesome they are.
Anyone running R6 or later can though. Have you trialled the Softube amps yet? If so, what do you think so far?

I jave a rule not to trial RE's unless it is likely I am going to buy them shortly thereafter. And despite being a guitarist, I have no plans to buy the Softube amps (I'm seriously considering buying the Eleven rack hardware) outside of an upgrade... so maybe version 9 or 10. I would also like to see if there is an integration of the softube as an auto-relace for the Line6 so all of my ReFills aren't crippled by Propellerhead's changes.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:06 pm

KarmaShaman wrote:There's plenty of WOW in the six marketing videos released. You can be TOLD that R8 is the greatest thing since the moon landing

Funnily, the people expecting a huge WOW factor in every new release are actually the reason they produce vids like that.

I wonder, was there a huge wow factor in version 2 compared to version 1? On version 3 compared to version 2.5? Or is it just of late that we expect the next super duper WOW ROFLMAO thing in every new release? Are we too spoiled, too bored, too fed up with everything? Time to make more music and care less about the tools IMO. Although that has pretty much become a cliché slogan around here. Well, for a reason i guess.

softska · Post by **softska** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:13 pm

KarmaShaman wrote: I jave a rule not to trial RE's unless it is likely I am going to buy them shortly thereafter. And despite being a guitarist, I have no plans to buy the Softube amps (I'm seriously considering buying the Eleven rack hardware) outside of an upgrade... so maybe version 9 or 10. I would also like to see if there is an integration of the softube as an auto-relace for the Line6 so all of my ReFills aren't crippled by Propellerhead's changes.

I do not know for sure, but the fact they are being sold in their shop makes me think they may not be included in future ver. Which probably will be stupid, but certainly can happen. Refill are probably dead though, they sound nothing similar.

May be I didn't deep dive into its new features but the only thing they ‎Emphasize were, UI, workflow and Drop-n-Drop. What are they Wow factors that I've missed ?

Nothing, congrat!

Personally I have a lot of trouble going back since Kong/DrRex is what I use 80% of the time, but otherwise don't see why you'll want to spring for it.

trimph1 · Post by **trimph1** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:15 pm

chk071 wrote:
KarmaShaman wrote:There's plenty of WOW in the six marketing videos released. You can be TOLD that R8 is the greatest thing since the moon landing
Funnily, the people expecting a huge WOW factor in every new release are actually the reason they produce vids like that. I wonder, was there a huge wow factor in version 2 compared to version 1? On version 3 compared to version 2.5? Or is it just of late that we expect the next super duper WOW ROFLMAO thing in every new release? Are we too spoiled, too bored, too fed up with everything? Time to make more music and care less about the tools IMO. Although that has pretty much become a cliché slogan around here. Well, for a reason i guess.

I think chk071 hit the nail on the head there. And marketing men know this too well.

It may be the driving force behind all the bitterness and angst of late.

Consider. Back in the day when you had to pay big bucks for renting recording time, or, you had, in my case, a Wollensack reel to reel and were editing using a razor blade...

Tronam · Post by **Tronam** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:27 pm

KarmaShaman wrote:
Tronam wrote:
KarmaShaman wrote: A warning... in another wise move, the primary selling point in the promos was the softube amps. Inexplicably these cannot be trialled ! So you will have to take their word for it as to how awesome they are.
Anyone running R6 or later can though. Have you trialled the Softube amps yet? If so, what do you think so far?
I jave a rule not to trial RE's unless it is likely I am going to buy them shortly thereafter. And despite being a guitarist, I have no plans to buy the Softube amps (I'm seriously considering buying the Eleven rack hardware) outside of an upgrade... so maybe version 9 or 10. I would also like to see if there is an integration of the softube as an auto-relace for the Line6 so all of my ReFills aren't crippled by Propellerhead's changes.

Interesting rule. How do you know if you're likely to buy them without trying them out first?

I doubt there will be an auto-replace for Line6, but maybe they'll figure out some kind of automated approximation in the future. Hopefully over the next 2 years the Refill devs will release updates that swap them out. In the meantime I'd like to see Yamaha develop rack extension versions of those amps; It's their tech. Then again, why would they? They own Steinberg, Cubase and Line6 now. This situation should prove to be a good lesson for Propellerhead to avoid any technology partnerships in the future, because business relationships can and do change. The Line6 amps were unique in that regard. There's an amazing thread in the old archived PH forums back in 2009 talking about this and they came really close to predicting this scenario even then.

Tronam · Post by **Tronam** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:29 pm

softska wrote:I do not know for sure, but the fact they are being sold in their shop makes me think they may not be included in future ver. Which probably will be stupid, but certainly can happen.

It's been confirmed that the Softube amps will be included with all future versions of Reason.

TheNickC · Post by **TheNickC** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:35 pm

chk071 wrote:Funnily, the people expecting a huge WOW factor in every new release are actually the reason they produce vids like that.

Or do people expect it because companies like Propellerhead and Apple market themselves in this way? The end result is ultimately that the people that buy in become fanatical while many become deeply skeptical of what is otherwise a pretty good product. Being realistic, there's no reason to be THAT upset over this upgrade. You can skip it and whenever you do upgrade it will still cost the same(probably). And if things like no patch preview are so universally hated, there's a good chance it will change by then. I think people become agitated with the auto-fellatio marketing BS as much as anything to do with the actual products, no one wants to hear about how drag and drop and a docked browser are the biggest changes ever in 2014. The Line 6 thing also ties into it, the props have always marketed their product as being the most solid, efficient, backwards compatible thing out there that "just works". Well now a lot of past projects and refills are about to not work, people take notice when there is a big disconnect between your words and what you're actually doing. Wonder if they learned from that and have a more favorable contract with Softube? Because if that becomes prohibitively expensive in the future...these are the kinds of things that you run into the more you involve external developers, RE's are one thing but actually including them as part of the core program may not be wise

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:47 pm

TheNickC wrote:
chk071 wrote:Funnily, the people expecting a huge WOW factor in every new release are actually the reason they produce vids like that.
Or do people expect it because companies like Propellerhead and Apple market themselves in this way?

Kind of a chicken <-> egg thing. Just like with ads, the companies drove it to extremes i guess, and there's no way back now. But then, why is there such a reception to it? Especially as, when you expect too much, you will be disapointed, if the product doesn't live up to it, which it surely doesn't, if you expect something totally awesome.

Saying that, of course i'm not immune to all of that too. After all it's the reason i browse this site every day, always on the outlook for something new and cool.

But i don't expect the marketing slogans to be the final truth, i rather take them for what they are, maybe that's the difference.

Give me the WoW factors of Reason 8, pls