Mixing on Closed Headphones [Solved]

[lsc9x]

Hi there!

Just wanted to update my experience working with Ableton and mixing on headphones and I have a couple of updates!

First, everyone knows that having a Deadmau5 style studio in an insulated building with great monitors is really the way to go to mix, but without getting into arguments about it, you're probably in the same situation as me:

You don't have a properly treated room, you can't work with open back headphones because it will bug people around you, you can't work with monitors because they are too loud and will bug the neighbors (especially the BASS) and so you are stuck with closed back headphones.

Now what?

If you've tried to mix on closed back headphones, you've probably already run into the absolute problem with mixing on phones: Your mixes SUCK when you take them to a car stereo, a home theater system, or any other kind of system that involves speakers, and usually the problem is with muddy mids and badly tuned or muddy bass.

I ran into this problem immediately when I started doing electronic dance music, and have been through many different headsets and strategies for mixing, but I finally made some progress which (hopefully) will save you a lot of time, struggle and MONEY.

So rather than get into a detailed discussion about mixing, let's just assume that you know what a "reference" is (it's a piece of music you can use to compare your mix to on various gear) and know how to work your gear.

Here are my tips:

1) Get rid of the idea that you will get all your work done on ONE pair of headphones. You'll be selling yourself short. You will need at LEAST two sets of phones. One for the mids and highs mix and a second pair for the BASS. Maybe even 3 sets: One for each of highs, mids and lows.

2) Expensive doesn't necessarily translate to good. For example, a lot of people say that the Sennheiser 650 open back phones are great, but I listened to them back to back with the Shure SRH940s and I liked the 940s a lot more. They sounded more flat, but the mids were more warm and present and clear, and the bass was at least audible, and the highs were present without being overstated or tinny. You could call it a fairly "flat" response, which is what you want for mixing. The only thing I don't like about the 940s is that the construction is pretty cheap for a $300 pair of phones. I also own the Beyerdynamic DT 770s, Audio Techinca ATH-M50s, and Vmoda custom m-100s, and a pair of Skyllcandy Crushers.

- If you are on a budget, the AudioTechincas are a good place to start. They sound good all around (the mids are a bit muddy compared to more expensive sets), but they are do-able, collapseable and mobile. Plus 11 foot straight (or coiled) cable is nice. The M-50s has the straight cable, which I love because I can get up and walk around while listening. They are also durable if you take care of them!

- The Beyerdymanics DT 770s are great sounding and VERY comfortable working with for long periods of time, but I think the mids sound a bit distant and pushed back compared to the SRH 940s. Still, the sound quality is great, but you may OVERSHOOT your mids by mixing them upward to compensate for the distant sound, if you aren't careful.

- The Vmodas? Very pretty to look at and solid DJ headphones, but I'd steer way clear of these for mixing. They aren't even close to what you need.

3) A cheap tool can save you a lot of work: The best way I have found to get a GOOD bass representation in headphones mix is actually the Skullcandy Crusher headphones with the bass switch. Make sure you get the adjustable ones with the bass slider because you don't want to hurt your ears.

The SkullCandy's are a cheap pair of headphones ($79 is cheap when compared to many of the others), and the cable that comes with them kind of sucks unless you are plugging directly into an iPhone or other such device. I had to go through several adapters and none of the standard ones work, so you may need to do some research on adapters. However, if you plug them into a 1/8" jack directly, they should work OK.

As you know, bass is incredibly hard to mix on phones because you can't really hear it because the vibration is so low that it can't properly be represented on phones. What makes bass bass is a large audio cone pushing large amounts of air. You FEEL the bass more than you hear it. But when you switch to phones, the bass is GONE!

Now what?!

Crushers to the rescue! The SC Crushers have a feature pretty rare in headphones: They simulate the air vibrations of bass by actually vibrating the phones to the same frequency as the bass. It actually works pretty damn good! The mids and highs on the Crushers are just OK (not as good as the M50s), but not great, but the BASS leaps out of these phones and you get a really solid idea of where your whole mix is, where it relates to bass. I can't say enough about these phones for Bass. The only thing I regret is not getting them sooner because people said "they sucked".

For mixing highs and mids, they do suck, but for bass, they are my go-to set.

4) Finally, after you have your main set of phone and your bass phones, the last tool or tools you should have are "speaker simulators" in either software, hardware, or both.

So what is a "speaker simulator"? Well, one solution to hearing your mix on many different devices, without actually having those devices, is to have software that takes your mix and then plays it out differently through "virtual speakers" via digital signal processing.

The first plugin I would recommend taking a look at is Tonebooster's Isone VST plugin. It's cheap, it's works well, and it is designed to alter your mix to what it would sound like if you were playing it in various types of rooms. Don't let the $20 price tag fool you! The guys behind Toneboosters plugins are math whizzes and experts in digital signal processing and audio acoustics, so it's a steal deal. (The rest of their plugins are good too!)

Another, more subtle plugin that can simulate rooms or "virtual staging" for your mix is 112db's Redline Monitor. It is far more subtle than the effects you can get from Isone, but good for finishing mixes and adjusting the sound space.

Finally, one of the best things I've found (if you can get your hands on one) is Focusrite's VRM, or Virtual Room Monitor. It's actually a physical device that you plug into your computer via USB. It has a software component that allows you to control it from your DAW or outside of it.

The VRM is fantastic if you want to know what your mix will sound like on a crappy quality radio, or a TV speaker, or any number of other sets of speakers. In fact, several popular studio monitors are represented in software which can save you THOUSANDS of dollars in speakers!

So, that's it!

- Have at least TWO sets of headphones. One for Bass, One for everything else.
- Reference your mixes to the mixes of other similar music. This will help you get your bass and beat mixes right.
- Test your mix on "virtual hardware monitors" OR in a "virtual studio" environment using Isone, Redline Monitor, or (the best) on a Focusrite VRM.

Hope this helps someone because I had to spend a LOT of money, time and energy to figure all this out. PASS IT ON! Peace. =)

[Kaine]

The HD650's are meant to be slightly hyped through, it's the HD600's that are advertised as the flat ones.

Looking at the comparison chart, the Shures look like they've got a few midrange bumps, that might be where the clarity is coming from as its also dipping the bass a bit lower down. Handy for picking out the midrange as you say, but not as flat as they could be.



Agreed on the AT50's being a good starting point for the price, but it has to be the the AT50X edition for me as I find it clearer, where as I never really liked the originals where I found the bass too uneven.

I'd suggest the DT880's over the 770's as those fix the midrange issues you picked up on.

For a admittedly a fair bit more than what you forked out for that collection, you could pick up the holy grail in the shape of the Audeze LCD 2's. Thats where it starts to get really flat and accurate (bass included), but it comes at a cost.

[chaosWyrM]

hmmm....

i have to say i completely disagree with most of this. though if it works for you thats great. personally i feel that its far easier, quicker, and less expensive to get one decent pair of phones and learn how they sound.

now im not going to suggest specific headphones...theres plenty of other threads that do just that, but i will say ive gotten quite accustomed to how my akg q 701s sound. i know what their quirks are and how things are supposed to sound with them. i feel that using just them all the time has allowed me to easily adjust things properly to account for their sound profile.

i do nearly all my initial mixing on headphones (the product of working almost entirely late at night), but ive never not gone through monitors before finalizing anything. i think its fair to say that almost no one is doing 100% of their mixing on headphones, so eventually youre going to work on monitors anyway.

again...this is all just my opinion and if using multiple sets of cans works for you...then do that. i just think its unnecessarily time consuming and expensive.

i feel the more consistent your work environment is...the quicker youll acclimate to it and be able to make the proper adjustments.