Introducing the new SONAR: New lineup, new features, plus membership

[fmr]

you pay for a year-long block in advance, or you pay a month at a time over sequential 12-month blocks. if you pay for less than a full 12-month block by the second method, you revert back to how things were before you started paying for that block. ie if you paid monthly for 18 months, you'd lose theprevious 6 months of extra stuff, but keep the first year's.

FTFY

FTBBYW. Fixed that back, because you're wrong.

months 13 to 18 are in the second block. Stop paying at month 18 and your version reverts to the capabilities fo the version as it was at the end of month 12, ie in month 18 you lose the previous 6 months worth of features. you never got the functionality from the last 6 months of your block (months 19 to 24), so you cant lose the last 6 months functionality.

So, if you pay 18 months and then cease payment, you keep the first 12 months and bug fixes/improvements, but lose the last 6 months. Where am I wrong?

[lfm]

Basically if there's a critical bug at the end of your subscription, you're screwed.

for the definition of screwed which equates to 'same as you would be for any software where a bug gets fixed in the version after you buy it'

The difference with other DAW is that your subscription can end and you cannot get that minor 1.22 version that fix bugs in 1.2 .

Other DAW will at least make that 1.22 version available to all customer of version 1.

That would be the case unless vendor supplied a payable version instead of that bugfix.

I never saw such an agreement like Avid now claims is their policy that bugfixes always are available to everybody - that one would separate releases of bugs for years to come - and separate updates for upgraded features.

Maybe it exist - but I never saw it - for any software, but Windows. And Cubase Elements had a maintenance release of Elements 7.08 just recently after Cubase Pro/Artist 8 was announced - but they are really different products, although with similarities.

If a new dotted release that is payable - then pay to get the goods. Did Cubase release maintenance stuff on 7.0x when 7.5 was released? Will there be 7.5.x maintenance now that C8 is released?

Many stay by annual upgrades to keep money flow going - but new subscription model do keep money flow and users are not stuck to shop at a certain time of year to get the best value for money.

Cakes policy is rather gentle as I see it. Did we ever in history see a maintenance release of previous version after a new major version arrived - I never saw it?
It's usually within 3-4 months after release they had maintenance - the rest they skipped to possibly next major release or never bothered. I held back on updates of Sonar 4 for 5 years since bugs were not fixed even in new major releases - but that was their loss then, me not upgrading. And we still can make a statement by not renewing subscription to tell - I'm not happy.

So the golden rule for me came by - never make yourself dependent on a daw - have all your tools/plugins 3rd party - and you can switch daw with less penalty and not having to learn new EQ's or compressors etc and what they do to your sound.

[fmr]

Steinberg already released version 8 of Cubase, but still announced a new 7.5.4 version to be released specifically to cover compatibility with OS X 10.10 - free to all 7.5 users.

[whyterabbyt]

You miss the point. If they didn't release version 2 yet and have 1.22 version to fix critical bug instead, then you're screwed if you don't have subscription.

I doidnt miss the point, you're just confusing yourself. There is no V2 or V1 any more. The software that does have V2 and V1 doesnt have subscriptions.

If you have a subscription for this, and your subscription doesnt entitle you to a newer version with the bugfix, then you're in exactly the same position as when you have a versioned software, and the bugfix is in the next version you don have.

The effect is the same. The only change is when this potentially occurs. In this subscription model it has changed from being dependent on the version number to your annual 'anniversary'. It is in fact exactly equivalent, regarding bugfixes, to your DAW getting a new version exactly every 12 months.





Your 'issue' (is it just academic, btw, or do you actually own Sonar?) is a conflation of two things; a bugfix that you might not get, versus when you ge

Read my previous post, they mention explicitly about fixes not covered if you're not subscribed.

Bug fixes and minor version update is free with any other DAW, before the release of major update.[/quote]

[whyterabbyt]

you pay for a year-long block in advance, or you pay a month at a time over sequential 12-month blocks. if you pay for less than a full 12-month block by the second method, you revert back to how things were before you started paying for that block. ie if you paid monthly for 18 months, you'd lose theprevious 6 months of extra stuff, but keep the first year's.

FTFY

FTBBYW. Fixed that back, because you're wrong.

months 13 to 18 are in the second block. Stop paying at month 18 and your version reverts to the capabilities fo the version as it was at the end of month 12, ie in month 18 you lose the previous 6 months worth of features. you never got the functionality from the last 6 months of your block (months 19 to 24), so you cant lose the last 6 months functionality.

So, if you pay 18 months and then cease payment, you keep the first 12 months and bug fixes/improvements, but lose the last 6 months. Where am I wrong?

Do you actually not know what the word 'previous' means?

[xamido]

I own Sonar X3, and it's a buggy pile of poo.

Basically you will not get bug fixes if you're not subscribed. That's the main point here. Those minor bug fixes that's usually free in other DAW is now paid for.

This is a DAW that's notorious for being buggy and now they want people to pay annually for bug fixes? Really?

[Burillo]

i think it's a difference in terminology, you're not actually disagreeing on anything. it's just that whyterabbit refers to "last six months" as months 18-24, while fmr refers to "last six months" as in "last six months of his 18-month ownership", as in months 12-18.

[whyterabbyt]

Basically you will not get bug fixes if you're not subscribed. That's the main point here. Those minor bug fixes that's usually free in other DAW is now paid for.

In any other DAW you will not get some bug fixes if you dont buy the next version. That's the main point here.
The only difference is that you want to say 'Oh if I only paid for 4 months usage instead of 12, I should still be entitled to the bugfixes in the next full version anyway'

[fmr]

So, if you pay 18 months and then cease payment, you keep the first 12 months of bug fixes/improvements, but lose the last 6 months. Where am I wrong?

Do you actually not know what the word 'previous' means?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/previous
adjective: coming or occurring before something else; prior.

[whyterabbyt]

i think it's a difference in terminology, you're not actually disagreeing on anything. it's just that whyterabbit refers to "last six months" as months 18-24, while fmr refers to "last six months" as in "last six months of his 18-month ownership", as in months 12-18.

Almost but not quite. I specifically didnt use 'last 6 months' in the first place, I used 'previous 6 months'. That's because, as you point out, 'last 6 months' is ambiguous unless you qualify it, but 'previous 6 months' is not.
The irony is that he claimed to have fixed my post by substituting the ambiguity of 'last' for my accuracte 'previous' and then justified it because 'last' can potentially mean 'previous' if properly contextualised.

[whyterabbyt]

So, if you pay 18 months and then cease payment, you keep the first 12 months of bug fixes/improvements, but lose the last 6 months. Where am I wrong?

Do you actually not know what the word 'previous' means?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/previous
adjective: coming or occurring before something else; prior.

And if you stop paying at month 18 out of 24 months, the 'previous' 6 months to that are only ever going to be months 12-18, while the 'last' 6 months can be either '12-18' OR '19-24' depending on context. The use of 'previous' did not need fixed, especially not by the use of 'last' without a context.

[el-bo (formerly ebow)]

Basically you will not get bug fixes if you're not subscribed. That's the main point here. Those minor bug fixes that's usually free in other DAW is now paid for.

In any other DAW you will not get some bug fixes if you dont buy the next version. That's the main point here.
The only difference is that you want to say 'Oh if I only paid for 4 months usage instead of 12, I should still be entitled to the bugfixes in the next full version anyway'

actually, i think he is alluding to the fact that the 'normal' way of point releases coming free between major releases is being eliminated

if i had bought logic x, i would now have received various free bug fixes, feature additions etc, and would continue to do so right up till the next version

with this system, you are gambling on the fact that a year's payments will be worthwhile because if you don't stick it through to the end then you forfeit all your previous payments

the guy who came up with this needs more love in his life

[She Changed Her Mind]

Quote:
'May 13 2014 - If you Buy SONAR X3 Producer or Upgrade today you will receive a free Upgrade to Addictive Drums 2'
Lame. Point. Because before that very day you are ripped off if you did buy X3. If you don't know what 'ripped off' means, you are probably Americun. Wanna bet?

[J4R1O]

In any other DAW you will not get some bug fixes if you dont buy the next version.

Question for all the Sonar X2 users:
Did you got those X2 bugs fixed when you bought the X3?

[xamido]

Basically you will not get bug fixes if you're not subscribed. That's the main point here. Those minor bug fixes that's usually free in other DAW is now paid for.

In any other DAW you will not get some bug fixes if you dont buy the next version. That's the main point here.
The only difference is that you want to say 'Oh if I only paid for 4 months usage instead of 12, I should still be entitled to the bugfixes in the next full version anyway'

Now u're going in circle again. In other DAW minor bug fixes is free. FREE. Even sometime they release pretty big update for free.

My Studio One 2 have just had its latest bug fix version last month. I've own Studio One 2 for two years since 2013, and i've gotten so many free update from them.

My FL Studio have had 3 update since the version 9 that i bought initially.

I would have to pay two year of extra subscription with cakewalk to get that same experience.

And nobody know what they will add during your subscription period, it's all vague promises currently.