KVR Audio

Hank the Knife · Post by **Hank the Knife** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:18 am

Vojtech, wasn't that the guy who wanted Bitwig team to remove the sandboxing of plugins? Besides, his way of conversation rises the question if they'll ever grow up. I wonder..

lnikj · Post by **lnikj** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:45 am

mcnelson wrote:
lnikj wrote:I can find Melda presets on my computer neatly placed in the usual locations ... the system library and the user library. On my mac that is; I don't know where they go on windows. I could very easily clean them up here if I could be bothered to.

Unless I am missing something, this doesn't constitute them being "all over my computer", unless, perhaps, my hard drive is badly fragmented.

Am I missing something?
Yes - you're missing the fact that you got them in the first place, as they're for plugins you don't own (unless you have every Melda plugin).

Why should you have to bother to remove them? You didn't ask for them in the first place.

Would you accept the same from Waves, if when you install one of their plugins, you get presets for every single one of them?

Bashing aside, this is the crux of the matter, and the defence seems to be "Vojtech is a good guy, we trust him" or "look at the quality of his free plugins", or "he gives good support". NONE of these address the issue.

Agreed. but what DOES address the issue is the point I made above. Vojtech has built an architecture for his plugins that involves sharing a kernel of code to host application specific algorithms on top of that. How tight and efficient this code forces certain compromises to make it simpler to maintain.

Some people have argued that this is bad coding or bad design. Maybe it is, but from what I have seen it is constantly under review, and I doubt that many people could pull off anything approaching what Vojtech has achieved.

Whilst we can all agree that it is undesirable to install unnecessary files, the current state of play is that that is the way things work. Maybe that will change in the future, maybe it won't.

However, the impact on the user of this, well for ME at least, is hardly worth losing any sleep about. It certainly doesn't warrant having a massive public tantrum about it, or starting a thread here, when the thread is still open on the dev's forum.

Skorpius · Post by **Skorpius** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:45 am

I can fully understand how the OP and others are upset due to the fact that the Melda software installs all presets instead of only those relevant for the respective plug-in. I sure don't like such software behavior either. However, this is not just Melda:

There are a great many plug-in developers whose "all-round installers" either don't let you choose what you want installed or install files (presets etc.) for formats you never chose. The Softube installer, for example, doesn't even care if you pick AAX or not during installation - it just installs the files for AAX. The Waves installer installs all VST2 and VST3 files, whether you've actually chosen them or not. The Nomad Factory installer installs all presets for all plug-ins, etc. etc.

While this is a nuisance, there's a simple solution for that: Delete everything you don't need after the installation. This takes far less time than having fruitless discussions with developers, or worse, with support people who don't even pass your complaint on to someone in charge.

mabian · Post by **mabian** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 7:59 am

Scotty wrote:I am fan. My fandom has been earned through demonstrable product commitment, extremely fair pricing policies, excellent functionality, compatibility across DAWs and versions thereof.

The only thing this bloated is your overthetop criticism of the developer. Feel free to checkout. Sell your Melda software. Some unsuspecting person is going to get a great product from an outstanding developer replete with some benign presets. Hell it will be so reliable they might actually make some good music with it and decide to purchase more of his plugins; that is if the outstanding free-ones don't make the grade.

One thing is for sure their new plugins will be quite easy to operate due the the consistency in design, support videos and presence of the developer in the forum at KVR. Poor bastards they get what coming to them... fantastic software with a tiny footprint, proven reliability, easy authorization, continuous free upgrades.... oh damn those pesky benign presets.

Once you sell your Melda plugin(s), consider selling your software sample libraries. You know those ones with the 24 sample layers when you only really use 12? They are so annoying... what being spewed all over the hard drive like some ill-conceived argument. But you wouldn't know anything about that.

+4 - if all developers would "unveal" all the files they install and that are not stritcly needed.... looks like Melda is paying for sins of all

Ghostwave · Post by **Ghostwave** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 8:03 am

OutCider · Post by **OutCider** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 9:49 am

OutCider wrote:Shari Lewis' right hand just got a lot colder

Like a Lambchop to the slaughter
or
Silence of the Lambchop

murnau wrote:
Don't bother with OutCider "arguments". Like usual he don't have any, easy to see.

Somebody called the whambulance already?

Famous last words, Mr intuition

murnau · Post by **murnau** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:00 am

D.H. Miltz wrote:^He's someone who's been repeatedly banned before (BachRules etc).

Okay, thanks for explaining Miltz (i know you don't need to).

Anyway, every user have the right to to voice his misgivings as every dev has the right to take care of it or not. I have some devs i don't support anymore because i'm not satisfied with certain moves/attitudes whatever but that doesn't mean those products are bad or harmful they just not for me anymore. Also those people are sure fine persons in private.

No problem. Only fair: It's also vice versa some dev lately decided not to support certain users anymore..

murnau · Post by **murnau** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:03 am

OutCider wrote:
murnau wrote:
Don't bother with OutCider "arguments". Like usual he don't have any, easy to see.

Somebody called the whambulance already?
Famous last words, Mr intuition

Your point this time..

OutCider · Post by **OutCider** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:06 am

murnau wrote:
Your point this time..

At least that's one thing you've got right

plexuss · Post by **plexuss** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 12:21 am

I've found a number of plugin developers ignorant of their customers concerns - they don't know how to balance customer relations with product development. many fancy themselves experts at everything. i am a user experience designer with 20 years experience and I was told off by a developer of an expensive plugin because I pointed out usability issues with their plugin - they suggested I was using my title to push my own agenda and that they too are experts at user interface design. are they a developer or a ux expert? or a visual designer? or...? It's simply not possible for one person to do everything optimally. larger developers, those beyond the one-person-shop, tend to offer better support and customer relations... from my experience anyway.

Nothing you can do about it other than assume that if the developer is an individual you might experience issues with the way they manage their business and customer relationships.

Has anyone else found that the smaller the developer, and especially one-person-shops have worse interactions with their customers than larger plugin companies?

I think its some kind of coder arrogance of some sort. because they are the sole person who developed their amazing plugins and doing everything else in their business, well they must be experts at everything.

lingyai · Post by **lingyai** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 1:07 am

Try installing the free Softube saturator. Downloads and installs dlls for the demo versions of everything they make. Just sayin'.

Hank the Knife · Post by **Hank the Knife** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 1:53 am

Softube Saturator doesn't come for free: it needs iLok

woggle · Post by **woggle** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:05 am

plexuss wrote:I've found a number of plugin developers ignorant of their customers concerns - they don't know how to balance customer relations with product development. many fancy themselves experts at everything. i am a user experience designer with 20 years experience and I was told off by a developer of an expensive plugin because I pointed out usability issues with their plugin - they suggested I was using my title to push my own agenda and that they too are experts at user interface design. are they a developer or a ux expert? or a visual designer? or...? It's simply not possible for one person to do everything optimally. larger developers, those beyond the one-person-shop, tend to offer better support and customer relations... from my experience anyway.

Nothing you can do about it other than assume that if the developer is an individual you might experience issues with the way they manage their business and customer relationships.

Has anyone else found that the smaller the developer, and especially one-person-shops have worse interactions with their customers than larger plugin companies?

I think its some kind of coder arrogance of some sort. because they are the sole person who developed their amazing plugins and doing everything else in their business, well they must be experts at everything.

Whilst I agree some devs could really do with usability/experience design overhauls (eg Reaper) this is not a usability case. But it is a customer relations example. For me Vojtech gave a polite and clear response - which the customer rejected. As you know from UX, the customer is not always right and does not always understand the solution space.

Also agree re large and small devs - greater variability in small dev responses - as you'd expect. But the best small devs are better than the best large devs (in my limited experience)

Gregorius · Post by **Gregorius** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:06 am

plexuss wrote:...many fancy themselves experts at everything....

I think its some kind of coder arrogance of some sort. because they are the sole person who developed their amazing plugins and doing everything else in their business, well they must be experts at everything.

Yes! I also experienced that with small developers.

Hank the Knife wrote:Vojtech, wasn't that the guy who wanted Bitwig team to remove the sandboxing of plugins?

Some other quotes from one of his last posts:

MeldaProduction wrote:First of all, I understand some people want their computers clean, me 2, but you are looking in bad places...

MeldaProduction wrote:MeldaProduction Plugin Kernel - a few people argued, words like "malware" sometimes appeared... Well, this thing is the biggest thing in plugin history

MeldaProduction wrote:Here's the thing - in the computers it rarely is "how it looks like". More files don't do anything that horrible. The file systems are made in such a way, that this doesn't really do much. If you want your computer fast, then you use proper HW, don't use antiviruses and such malware (AV is the true malware...)

eidenk · Post by **eidenk** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 3:13 am

Hank the Knife wrote:Softube Saturator doesn't come for free: it needs iLok

No it doesn't.

Melda Products Install ALL Presets for ALL Plugins