SYN'X 2.5 Released - Xils-Lab - (Multitimbral Synthex - intro discount-)

[wagtunes]

Finished going through the manual of this beast and I noticed something very interesting. The arpeggiator was left out.

I figured out how it works so it's not a big deal but you might want to put something in the manual for anybody who might be a little confused.

PS - Absolutely LOVING this synth. Might be my purchase of the year.

Thanks for pointing out the arp omission. The arp is quite intuitive to use. But it should be in the manual for sure.

I hope the -completely rewritten- manual will have given you a precise idea and good understanding of what is the Syn'X 2, and how to operate it not only in the eazy mode, wich is very simple, but also in the advanced mode.

Thank you, yes. I pretty much have this thing under control. Took me 2 whole days and that's after 36 years of using Synths. This one has some quirkiness that takes some getting used to.

Primarily, when creating patches in advanced mode where you're modifying each OSC by hand one at a time, getting instant feedback isn't so straight forward because of how voice allocation works.

For example, working on layer A (voices 1 and 9), with all the other OSC's turned on, it's hard to hear what's actually happening to those 2 voices. However, if you solo layer A, it doesn't shut off the other voices, just the other layers. So as you play, you're going to get lots of silent notes when the other voices are triggered. So what you need to do in order to rectify this is go down to the advanced section and actually turn off voices 2, 3,4, etc. And then, when you're finished with layer A and move on to layer B, you have to turn voices 1 and 9 off and turn on voices 2 and 10. And you need to continue doing this throughout the process.

But here's where it gets tricky.

After you've programmed all 8 layers, you then have to listen to them all back on to see if anything you've done clashes. If something doesn't sound right, as you play, you need to watch the voices as they're sounding to see which voice is actually causing the problem.

Needless to say, I have never performed such surgery with a synth in my life, including every modular I've ever worked on. But the end result is astonishing if you get everything just right.

Ironically, splits are easier than layers because you can just concentrate on 8 voices at a time instead of 16, or whatever combination you want.

Two very minor nit picks and this pertains to splits and the arpeggiator.

For splits, where you want different FX for the top and bottom, you can't. The FX are global. So if I want an ARP with a delay in the bass and a dry lead in the treble, I'm out of luck.

For the arpeggiator, I notice that the gate time is not modifiable through the mod matrix. This would be such a cool effect if you want to use the mod wheel to go from a short to long gate.

Other than those 2 minor nit picks, I'm pretty cool with the way it's laid out. It certainly has balls for a sound. I'm totally in love with this thing and plan on doing a lot of programming with it.

Even if it's not perfect.

[KingTuck]

Is the intention to have this in beta for a while? Or is the beta largely complete and it's just here to iron out bugs for a few weeks or so?

[aMUSEd]

I suspect the former, doesn't seem to have lots of bugs, although the midi cc assignment setup needs fixing as it stops me being able to assign my joystick to it. There are a few cosmetic issues.

[Lotuzia]

....Thank you, yes. I pretty much have this thing under control. Took me 2 whole days and that's after 36 years of using Synths.....

Primarily, when creating patches in advanced mode where you're modifying each OSC by hand one at a time, getting instant feedback isn't so straight forward because of how voice allocation works. For example, working on layer A (voices 1 and 9), with all the other OSC's turned on, it's hard to hear what's actually happening to those 2 voices. However, if you solo layer A, it doesn't shut off the other voices, just the other layers. So as you play, you're going to get lots of silent notes when the other voices are triggered. So what you need to do in order to rectify this is go down to the advanced section and actually turn off voices 2, 3,4, etc. And then, when you're finished with layer A and move on to layer B, you have to turn voices 1 and 9 off and turn on voices 2 and 10. And you need to continue doing this throughout the process.

But here's where it gets tricky.

After you've programmed all 8 layers, you then have to listen to them all back on to see if anything you've done clashes. If something doesn't sound right, as you play, you need to watch the voices as they're sounding to see which voice is actually causing the problem.

Needless to say, I have never performed such surgery with a synth in my life, including every modular I've ever worked on. But the end result is astonishing if you get everything just right.

.......................

For both cases : There's a turnaround for the voice allocation I often used for complex patches. Instead of turning voices off, just solo one layer then increase the Unison value, as much as necessary so that each note triggers the layer you're soloing. It's often quicker.
Else welcome to the beauty of the Syn'X 2 : By making *weird* voices allocations, like one of the voices of a layer for one Keyboard, and another one for the other keyboard, you can get some really otherwordly patches. Simon Ball ( Sounds Divine ) used this for some of his patches, and the results speak for themselves.
Else, those who have performed with an Oberheim Matrix 12 for example will be more familiar with this kind of Voices/Card architecture. Once you're into it, it's incredibly powerfull, inspiring, and full of fantasy. This is the sense of the 'matrix12/Synthex hybridation imho. It brings something new in the synthesizer world.

[Lotuzia]

......

Two very minor nit picks and this pertains to splits and the arpeggiator.

For splits, where you want different FX for the top and bottom, you can't. The FX are global. So if I want an ARP with a delay in the bass and a dry lead in the treble, I'm out of luck.

For the arpeggiator, I notice that the gate time is not modifiable through the mod matrix. This would be such a cool effect if you want to use the mod wheel to go from a short to long gate.

Other than those 2 minor nit picks, I'm pretty cool with the way it's laid out. It certainly has balls for a sound. I'm totally in love with this thing and plan on doing a lot of programming with it.

Even if it's not perfect.

Global FX : for total mix freedom, just duplicate the patch, and mute the layers you do not wish to receive the effects in one instance ( this is for those who hate to freeze, like me) If you accept freezing/export to audio tracks, just make two successive renderings, one with the layers taht should receive a certain FX, and one without.
for the Gate, preference was given for the gates of the polysequencer lines : Each line has its own gate, and you can play ARPs and Sequences lines simultaneously. This said there are already more than 130 destinations in all the mod matrixes, so a creeative turn around could be to control the Decay of the different synthesizers instead of the gate of the arpegiator, its not strictly similar, but sometimes its very close ( + if you automate the Decay of the filter EV instead of th VCA, you can often get similar results -depends of the ev/vcf amount- + ... a lot of additional fun )

[Lotuzia]

Is the intention to have this in beta for a while? Or is the beta largely complete and it's just here to iron out bugs for a few weeks or so?

Largely complete I agree with aMused, according to Xils last newsletter : the v 1.0 should be released on June 21st. ( and the discount will decrease from 30% to 25% as well when version 1.0 is released so ......)

Summer day

[wagtunes]

....Thank you, yes. I pretty much have this thing under control. Took me 2 whole days and that's after 36 years of using Synths.....

Primarily, when creating patches in advanced mode where you're modifying each OSC by hand one at a time, getting instant feedback isn't so straight forward because of how voice allocation works. For example, working on layer A (voices 1 and 9), with all the other OSC's turned on, it's hard to hear what's actually happening to those 2 voices. However, if you solo layer A, it doesn't shut off the other voices, just the other layers. So as you play, you're going to get lots of silent notes when the other voices are triggered. So what you need to do in order to rectify this is go down to the advanced section and actually turn off voices 2, 3,4, etc. And then, when you're finished with layer A and move on to layer B, you have to turn voices 1 and 9 off and turn on voices 2 and 10. And you need to continue doing this throughout the process.

But here's where it gets tricky.

After you've programmed all 8 layers, you then have to listen to them all back on to see if anything you've done clashes. If something doesn't sound right, as you play, you need to watch the voices as they're sounding to see which voice is actually causing the problem.

Needless to say, I have never performed such surgery with a synth in my life, including every modular I've ever worked on. But the end result is astonishing if you get everything just right.

.......................

For both cases : There's a turnaround for the voice allocation I often used for complex patches. Instead of turning voices off, just solo one layer then increase the Unison value, as much as necessary so that each note triggers the layer you're soloing. It's often quicker.
Else welcome to the beauty of the Syn'X 2 : By making *weird* voices allocations, like one of the voices of a layer for one Keyboard, and another one for the other keyboard, you can get some really otherwordly patches. Simon Ball ( Sounds Divine ) used this for some of his patches, and the results speak for themselves.
Else, those who have performed with an Oberheim Matrix 12 for example will be more familiar with this kind of Voices/Card architecture. Once you're into it, it's incredibly powerfull, inspiring, and full of fantasy. This is the sense of the 'matrix12/Synthex hybridation imho. It brings something new in the synthesizer world.

The problem with using Unison mode is that you don't really get a true sound as the unison does alter the timber even if just slightly. But yes, that is the beauty of this synth, and I have allocated voices of layers split between both keyboards. The results, as you will eventually hear, are nothing short of surreal.

Don't remember the last time I had this much fun programming a synth.

[wagtunes]

Discovered an interesting bug with the sequencer.

Step 1) Click on REC.

Step 2) Check the box you want to record and enter a voice number.

Step 3) Click on EDIT and DISP for the box you want to record and edit.

Step 4) Play a note on the keyboard. You will discover that it skips the first 3 notes and places the first recorded note at position 4.

Step 5) Try to edit the first 3 positions. You can't. It appears to be locked.

Step 6) Click off EDIT and then click back on.

Step 7) Try to edit those positions. Editing now works.

It appears that you can't begin the record procedure on a track with the EDIT button lit. I don't know why.

I haven't tested it from the first step with the button off to see if it works but you definitely have to turn it off if it's on in order to get the sequencer to behave properly.

Sorry, I was a QA tester for 5 years. I'll find stuff like this.

[wagtunes]

Okay, this is really getting weird.

Take a look at the screen capture attached.

You will notice that the keyboard is split between upper and lower with only voices 1 and 9 assigned to lower and everything else assigned to upper. The lower keyboard plays the sequence I was referring to above.

You will also notice that there are no boxes highlighted for voices 1 and 9 for the lower keyboard. They play, sporadically at best. And for some reason the key follow on the sequencer triggers even when I play the upper keyboard and not change the root note of the lower keyboard.

This shouldn't happen. It makes holding a sequence and playing a comp to it impossible because the key keeps changing with every note you play in the upper keyboard.

The key follow should only trigger when you play notes within the range.

Not only that, but the sequence, as I just discovered, doesn't stop at note 73. It plays throughout the key range.

So, I'm going to guess that the Sequencer is independent of the two keyboards and thus, if you want to do a sequencer/pad split, you really can't.

Either that, or this is a bug.

[XILS-lab]

Discovered an interesting bug with the sequencer.

Step 1) Click on REC.

Step 2) Check the box you want to record and enter a voice number.

Step 3) Click on EDIT and DISP for the box you want to record and edit.

Step 4) Play a note on the keyboard. You will discover that it skips the first 3 notes and places the first recorded note at position 4.

Step 5) Try to edit the first 3 positions. You can't. It appears to be locked.

Step 6) Click off EDIT and then click back on.

Step 7) Try to edit those positions. Editing now works.

It appears that you can't begin the record procedure on a track with the EDIT button lit. I don't know why.

I haven't tested it from the first step with the button off to see if it works but you definitely have to turn it off if it's on in order to get the sequencer to behave properly.

Sorry, I was a QA tester for 5 years. I'll find stuff like this.

I uploaded a few hours ago a new version which may fix this one (there was something wrong between the sequencer edit panel and the sequencer button)
Anyway, I will check your report deeper to be sure it's all fine now.

I also changed a bit the menu of the Sequencer Tracks, showing the layer aside the voice number (maybe more useful !)

BTW I like your idea about the "solo" button, assigning the same layer to all the voices instead of just playing with the level. But this may have some drawbacks I must check first.

Best regards
Xavier

[wagtunes]

Discovered an interesting bug with the sequencer.

Step 1) Click on REC.

Step 2) Check the box you want to record and enter a voice number.

Step 3) Click on EDIT and DISP for the box you want to record and edit.

Step 4) Play a note on the keyboard. You will discover that it skips the first 3 notes and places the first recorded note at position 4.

Step 5) Try to edit the first 3 positions. You can't. It appears to be locked.

Step 6) Click off EDIT and then click back on.

Step 7) Try to edit those positions. Editing now works.

It appears that you can't begin the record procedure on a track with the EDIT button lit. I don't know why.

I haven't tested it from the first step with the button off to see if it works but you definitely have to turn it off if it's on in order to get the sequencer to behave properly.

Sorry, I was a QA tester for 5 years. I'll find stuff like this.

I uploaded a few hours ago a new version which may fix this one (there was something wrong between the sequencer edit panel and the sequencer button)
Anyway, I will check your report deeper to be sure it's all fine now.

I also changed a bit the menu of the Sequencer Tracks, showing the layer aside the voice number (maybe more useful !)

BTW I like your idea about the "solo" button, assigning the same layer to all the voices instead of just playing with the level. But this may have some drawbacks I must check first.

Best regards
Xavier

I'll download the update and see if anything changes. In the meantime, you might want to read my post afterwards. I'm finding some really odd stuff here. Check out that screen print.

Is it supposed to do that?

[XILS-lab]

Hi again wagtunes

Yes, sequencer and keyboard are independent, apart for the sequencer tuning which is done with the lowest note of the whole keyboard.

I don't quite understand what you are saying about " sequencer/pad split".
You're right in saying that the sequencer can't play note whatever the keyboard settings.
These limits, channel are token into account only for the keyboard zone (if the midi note is inside the two limits, if the channel number is corresponding, then the Midi note is sent to the keyboard manager, which is processing the note and according to the mode (unison, mono, poly) is triggering one of the voices which is affected to the zone ).

The sequencer is triggering the corresponding voices affected to the track with no relation to the keyboard.

That's why you can't affect a voice to several control source (keyboard, sequencer,guitar)

Best regards
Xavier

[wagtunes]

Hi again wagtunes

Yes, sequencer and keyboard are independent, apart for the sequencer tuning which is done with the lowest note of the whole keyboard.

I don't quite understand what you are saying about " sequencer/pad split".
You're right in saying that the sequencer can't play note whatever the keyboard settings.
These limits, channel are token into account only for the keyboard zone (if the midi note is inside the two limits, if the channel number is corresponding, then the Midi note is sent to the keyboard manager, which is processing the note and according to the mode (unison, mono, poly) is triggering one of the voices which is affected to the zone ).



The sequencer is triggering the corresponding voices affected to the track with no relation to the keyboard.

That's why you can't affect a voice to several control source (keyboard, sequencer,guitar)

Best regards
Xavier

So in layman's terms (LOL) if I create a sequence, even if it's for just 2 voices and I assign those 2 voices to just one part of the keyboard (under normal conditions) once the sequencer range is defined in the box (1-9 etc) that takes over control from the layers and anywhere I play on the keyboard is going to trigger that sequence.

Therefore, if I want to have the lower part of the keyboard play the sequence and the upper part of the keyboard play a pad or lead or something else, that's beyond the capability of the software, correct?

In other words, you can do any kind of split with Syn'X 2 (pad/lead, bass/lead, pad/bells, etc) EXCEPT Sequencer/(fill in the blank) because the sequencer is keyboard independent.

Have I got it?

If so, bummer. That would have been cool to be able to have a sequencer going in the bass and a lead screaming away in the treble.

Oh well, I guess we can't have everything. LOL.

[XILS-lab]

I'm not sure I totally understood, but I think you can do what you want (if this doesn't need more than 16 voices/8 layers )

Let see for instance.

Sequencer 4 tracks are using layer 1, 2, 3, 4 (voices 1,2,3,4)

Keyboard lower is using layer 5,6,7 (voices 5,6,7,13,14,15, poly circular for pads)
Keyboard upper is using layer 8 (voice 8, 16, unison 2 for lead)

I must agree you need a quite powerful computer (up to 12 voices playing at the same time) , but that's possible (there is still 4 voices left for anything you would need. Unison for the sequencer for instance)

Inside the limit 8 layers, 16 voices (each layer controlling always the same two voices) everything is possible.

Using the Copy/Past/Exchange between layer can help you. But as assigning a voice is quite obvious too, for exchanging layers.

Best regards
Xavier

[az82]

Was about to try the demo, but then I saw that a USB dongle is required for the full version. I won't even bother trying the demo now. Sorry.

PS: The price offer looked tempting though...