KVR Audio

Dasheesh · Post by **Dasheesh** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:12 pm

V0RT3X wrote:
Dasheesh wrote:Serum is a kid's toy (ask mouse face), but maybe you like that kind of thing.
Serum a kid's toy?
I'll just respond with this.

Do you even synthesize?

Go make some
More presets.

Pyrotek45 · Post by **Pyrotek45** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:13 pm

Dasheesh wrote:Serum is a kid's toy (ask mouse face), but maybe you like that kind of thing.

WAT

Robmobius · Post by **Robmobius** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:18 pm

Dasheesh wrote:Serum is a kid's toy (ask mouse face), but maybe you like that kind of thing.

Phew!! I didn't know that... Thanks buddy. I going to sell Serum now on the market place, because you are obviously are genius.

Meanwhile back on planet Earth - Serum is a class synth.

I prefer it to Synth Master to be honest, although SM is a very good synth too. Serum can do so much though, and it's very easy to get to grips with. If you like bass, then you should definitely check it out.

Igro · Post by **Igro** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:21 pm

^^^ bass can be made using any synth.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:24 pm

No.

Unless you mean something remotely bassy. But there's definitely instruments with a lot more bass than others.

Robmobius · Post by **Robmobius** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:28 pm

Igro wrote:^^^ bass can be made using any synth.

Phew.... There's something I didn't know either.

I applaud you're incredible insight as well. And for nearly 7 years I've not been making any bass at all - just leads. Because I genuinely thought it was hardware only thing. Wow! Learn something new everyday. Well most of us do.

Oh, but then again, Serum has some very nice options for making bass (that's very big). Better then most imo.

kv331 · Post by **kv331** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:36 pm

Igro wrote:^^^ bass can be made using any synth.

Well, for synths that use wavetable synthesis It might depend on the wavetable size of the synth. SynthMaster uses 2048 samples, which translates to note F#0 at 44khz sampling rate. So maybe that might be a limitation in creating good bass sounds, I don't know

(As a comparison Serum is using 4096 samples single cycles internally if I am not mistaken. In v2.7 I actually changed the internal engine so it calculates variable length single cycles however still the max size is 2048. I'll increase that probably in v3.0)

Robmobius · Post by **Robmobius** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:48 pm

kv331 wrote:
Igro wrote:^^^ bass can be made using any synth.
Well, for synths that use wavetable synthesis It might depend on the wavetable size of the synth. SynthMaster uses 2048 samples, which translates to note F#0 at 44khz sampling rate. So maybe that might be a limitation in creating good bass sounds, I don't know

(In v2.7 I actually changed the internal engine so it calculates variable length single cycles however still the max size is 2048. I'll increase that probably in v3.0)

Serum is one of my favorite synths so I'm naturally biased.

But I own SM as well and I like it a lot.

So, this is not a criticism of it. Serum, like Diva sound immense in the low end, but Diva does'nt do wavetable, etc.

Tone2's Gladiator, to use another example, doe's decent bass but it wouldn't have the same weight in the low end as Serum or Diva imho. But it's still a class synth.

I guess the question here is should the OP spend the money on another synth. He or she probably does'nt need to spend the money, but both are nice to have. And both will offer a new sonic range.

KingTuck · Post by **KingTuck** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:52 pm

Just to put out my experience, I got Synthmaster for an incredible (and I mean, incredible) bargain price and it's a really really great synth. It stands with something like Zebra and Electra as "desert island" synths for me. Now that Bulent is back on KVR offering regular support, things are all pretty darn great in Synthmaster land.

Serum is quite different, but both are extremely versatile. It's extremely likely you already have what you need with Synthmaster. As always though, demo it and decide for yourself!

KingTuck · Post by **KingTuck** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:56 pm

When people talk about "weight in the low end" from one synth to the next, is this the sort of thing that mystifyingly defies measurement? Or is it a legitimate claim? Not personal, just a whole lot of subjective stuff thrown about on this forum. I'd like to know how/why this would differ and how one would measure the particulars.

KingTuck · Post by **KingTuck** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:58 pm

kv331 wrote: Well, for synths that use wavetable synthesis It might depend on the wavetable size of the synth. SynthMaster uses 2048 samples, which translates to note F#0 at 44khz sampling rate. So maybe that might be a limitation in creating good bass sounds, I don't know

Is F#0 even audible?

Robmobius · Post by **Robmobius** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:01 pm

KingTuck wrote:When people talk about "weight in the low end" from one synth to the next, is this the sort of thing that mystifyingly defies measurement? Or is it a legitimate claim? Not personal, just a whole lot of subjective stuff thrown about on this forum. I'd like to know how/why this would differ and how one would measure the particulars.

Subjective (or with a frequency analyzer) who knows??

However, I could now start to go off getting examples to prove my claims. But I'm far too lazy...

I'm happy for anyone (or everyone) to disagree - as long as I don't have to do anything mentally or physically.

Fill 'yer boots!

kv331 · Post by **kv331** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:06 pm

KingTuck wrote: Is F#0 even audible?

Yep!

and for our default analog waveforms (mopho) we sampled starting at C1. Next time we'll start at C0

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:18 pm

KingTuck wrote:When people talk about "weight in the low end" from one synth to the next, is this the sort of thing that mystifyingly defies measurement? Or is it a legitimate claim? Not personal, just a whole lot of subjective stuff thrown about on this forum. I'd like to know how/why this would differ and how one would measure the particulars.

I would use my ears.

But seriously, you don't think that synths differ in regard of bottom end? I think they differ massively. Also regarding "snap" which has been discussed in another thread here, and which is IMO also an important thing for many bassy synth sounds. Largo e.g. has a bass boost option, which has a massive influence on low end weight. You might wanna check it out for an example.

Robmobius · Post by **Robmobius** » Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:26 pm

chk071 wrote:
KingTuck wrote:When people talk about "weight in the low end" from one synth to the next, is this the sort of thing that mystifyingly defies measurement? Or is it a legitimate claim? Not personal, just a whole lot of subjective stuff thrown about on this forum. I'd like to know how/why this would differ and how one would measure the particulars.
I would use my ears. But seriously, you don't think that synths differ in regard of bottom end? I think they differ massively. Also regarding "snap" which has been discussed in another thread here, and which is IMO also an important thing for many bassy synth sounds. Largo e.g. has a bass boost option, which has a massive influence on low end weight. You might wanna check it out for an example.

I would say something similar for Serum as well. No two soft synths really sound the same.

The sub settings in Serum offer you a lot of 'size' - and can also be detached from the patch so to speak. So the filters don't muddy things up, etc.

And if you use any of their analog waveforms they sound really sweet and big as well. So, you can easily add more bass if you need to, with another wavetable osc for example.

Is it worth getting Serum if I already have Synthmaster?