Now Hive is here, is it RIP Sylenth?

[fluffy_little_something]

That's too much flexibility for my taste I have one synth where I can choose from 10 or so curves for every envelope generator. Add to that the timescale slider and you are bound to spend hours tweaking envelopes

So at the end of the day I almost always use exponential as fiddling with curves and timescales simply takes too much of my time. I prefer good general-purpose envelopes which take only a few minutes to set right.

[hakey]

RIP Sylenth? Not unless Hive can do this:

ARP 303 Saw

then let's create it in HIVE

I've had a go, but it's difficult deconstructing Sylenth patches from the demo, what with some of the modulation amounts being hidden.

I reckon it should be possible to get fairly close to sound in the above clip using Hive (though probably not close enough to satisfy the zealots).

[trimph1]

RIP Sylenth? Not unless Hive can do this:

ARP 303 Saw

then let's create it in HIVE

I've had a go, but it's difficult deconstructing Sylenth patches from the demo, what with some of the modulation amounts being hidden.

I reckon it should be possible to get fairly close to sound in the above clip using Hive (though probably not close enough to satisfy the zealots).

I've tried the same but no go here..

[pdxindy]

That's too much flexibility for my taste I have one synth where I can choose from 10 or so curves for every envelope generator. Add to that the timescale slider and you are bound to spend hours tweaking envelopes

So at the end of the day I almost always use exponential as fiddling with curves and timescales simply takes too much of my time. I prefer good general-purpose envelopes which take only a few minutes to set right.

I don't spend much time 'fiddling' cause I learn what settings do what... Plus in Hive you can save module presets and recall them so no need to tweak at all. Save a 'sharp pluck', 'round pluck' etc.

Hive has good general purpose envelopes and since the slope functionality is tucked away in the Mod Matrix, it is easy to just not use it if someone prefers simplicity.

Me, I like some control over env slope because in real world sounds there are lots of different shapes to different sounds. A synth that has no slope control starts to bug me after a while cause every sound has the same shape.

And for me, I especially like to add variability so a bit of randomization/velocity/key follow to the curve sounds great to me and helps alleviate a repetitive mechanical sound.

[fluffy_little_something]

Well, synths didn't sound boring 30 to 40 years ago, and they didn't have all that curve variety. Some did not even have a release knob

And in the mix most of those subtle differences get lost anyway...

[pdxindy]

Well, synths didn't sound boring 30 to 40 years ago, and they didn't have all that curve variety. Some did not even have a release knob

Analog synths have their own lovely and unpredictable character. It is the nature of real things whereas digital is exactly predictable... then devs go to great lengths to add non-linear responses that mimic real circuits (see Diva)

[mutantdog]

RIP Sylenth? Not unless Hive can do this:

ARP 303 Saw

then let's create it in HIVE

I had a go but couldn't really get it to sound close. In the end i just tinkered around and made a variant on it. http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/download/file.php?id=2447

[fluffy_little_something]

I don't think the unpredictable character was really that important, it was not that unpredictable, anyway, except tuning issues, which however you won't hear on records.
Frankly, I think the key was that they made better use of synths back then, which also means more sparse use of synths. Often there were just 1 to 3 synths sounds in a song, while the rest was all real instruments, be it acoustic, be it electric. So synths were special as they made sounds that the familiar real instruments could not make. But today synths are way too present in music, so people feel like they need to make ever more spectacular and complex patches to impress. In the past a simple Oberheim pad was often enough to do the trick, and those simple sound still appeal if they are embedded in good music.

[Caine123]

I don't think the unpredictable character was really that important, it was not that unpredictable, anyway, except tuning issues, which however you won't hear on records.
Frankly, I think the key was that they made better use of synths back then, which also means more sparse use of synths. Often there were just 1 to 3 synths sounds in a song, while the rest was all real instruments, be it acoustic, be it electric. So synths were special as they made sounds that the familiar real instruments could not make. But today synths are way too present in music, so people feel like they need to make ever more spectacular and complex patches to impress. In the past a simple Oberheim pad was often enough to do the trick, and those simple sound still appeal if they are embedded in good music.

well not really sometimes, or depends what you mean, 70s? because in the 80s it all started much much more to get fully synth and im a geek for only synthmusic, so the comment is not really logic . it depends all on taste! since a kid i was so attached to synthstuff i dunno why, it is also when people say real instruments sound better, what is better? i sometimes or depends on the song prefer synthharps, synthbells etc. etc. much more.
or hollywood movies with orchestrated music or games where i read people saying "with the orchestra it sounds so much more professional" im sitting here (like diablo 3) and say what a whack soundtrack preferring the mixed score with synths and orchestra much more

[Chris-S]

http://chris-s.bplaced.net/div/hive_acid.mp3


it's the acidity patch with some distortion.

[pdxindy]

I don't think the unpredictable character was really that important, it was not that unpredictable, anyway,

There are all sorts of lovely non-linear responses... unexpected tonalities as you tweak the sound.

[fluffy_little_something]

Yes, definitely a matter of taste. I grew up listening to Grover Washington Jr., Maze, Azymuth, etc.
So, I am all into that mix of about 80% real instruments and 20% synths. While there are some great synth bass lines, nothing comes close to the sound of an electric bass. Or the sound of George Benson's guitar. Or the sound of Richard Tee's Rhodes.

[fluffy_little_something]

I don't think the unpredictable character was really that important, it was not that unpredictable, anyway,

There are all sorts of lovely non-linear responses... unexpected tonalities as you tweak the sound.

Yes, but most of that gets lost in the mix. Basically you only hear those things during some solos or while programming patches...
That is why good musicians can play their songs on almost any equipment you throw at them.

[Trancit]

Perhaps not on topic, but because it´s about a synth, which is not finaly developed, I would like to bring this up:

What I always missed in most synth filters, is the ability of having a kind of volume compensation (not compensation of high resonance, which on the other hand would be nice and I´ve seen this first time in Logic 5 with the internal instruments and the "Fat Mode" of their filters...this was when???? 2000 or 2001) ...

If we are talking about Unison synths, we talk as well about instruments used 95% in electronic music, which means music with more or less no "dynamic"... a music, which is nearly all the time "on top" regarding the loudness...

On the other hand, it´s a kind of music, which is based heavily on mostly LP modulated/automated sounds/patches...

Now my question: why on earth is there nearly no virtuell instrument, which offers (at least the option) a LP filter, which compensates the volume/loudness loss, while the filter is closing...
I know why this happens (the volume loss), but I know as well how much the volume loss of often 3-4db (perhaps sometimes more) can ruin the punch and power of a main sound, while the filter closes and I know, what PITA it can be to create a volume automation to compensate this manualy, because this volume loss is mostly not linear...

I don´t know, why I nearly never read about this topic, but I personaly don´t like LP filters, which loose too much gain...

[fluffy_little_something]

I suppose that is what the amp envelope decay and sustain controls are there for
And if you change the cutoff frequency with an lfo, you might use another lfo which does exactly the opposite for the volume, i.e. same rate and phase for both, but inverted amount.