KVR Audio

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:15 am

MorpherX wrote:All what is coming from Mr. Palm in the last years regarding Wavetable-Synths is in real nothing news.
Old stuff in new clothes.
Beside this, all this offered products are CR- or Dongle-Ware and this is a absolute no-go for serious sound-designers, composers and musicans and causes very, very big problems in long term.
Waldorf-Palm Wavetable-Synth are the past, the future lies in innovative and dongle-free VSTis like "SERUM".

Without Mr. Palm and Waldorf something like Wavetable synths would not even exist and Waldorf is one of the few companies that still provides hardware Wavetable synths like the Blofeld.

Your comment is also funny as AFAIK you told that you own a real PPG Wave hardware synth. If you really think that the current products of Mr. Palm are no improvements i do not agree with you. Wavegenerator had a Wavetable editor long before Serum or Codex were released and there is also a compatible wavetable format in the free Audio Term wavetable editor.
Also things like the 3D wavetable display in Serum were copied from Waldorf Nave and even from the old Waveterm units for the PPG Wave 2.x synth.

Anyway at the same time i also love the PPG Wave 3.V synth which BTW was created by Waldorf and not by Mr. Palm while he helped with beta testing and providing new wavetables and factory patches.

Concerning Waldorf i am of course a bit biased, not only because i am more or less working for them now (as the Waldorf Beta forum manager, Beta tester and sound designer).

Of course the new PPG synth will also sound like a PPG synth and if you don't like that the synth is maybe not for you.

jacqueslacouth · Post by **jacqueslacouth** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:19 am

MorpherX wrote:
Beside this, all this offered products are CR- or Dongle-Ware and this is a absolute no-go for serious sound-designers, composers and musicans and causes very, very big problems in long term.

What a load of bollox!

ftech · Post by **ftech** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:40 am

MorpherX wrote:All what is coming from Mr. Palm in the last years regarding Wavetable-Synths is in real nothing news.
Old stuff in new clothes.
Beside this, all this offered products are CR- or Dongle-Ware and this is a absolute no-go for serious sound-designers, composers and musicans and causes very, very big problems in long term.
Waldorf-Palm Wavetable-Synth are the past, the future lies in innovative and dongle-free VSTis like "SERUM".

What's that? You're serious??

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 7:51 am

jacqueslacouth wrote:
MorpherX wrote:
Beside this, all this offered products are CR- or Dongle-Ware and this is a absolute no-go for serious sound-designers, composers and musicans and causes very, very big problems in long term.
What a load of bollox!

Indeed. Some people still do not understand that the newer products from PPG and Waldorf are from two different companies/developers and the fact that Mr. Palm helped during the Betatest of PPG Wave 3.V does not change this (actually this seemed to be before he released his recent software synths).

PPG products indeed use CR while some Waldorf Products use the eLicenser protection (either with an USB dongle or with a soft elicenser license stored at your HD). The current Waldorf Edition uses a simple serial protection BTW (since around 2011) and those who had the old CD ptotected version could request a new serial.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:16 am

Ingonator wrote:
MorpherX wrote:All what is coming from Mr. Palm in the last years regarding Wavetable-Synths is in real nothing news.
Old stuff in new clothes.
Beside this, all this offered products are CR- or Dongle-Ware and this is a absolute no-go for serious sound-designers, composers and musicans and causes very, very big problems in long term.
Waldorf-Palm Wavetable-Synth are the past, the future lies in innovative and dongle-free VSTis like "SERUM".
Your comment is also funny as AFAIK you told that you own a real PPG Wave hardware synth. If you really think that the current products of Mr. Palm are no improvements i do not agree with you. Wavegenerator had a Wavetable editor long before Serum or Codex were released and there is also a compatible wavetable format in the free Audio Term wavetable editor.
Also things like the 3D wavetable display in Serum were copied from Waldorf Nave and even from the old Waveterm units for the PPG Wave 2.x synth.

Too bad that Waldorf and Wolfgang Palm seem to be losing the race in what concerns wavetable synths. I am a longterm fan of Waldorf (I have a Microwave and a Microwave II). After the demise of Microwave II/XT, Waldorf turned itself more to VA oriented synths. When they made the come back, and launched Blofeld and Largo (and later PPG Wave 3.V) I talked with Wolfram Franke about the possibility of having a wavetable editor (and/or the Waveterm emulator, since it was always my opinion that a PPG emulation cannot be complete without the Waveterm), and he told me they were thinking about it, BUT as an add-on product. Nothing was launched in that field, and in the meanwhile, newcomers like Xfer came in and showed how things should have been done.

It seems like Waldorf neglected the will people have to edit wavetables. I remembre when I asked about Waveterm some people telling that "there are many wavetables available in PPG Wave 3.V, and Wolfgang have even created more". Clearly, there is no such thing as "many wavetables already", as the developers of Serum and Codex understood.

Audio-Term is a wavetable editor, and it is great (glad to have that) but it is not from Waldorf nor from Wolfgang Palm. Nave may have the 3D wavetable display (but not the editor, I presume?), however, Nave is just for iOS. Sadly, Mr. Palm chose iOS as his main platform, and he may very well have lost this race in the real computers platform, now that we have two strong contenders like Serum and Codex in the field.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:20 am

Again, a duplication caused by hitting the wrong button.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:25 am

As long as there are people liking what Waldorf/mr. Palm are doing, they haven't lost the "race". I don't think they even care about the "race", they just care to get their ideas and synths out to the people and have them at it.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:30 am

EvilDragon wrote:As long as there are people liking what Waldorf/mr. Palm are doing, they haven't lost the "race". I don't think they even care about the "race", they just care to get their ideas and synths out to the people and have them at it.

This is a race, wanting or not. To "get their ideas and synths out to the people and have them at it" there has to be people available, and in a market currently becoming crowded like the wavetable based synths, it will be much more difficult.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:33 am

Well, as usual people will decide. Serum or Codex won't give you the "Waldorf sound". People looking for that will always go to Waldorf.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:32 am

EvilDragon wrote:Well, as usual people will decide. Serum or Codex won't give you the "Waldorf sound". People looking for that will always go to Waldorf.

I agree. I got a bunch of different wavetable synths like e.g. this new synth, PPG Wavegenerator, PPG Wave 3.V Largo, DUNE 2, Codex etc. and they all have either a different sound or different features.
I don't have the feeling that any of the synths i mentioned are "redundant" due to owning some newer synths like e.g. DUNE 2 and Codex.

Concerning the new synth from Mr. Palm of course it will still sound like a PPG synth and there is nothing bad about that. Besides that it seems to include at least two interesting features not included with other wavetable synths in the same way (and as alraedy mentioned wavetables from Wavegenerator will be compatible).

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:10 pm

The release of the new PPG synth should not take too long now if everything works as expected. There is no fixed date yet.

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:20 pm

Why are people dismissing this before any kind of hint of a sound example?

layzer · Post by **layzer** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:35 pm

nineofkings wrote:Why are people dismissing this before any kind of hint of a sound example?

because they are psychics

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:47 pm

nineofkings wrote:Why are people dismissing this before any kind of hint of a sound example?

Because some people seem to think that with Serum being released there is no more need for other wavetable synths which of course is totally wrong IMO (for several reasons that i already tried to explain).

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Fri Oct 17, 2014 3:53 pm

Ingonator wrote:Because some people seem to think that with Serum being released there is no more need for other wavetable synths which of course is totally wrong IMO (for several reasons that i already tried to explain).

+1

So what if 3 wavetable synths gets released in the same month.

Nobody complains about too many VA plugs

Wolfgang Palm WaveMapper 2 is out for PC and MAC