KVR Audio

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 7:57 pm

I just saw this in the KVR Audio News:
http://www.kvraudio.com/news/28775

I'm a little bit between the chairs on this one.
As much as I love Focusrite (both hardware and software - I'm a Midnight Suite user myself, and I love the ISA racks!), this is kind of coming on a tiny little bit strong.

The price of 299USD for two modules is IMO really hefty, considering that you can get Slate VBC for 99USD street (with a RED3 compressor clone), and the Midnight Suite (also 99USD) is basically the ISA/RED EQ/COMP - only that the RED uses a different case and PSU. (unless I misunderstood Dave Gamble wrong throught old shop talk)

Though some might argue "the hardware is darn expensive - here you can get infinite instances". True that, but look at the over-saturated market of EQ's and Compressors. At this price, a suite has to(!) blow me out of the water and substantiate and switch to the RED series exclusively.

I also find it kind of strange that the "Scarlett", Saffire and Forte users get the plugin for free. So it looks to me as if this is the "successor" to the Midnight Suite and the old "Scarlett Suite", especially as bundled software - while those that have(!) the old plugins are kind of left out in terms of cross-grades (didn't ask them yet - I only go by official news). KVR's news entry states however, that this is a "complementary release" to the Scarlett and Midnight Suite.

And once more... the old ISA Plugins for ProTools being revived in VST/AAX/AU would have been nice (complete with ISA GUI). But oh well.

The RED GUIs also looks a bit cheap IMO. Then again, the audio quality is important. Not to mention am I curious, if the plugins will feature any form of saturation, or are just plain "digital recreations". And I really hope that they might port the RED1 as well.

But it looks like as if Dave Gamble is not behind the porting this time around.

Aiynzahev · Post by **Aiynzahev** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:21 pm

what makes you think Dave was not involved?

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Thu Jan 22, 2015 8:43 pm

Summd up - because last time I talked shop with him about Focusrite, he told me that collaborations were never further considered.

Now this suite is coming out of the blue. Though granted, I did not check GS (so far) if some info's leaked over there.

And I still ask myself - why the RED series and not the ISA (as well?)? Though granted, the "Midnight Suite" is supposed to be an ISA (but not "the" ISA). Maybe because the RED hardware series is discontinued? Or maybe because requests came up after Slate Digital kind of revived this old hardware range with the FG-RED and competition is good for business?

We'll never know.

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:00 am

Well, I just downloaded the Red 2 and Red 3. Lets get this over with: The EQ is a decent ordinary digital-wannabe-analogue EQ without any complex harmonic distortion emulation. It's decent enough and has a very nice low and high shelf and the filters are very usable (though a bit steep for my liking).

Red 3, the compressor.. it. is. AWESOME!!! Like Cytomic The Glue awesome! I was seriously blown away by just how ridiculously good it sounds on so many things.

Granted, it doesn't have any complex harmonic distortion modeling either but that's actually a GOOD THING in my opinion. It means it will work on more signal sources and I already have so many damn saturation plugins that I don't really need another one. Besides I just combined it with SDRR (running the Germanic/Fuzz model) and it's a match made in heaven!

Seriously, I would have been laughing at the price of this plugin bundle but now I'm not so sure.. the compressor is seriously seriously awesome. So much so that I can't even quite comprehend it. It's extremely usable at almost any settings.. as a mild leveler, hard hitting stomper, total crush.. just a great workhorse. Not sure how close it is to the original's compression behavior (if my memory serves me right, it's definitely "in the ballpark".. perhaps a bit on the polite side of things with open attack and short release) but whatever it is, it's good.

Now for the best bit: It takes about 0.2% of CPU processing per instance. I can run hundreds of these and have no issues at all.

Bottom line is this: If you have a Scarlett interface you must download this plugin bundle immediately!!. If you are considering a Scarlett interface.. these plugins boosted the value of this interface by 299$.

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:12 am

I take it you have a Focusrite USB/Firewire module? Because the time I wrote the post, there was no download link.

Can you maybe provide THD plots?
If it's really "digital" throughout, I wonder why I should get the plugins if I have the Midnight Suite already.

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:17 am

Yeah I have the 18i8 here at home. Hmm.. wonder if I am allowed to install these plugins in the studio? Or is it only a single license per interface?

Anyhow, the R3 compressor sounds completely different to the Midnight Suite (which I have installed as well). In my opinion it is much better and more usable than the compressor in the Midnight Suite. The attack is way smoother and the auto release works really well if you want more invisible type of compression. It's just a way "rounder" sound.

I just ran these in VST Plugin Analyzer and there's no harmonic distortion at all in either unit (unless the compressor is compressing but that's a given).

AC222 · Post by **AC222** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:24 am

what is this s***t about being able to download this for free with the Scarlett series but not the Midnight series? The scarlett was a throwaway freebie that they packaged in with just about anything and the midnight was something you always had to pay for.

sprnva · Post by **sprnva** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:28 am

AC222 wrote:what is this s***t about being able to download this for free with the Scarlett series but not the Midnight series? The scarlett was a throwaway freebie that they packaged in with just about anything and the midnight was something you always had to pay for.

They mean Scarlett hardware, not the plugin bundle.

Just checked my Focusrite account and it was there. Installed and activated fine in 10.6.8 (nice to see that not all devs are into pushing Apple's upgrade train).

AC222 · Post by **AC222** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:32 am

sprnva wrote:
AC222 wrote:what is this s***t about being able to download this for free with the Scarlett series but not the Midnight series? The scarlett was a throwaway freebie that they packaged in with just about anything and the midnight was something you always had to pay for.
They mean Scarlett hardware, not the plugin bundle.

Just checked my Focusrite account and it was there. Installed and activated fine in 10.6.8 (nice to see that not all devs are into pushing Apple's upgrade train).

Thanks boss. That makes sense now. Otherwise I would have felt ripped off. Hope this plugin floats your boat

I'm sure it will be a step up from the midnight package.

antithesist · Post by **antithesist** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:42 am

I'll bet they are the same codebase as the Digidesign/Avid versions, which I like a lot.

I did like those interfaces more, too (EQ graph, etc.).

Focusrite got the Forte Suite (ISA) back from Digavid a few years back.

I imagine these came home too, after a license expiration, etc.

We have the Forte Suite here, but can only use it as RTAS under Pro Tools 9/10, since we don't have active TDM systems anymore.

MickGael · Post by **MickGael** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:52 am

bmanic wrote:Red 3, the compressor.. it. is. AWESOME!!! Like Cytomic The Glue awesome! I was seriously blown away by just how ridiculously good it sounds on so many things.

I'm also quite pleasantly surprised.

I owned a pair of Focusrite Red 7s for many years, so it's a sound and feel I know quite well. Yes, the Red 7 and Red 3 are different boxes, but there is a family resemblance. My initial impression is that the Focusrite version sounds (and feels) A LOT more like Red hardware that does the Slate (which honestly has never done much for me).

Most interesting.

antithesist · Post by **antithesist** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 4:08 am

Mercado_Negro · Post by **Mercado_Negro** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:25 am

I'm also impressed with the Red 3 comp. This is a truly versatile compressor and I have to admit I was skeptic when I read about it because the Scarlett Suite sounds really bad to me (came bundled with my Liquid Saffire 56). It works on so many things that I can actually relate to bmanic when he says it is "Like Cytomic The Glue Awesome" because that's one of my favorite comps for "rough mixes". It's the comp I load on all tracks when I need to get things done quickly. Now, it doesn't sound like The Glue, it's a different tone/comp behavior but it can get you great results in no time (that's why I compare both).

To me it is smoother and a bit more natural than the FG-Grey which is my favorite for leveling and getting things in place while editing, just to bring things into perspective before actually mixing. The Red 3 feels like part of the performance, it grabs the signal and rides it so smoothly that you can hear it's tight but you're still comfortable with it. It is very very natural sounding and while you can clearly hear the tone (although, like bmanic said it doesn't have any harmonic content but it definitely has a particular sound), it blends so nicely with the sound that you wouldn't care it's imparting that character. It reminds me of the IK Opto Comp because it doesn't get in the way and doesn't change the sound drastically (in fact, if you see a plot while compressing a 1kHz tone you'll see it's aliasing-free all way at 96kHz -no I didn't test it at 44.1kHz, sorry).

Anyways, here's a comparisson between the FG-Red and this Focusrite Red 3 if someone wants to hear the differences. I also included the Dry version in case you want to see if you can get the same results with another compressor and save money.

DryVocal

FG-Red

Focusrite Red 3

Ah, almost forgot: yes, the EQ sucks big time.

bmanic · Post by **bmanic** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 9:30 am

Yeah what I meant with "Cytomic The Glue awesome!" was basically that this sounds so good that it could have been programmed by Andy.

Of course it sounds and behaves nothing like The Glue but in my quick tests so far it's definitely of similar quality and usability. In short: It's awesome!

Compyfox · Post by **Compyfox** » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:07 pm

Wow... I totally forgot that AVID also had the "RED" modules years before. And yes, pity that the FORTE suite was never upgraded/re-released (I'd get that, if it came with all bells and whistles - read: saturation, accurate filters, compression/gate, etc).

But reading between the lines, I take it that the 299USD price tag for the VST bundle is not really worth it? Unless you got it as "bundle deal" if you have one of the in-the-manual-listed hardware modules. Then you get it for free.

Don't get me wrong - if you're happy with the RED creation, it's fine. But why port (or re-release rather) it if it's basically "the same" like years back?

I mean... no harmonic distortion, just digital recreations. The only reason to go for the bundle is because of the RED3 compressor then (based upon the ISA215 EQ and ISA130 compressor circuits), and because it turned VST now as well. But then, it's a really hefty price.

Unless you're happy with the Midnight bundle (ISA 110 EQ and also a ISA 130 compressor).

Focusrite ports RED 2 and 3 modules (without Dave Gamble?)