SMF vs GM midi files

[Cole1012]

I'm used to using GM drum loops. Some of the midi drum loop products I've been looking at say they are in the format SMF (Standard Midi File) but they don't list GM. Are these the same thing? Would an SMF file work like a GM file in a program like Steven Slate Drums that's mapped for GM?

[chris.r]

SMF is a format to write midi messages to a file, so instruments can write and read them, you have format 1 and 0.
GM organizes and unifies those communicates (midi messages) into logical standard for more unity.
You can expect SMF to be GM compatible but that is'nt a must.
Sorry for weak language. Hope this helps.

[pljones]

SMF - standard MIDI file - is just that: a standard for files containing MIDI events.

GM - General MIDI - is a description of what those events mean, that is, how a MIDI device that is "GM compatible" should behave when it receives a MIDI event.

The two are independent.

As Chris.r says, you would likely expect music contained in SMF format to expect the target sound set to be GM compatible.

[fmr]

As Chris.r says, you would likely expect music contained in SMF format to expect the target sound set to be GM compatible.

What? Why? Standard MIDI files are just MIDI sequences that can be ported from one sequence to the other, and can be used, for example, to rebuild a session created in one DAW in another DAW, since the OMF/AMF just ports the áudio.

GM isn't in any way related to SMF, since GM is basically a sound map and a definition of some MIDI Continuous Control Messages. This definition was very basic in the first GM (just 128 sounds and six drum maps, plus like CC messages for expression, volume, panorama, and little else, butr then appeared GS (an expanded norm by Roland), XG (an even more expanded norm by Yamaha), and later appeared a GM2 norm, which, although not as comprehensive as XG, expanded the original GM norm a lot, with several additions to the original GM sound map, and many more CC messages.

The aim of GM (and GM2) was that MIDI files created for a certain sound would sound basically the same no matter what hardware sound module was used, as long as that sound modulke was compatible with the norm. For that, all sound modules followed the same sound map, which meant that, if we use a piano for a certain track, we will always get a piano, no matter what sound module we used. The same for strings, bass, guitars, etc. Drums were always recorded on channel 10, and we also had several drum kits to choose from.

Standard MIDI files, OTOH, are just plain MIDI sequence information (you can have all channels embedded in one single track - type 0 - or have tracks for each channel - type 1). SMF get whatever you record, and you can open them on any host that's compatible with them (all of the clasic DAWs that were born in the MIDI era are compatible, like Cubase, Logic, Cakewalk, Digital Performer, even Pro Tools, and pretty much all of the modern are too, but those you have to check).

However, the fact that you can "read" them mens nothing, since, because they are "blind", you have to address the tracks to the right device, or perform some editing to get the results you want.

Keep in mind that MIDI has no sound in it - it's just a stream of data. What you get from it depends on what sound source you input that data to. That's why GM was created - nothing to do with SMF, which was created much earlier.

[fmr]

IGNORE - double post

[fmr]

I'm used to using GM drum loops. Some of the midi drum loop products I've been looking at say they are in the format SMF (Standard Midi File) but they don't list GM. Are these the same thing? Would an SMF file work like a GM file in a program like Steven Slate Drums that's mapped for GM?

To answer directly to your question:
1. The fact they are Standard MIDI files means they can be played in whatever DAW (sequencer) supports that format, which, as I said, means pretty much ANY.
2. If they are mapped accordingly to GM drum map, is something that only after opening it can be said, but if they were created recently, there is a strong chance they are mapped accordingly to GM, because right now basically any drum instrument is mapped that way. You can't be 100% sure, though.

[pljones]

As Chris.r says, you would likely expect music contained in SMF format to expect the target sound set to be GM compatible.

What? Why? Standard MIDI files are just MIDI sequences that can be ported from one sequence to the other, and can be used, for example, to rebuild a session created in one DAW in another DAW, since the OMF/AMF just ports the áudio.

Like I said, the two are independent. Go count all the SMF files on the internet in total and those that don't contain data targeted at a GM sound set and then come back with the figures that show you would expect something other than what Chris.r and I said.

[fmr]

As Chris.r says, you would likely expect music contained in SMF format to expect the target sound set to be GM compatible.

What? Why? Standard MIDI files are just MIDI sequences that can be ported from one sequence to the other, and can be used, for example, to rebuild a session created in one DAW in another DAW, since the OMF/AMF just ports the áudio.

Like I said, the two are independent. Go count all the SMF files on the internet in total and those that don't contain data targeted at a GM sound set and then come back with the figures that show you would expect something other than what Chris.r and I said.

There are countless ones that are targeted specifically for GS (probably more than for GM), and also many for XG. Those "can be played" in GM (the XG ones sometimes can't, because they can have drums in any channel), but are not 100% compatible, nor do they sound the same.

Anyway, it's just statistics - The point is that SMF is one thing, and GM is another. One is a sequence format and the other is a sound map format. Totally unrelated.

[chris.r]

Cole1012 you can look for software that will enable you to edit midi data and so you can easily customize midi files to your needs if they don't match. It's easy like moving drum instrument from one note to another, few minutes of learning and work. That way you can adapt any midi drums to any instrument. Have no worry, go buy the midi files if you like them

[pljones]

As Chris.r says, you would likely expect music contained in SMF format to expect the target sound set to be GM compatible.

What? Why? Standard MIDI files are just MIDI sequences that can be ported from one sequence to the other, and can be used, for example, to rebuild a session created in one DAW in another DAW, since the OMF/AMF just ports the áudio.

Like I said, the two are independent. Go count all the SMF files on the internet in total and those that don't contain data targeted at a GM sound set and then come back with the figures that show you would expect something other than what Chris.r and I said.

There are countless ones that are targeted specifically for GS (probably more than for GM), and also many for XG. Those "can be played" in GM (the XG ones sometimes can't, because they can have drums in any channel), but are not 100% compatible, nor do they sound the same.

Anyway, it's just statistics - The point is that SMF is one thing, and GM is another. One is a sequence format and the other is a sound map format. Totally unrelated.

You're probably right about GS/XG targets, I'll admit.

Both GS and XG are supersets of GM. A GS device is a GM device. An XG device is a GM device.

You can keep agreeing about SMF and GM addressing two independent issues, though.

[chris.r]

GM is supposed to be downward compatible with XG/GS, sometimes XG uses additional drum part usually at midi channel 11.