KVR Audio

bibz1st · Post by **bibz1st** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:02 pm

What about using "Quick Controls" would that work ?

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:11 pm

bibz1st wrote:What about using "Quick Controls" would that work ?

What would work would be to be able to play my synth and move the mod wheel like I can do with 99% of the synths I own.

That's what would work.

bibz1st · Post by **bibz1st** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:18 pm

Is that not how you can set up Quick Controls, looks like it is from this, from 2009 http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul09/a ... e_0709.htm
Just trying to help
edit
hmm looking at it, thats for writing automation to the DAW, not for automating the vst. I'll get my coat

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 3:43 pm

bibz1st wrote:Is that not how you can set up Quick Controls, looks like it is from this, from 2009 http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul09/a ... e_0709.htm
Just trying to help
edit
hmm looking at it, thats for writing automation to the DAW, not for automating the vst. I'll get my coat

It doesn't work. I won't go into the details as to why.

TrojakEW · Post by **TrojakEW** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 5:25 pm

wagtunes wrote:Curious about something. Been looking for mod wheel modulation. Can't seem to find it.

Can somebody help me out here?

Well sorry friend but Eclipsis doesn't have midi cc for now. I will do everything to get that working in next version. Although it will be hard since I don't have any experience in that matter and I never used it because I don't have any external device to test it (please dont post reply that I should buy one when im on vst development - I cant afford even cheap version).

Also if you or anyone can tell me what use or what advantage it have in "computer" music making. I always thought it is only usable for live performance or do I missing something?

Share your experience.

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 5:31 pm

TrojakEW wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Curious about something. Been looking for mod wheel modulation. Can't seem to find it.

Can somebody help me out here?
Well sorry friend but Eclipsis doesn't have midi cc for now. I will do everything to get that working in next version. Although it will be hard since I don't have any experience in that matter and I never used it because I don't have any external device to test it (please dont post reply that I should buy one when im on vst development - I cant afford even cheap version).

Also if you or anyone can tell me what use or what advantage it have in "computer" music making. I always thought it is only usable for live performance or do I missing something? Share your experience.

No problem. I will try to explain why mod wheel is a vital part of even computer music.

Music without any kind of dynamics or movement is static and dull. A simple movement of a mod wheel to open and close a filter, as an example, can bring life and interest to an otherwise dull passage.

It is a basic function of almost all "computer" generated music and without it, quite honestly, leaves your product as less than desirable for a musician to use.

Just being honest with you. If this is something you just plan on giving away for as long as it's being developed then this might not matter to you. But if you someday plan on releasing a version that you hope people will pay for or, at the very least, donate to, you need to have basic functionality that almost all VSTs have.

Take this reply in the spirit in which it is intended.

RichardSemper · Post by **RichardSemper** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 5:53 pm

TrojakEW wrote:
wagtunes wrote:Curious about something. Been looking for mod wheel modulation. Can't seem to find it.

Can somebody help me out here?
Well sorry friend but Eclipsis doesn't have midi cc for now. I will do everything to get that working in next version. Although it will be hard since I don't have any experience in that matter and I never used it because I don't have any external device to test it (please dont post reply that I should buy one when im on vst development - I cant afford even cheap version).

Also if you or anyone can tell me what use or what advantage it have in "computer" music making. I always thought it is only usable for live performance or do I missing something? Share your experience.

Really its pretty essential. mod wheels and pitch bend help to add the human touch and feeling to any composition. Programming all the automation is far less intuitive and often sounds impersonal. In fact in this regard computer music making can be very similar to live performance.

I love the synth by the way. The interface design is something special! I was getting some very interesting sounds within couple of hours of installing it. I am having a go at creating some patches which i will post when i can, along with a more detailed appraisal.

I must say I really appreciate the effort you have put into making this synth. Perhaps if enough of us can be persuaded to donate something you may be able to get some form of controller - or maybe someone has an old unused one they could send? Certainly there are many of us would be only too willing to test your mods on our systems.

rayola1 · Post by **rayola1** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 6:07 pm

it's a fine sounding synth, but without the expressive possibilities of a mod wheel it's a little crippled for my work.

TrojakEW · Post by **TrojakEW** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 6:16 pm

Well you didn't answer my question. Maybe I'm looking like complete fool

(no offense) but in reality i know about imperfection/dynamics/changes over time in music/instrument. This what makes everything unique and less artificial while simulating real world behavior. This is what an automation is for when modulation is not enough. I use automation often and still don't need any external device except mouse

That's why I asked what use/advantage external controller have in cm. I always draw event in automation by myself. So I suppose you use it for recording automation or?

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 6:35 pm

TrojakEW wrote:Well you didn't answer my question. Maybe I'm looking like complete fool (no offense) but in reality i know about imperfection/dynamics/changes over time in music/instrument. This what makes everything unique and less artificial while simulating real world behavior. This is what an automation is for when modulation is not enough. I use automation often and still don't need any external device except mouse

That's why I asked what use/advantage external controller have in cm. I always draw event in automation by myself. So I suppose you use it for recording automation or?

Yes, I could setup my DAW to automate my using my mouse to move the filter cutoff while I play. The problem with that is that I now have to look at the screen of my PC while I am playing my keyboard. This is difficult for me to do.

With the mod wheel, I can look at the keyboard and move the mod wheel, something I have been doing now for over 35 years.

Because you are not a performer, you can't understand this.

Bottom Line: Very few people will use your product without basic mod wheel functionality.

animehaus · Post by **animehaus** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 6:55 pm

As I've said, I don't know about other DAWs, but with FL Studio I can assign my pitch bend, mod wheel and all knobs on my Behringer UMX610 to work with any parameter on Eclipsis. Of course it's not as straightforward as a Midi Learn button, but it works perfectly.

wagtunes · Post by **wagtunes** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 7:08 pm

animehaus wrote:As I've said, I don't know about other DAWs, but with FL Studio I can assign my pitch bend, mod wheel and all knobs on my Behringer UMX610 to work with any parameter on Eclipsis. Of course it's not as straightforward as a Midi Learn button, but it works perfectly.

The problem with Cubase is that I can only assign Mod Wheel to ONE quick control.

However, because of the weird way Eclipsis is setup, each OSC has its own filter. So I would need to assign the Mod Wheel to 3 different quick controls. Cubase does not allow this. So I would have to assign Mod Wheel to QC 1, a slider to QC 2 and another slider to QC 3 in order to control all 3 filters. I would therefore not be able to do any filter manipulation in real time as I only have 2 hands and would need 4 in order to pull off what should be easy to do with two.

I hope that's clear enough.

rayola1 · Post by **rayola1** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 7:14 pm

I am a player. even when creating background atmospheres, I want to put spontaneous feeling into my music. I'm very grateful for your work, but not everybody does beat - grid oriented music. I love to PLAY my instruments in the moment, not edit them. again, it's an awesome sounding synth that you've done a great job on, but without the ability to play it expressively is very, very frustrating to use. and assigning thru your DAW is not always feasible. I use Reaper, which records the controllers , BUT WON'T PLAY THEM BACK! why?- I don't know, but that's how it is.

animehaus · Post by **animehaus** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 7:18 pm

wagtunes wrote:The problem with Cubase is that I can only assign Mod Wheel to ONE quick control.

However, because of the weird way Eclipsis is setup, each OSC has its own filter. So I would need to assign the Mod Wheel to 3 different quick controls. Cubase does not allow this. So I would have to assign Mod Wheel to QC 1, a slider to QC 2 and another slider to QC 3 in order to control all 3 filters. I would therefore not be able to do any filter manipulation in real time as I only have 2 hands and would need 4 in order to pull off what should be easy to do with two.

I hope that's clear enough.

Sure, clear enough, and it's sad that Cubase doesn't allow it. I've just assigned the 3 OSC filter cutoffs to the mod wheel on FL Studio, and it worked flawlessly: I can control the 3 filters simultaneously with MW.

Mojo42 · Post by **Mojo42** » Fri Feb 06, 2015 9:01 pm

@Wagtunes: My midi Keyboard even haven`t got a Mod Wheel

Why? Because I`m a beginner and I`m new to the "hobby" electronic music. I`m a musician almost my whole lifetime, but making music at the PC and with Keyboard and Synthesizer is completely new for me.

Somewhere I had to start with a very little budget and for the beginning the M Audio Keystation 32 (without Mod Wheel) has been enough for me for to start and for the moment. I know that I will need a better Keyboard someday (with Mod Wheel and more keys), but keep in mind that there are also beginners among us here and not everybody needs the whole range of possibilities at a Synthesizer especially when it is freeware!!!

I have downloaded a lot of free Synthesizers during the last year and a lot of them have got fewer features than Eclipsis. In fact I think for a free Synthesizer Eclipsis is really, really great. As TrojakEW already said: He is also just starting, with a small budget. It is easy to develope something amazing, complex and very extensive if you have got enough money for it. But to create something cool (like Eclipsis

) with only a very small budget deserves respect in my humble opinion. To give it away for free although one could sell it even more. So: Give us "beginners" with small budget a chance to grow

Everybody starts somewhen. I also missed a couple of features at the modulation Matrix but I wouldn`t complain, because Eclipsis was a gift. I`m sure TrojakEW knows what could be improved by time and with more money, if enough people will donate, it will be possible. It is that simple. Giving him feedback is okay, but the way you did sounds a bit offending and it is not true that people will not donate, because they did already as you can see here in this thread.

Peace and Love
Yvonne

Eclipsis VSTi by VST zOne (free)