).This happened a few days ago, but it's still haunting me, and I am still as confused as I was few days ago, so I wanted to see if anyone had similar experience (and how the issue was resolved).
Also, this is not a "Waaaah, 8Dio are horrible don't buy anything from them" type of thread. On the contrary, I bloody well wish I could buy something from them and that's what I am trying to do
On Sunday I made my first 8Dio purchase (Studio Sopranos). I was all excited because it was a present/surprise for my wife, who is the one actually making the music. After the purchase was completed, I received an email informing me about 12-24 hour delay and possible verification/proof of identity. This part made me furious, since at no point during the purchase was I informed about this delay. Ruined my surprise plans, but ok, I'll survive.
12 hours later, at 3AM my time, I receive an email from 8Dio, asking for "online reference" (ex. website), phone number or any other type of "valid ID validation" that they could use. Still being angry, I explain them that I don't understand why they want all this since I've made many audio-related purchases (effects/instruments) in past 12 months and was never asked for anything like this. Nevertheless, I express my objections (as if they're gonna call me at 3AM to verify my ID somehow and use that for watermarking) and then explain who the purchase is for and I provide them the links to wife's website, her Soundcloud details (she has 140 tracks and around 5,000 real followers and is obviously very real and not some fake account), where they can also see her name (obviously shares same last name/location with me), picture and what not. Since purchase was for her, it would then make sense that 8Dio watermarks it to her as well. I have no idea what watermarking means for them and whether they watermark it for person paying for it or person using it, so that is why I gave wife's details. She'd be the one actually using it.
Next day I get a response, which completely ignores all the details I provided, and talks nonsense like "my domain is not active", even though they're communicating to me by sending an email to that domain (and domain name is my first name too, so kind of obvious that it's mine). Here they also first time mention about seeing "stolen Paypal credits" being used before and I still have no idea what they are talking about. My Paypal account is a verified one, and I know that merchants get my personal details when I pay using Paypal, since I got things delivered on many occasions without ever giving address/email and other data.
I am boiling and explain them that they can in 10 seconds find all the details about my domain (which was registered in 1998, very easy to lookup/validate/etc through search engines/archives/etc). My name is unique, I don't know any other person with my name (nor does Google), so I also suggest that they search for my name. Anyway, I am tired of arguing at this point, so I give them my phone number. I offer to bring up website on my domain name, to prove that it's me and I can put up personalized message if needed. I don't need a website, neither my job nor lifestyle require me to have 'online presence', thus I don't have a personal website running. I offer to send them a copy of translated/notarized utility bill, since this is the only type of document that I used for any kind of 'ID validation' for past 5 years, and it is a yearly requirement from my bank. So they can have it if they want it. My details as well as lawyer's details are on the document. I offer Skype (video, if needed) chat if they want and provide my skype ID. I provide my KVR audio username, so they can see posting/purchasing history and feedback thread, if they want. And last, I very clearly ask them to tell me what else they would want since I still really have no idea what exactly is it they want from me.
In the evening, new mail arrives completely ignoring everything I've said/offered, and saying that it is obvious that I don't feel comfortable providing ID. First wtf moment.
Next, they conclude that my domain name didn't have any content they could use for verification. Wtf moment number two, since it is hard for me to believe that someone would rely on content of a random website to do "ID verification".
And the most shocking moment was their conclusion that origin of my site is in Germany, yet I am making the order from Thailand (which is where we live, and where I spent 10 years of my life). Then, they finalize it with stating that Thailand is high-risk when it comes to piracy (and that statement makes absolutely no sense in this context). And they imply that they should just refund the purchase.
I am a network/computer geek and have been in this for over 20 years. I have had my own dedicated servers (for my own/family emails/galleries/etc) for 12 years now, in US, Netherlands, Germany, probably in few more places I can't even remember anymore. I am completely stunned with incompetence here, where someone is making incredibly wild, arrogant and wrong assumptions due to (seemingly) lack of basic understanding of technology.
Anyway, this damn post is already too long, so long story short.
Since I have job, life, 2 kids and what not, I am unable to respond until the evening, where I try to gather all the things for them. I provide them with the invoice from my hosting provider in Germany, for this dedicated server, and invoice clearly shows IPs of the server, so I explain how wife's site and my domain MX record match the server IPs, and IPs are all clearly visible in invoice. I mean, I can't get more specific than this, and invoice also clearly states my name and address (which matches my Paypal address).
Since it is now obvious that everything so far has been ignored, I make a desperate move and take a scan of my passport and attach that to the email too. I usually wouldn't do something like this, but I desperately want to end this.
I take screenshots of last 3 months on my Paypal account, to show many purchases from known instrument/effect vendors, as well as purchases that I made from KVR market thread. With little bit of effort, plenty of them could be matched with sale/feedback threads, if they wanted to go that far.
And finally I take a picture of myself, holding a paper with message to 8Dio (which said "Dear 8Dio, please stop being naughty. Thank you. Yours truly, person with a dedicated server in Germany."), so that they can hopefully match the picture to my passport picture and message is obviously very specific and related to transaction I was trying to complete.
As I send that mail out, I notice that *literally* 11 minutes earlier they have refunded my order without even waiting for my reply. I send them another mail, asking them if documents I've sent are sufficient and whether I could resubmit my order. It's now incredibly late (not night anymore, but morning, ouch) and I go to bed.
I wake up, and there are no responses. I also realize that they haven't even checked the passport scan (it was inside ZIP encrypted file, password for which was stored on my server and I provided them the URL - it was never visited).
I then placed a new order, which silently got refunded an hour later.
Last act of desperation was to send an email to another account listed on their site (not related to support/info), explain what was happening and I literally just wanted an explanation, or some kind of 'closure', since I still have absolutely no idea whether their refusal was based on prejudice/incompetence (I live in Thailand, and server is in Germany, therefore I must be up to something - ok, I am joking and simplifying, but everything sounds plausible at this point in time
) or something completely different. That was 2 days ago, never got any response. So I presume they're completely ignoring me. Which is beyond ridiculous, since they are one of the largest and most famous sound library companies, it just doesn't make sense to do this. I would be fine even if they told me "Piss off, we don't like you and don't want to do business with you", since that would at least explain something. I am pretty vocal about things (especially about privacy issues/etc) so maybe they got upset because I was not immediately silently complying with whatever it is they wanted me to do, but it still doesn't make sense. They (nor anyone else) are not obliged to do business with me and I am aware of that, but just going completely silent on a customer after this whole ordeal is simply... illogical. Twilight zone, if you will Last time I was asked for any type of 'validation' was years ago (~5 years or so), which was a simple copy of my CC to prove I was the owner. Since I've gotten Paypal account I never had a single request for ID validations, and I literally have no idea what ID validation even means to 8Dio. It's not explained anywhere on their site (that I could find/see), it's not mentioned during checkout/purchase process.
I've purchased libraries that were also seemingly watermarked (ones that use that "Connect" thingie for downloads, I think?) and I have no idea how they were watermarked or with what, but I was never asked for anything. I bought things (that cost more than that $250 Sopranos library) from SoundIron, Sample Logic, Sonokinetic, I've also got libraries from Best Service and many others, and I was never asked for anything so I have no idea if/how they do watermarking.
So, could people tell me what they use(d) for ID validation for their 8Dio purchases? Or general experiences with purchases? Do you send multiple documents? Did you need to talk to them on the phone? Might in the future have my wife create Paypal account and purchase the library on her own, but I'd like to know what is it, that is needed to be sent in order to pass their "ID validation" process. I have tried searching the web for similar cases, but didn't find any, it doesn't appear that 8Dio does things like this.
Have you ever been rejected by 8Dio while trying to purchase a library? And how did you resolve the issue (if you did)?
I am not mad at them, I am just puzzled as to what is/was going on. I solve problems for living, for a very long time, and I feel helpless with this one. Mind you, I solve technical problems, seems that I am not very good with problems like this
I mean, when I am re-reading emails I realize that I was bit blunt and not very diplomatic (and most of exchanges were taking place late at night, and I'm not a native English speaker either, hmm...), but I wasn't offending anyone or calling anyone names, so it wouldn't make sense that they got offended by someone simply being vocal. Or maybe they did, who knows. I'd at least appreciate if they mentioned it
Any experiences/advices are much appreciated.
Thanks.
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