Ableton 9.5/Push2

[elxsound]

Thanks, folks. I just knew that Live 8 only made it to 8.4.2 before v9, thus the curiosity. I realize that doesn't mean a lot, however.

Live 8 was broken when they released it. Total nightmare. They spent years fixing it ... may be why it only made it to 8.4.2

Yup, they stopped work on 9 to address all the issues people were experiencing on 8. Live 9 is a different beast.

[thecontrolcentre]

Been trying to download the update all day. It keeps failing at around 50% ...

[elxsound]

@elxsound : you've got a Push 2?

Yes. Fresh out the box.

I have both Push 2 and Push 1 setup together.

[thecontrolcentre]

@elxsound : you've got a Push 2?

Yes. Fresh out the box.

I have both Push 2 and Push 1 setup together.

Interesting setup. Let us know how v2 compares

[kenobi77]

@elxsound : you've got a Push 2?

Yes. Fresh out the box.

I have both Push 2 and Push 1 setup together.

Hmmmmmm......fresh (homer Simpson)

That's was quick! you don't mess about!

Initial thoughts?

[elxsound]

@elxsound : you've got a Push 2?

Yes. Fresh out the box.

I have both Push 2 and Push 1 setup together.

Hmmmmmm......fresh (homer Simpson)

That's was quick! you don't mess about!

Initial thoughts?

The obligatory disclaimer. Its an NFR.

I love this thing.

The pads are the biggest improvement (aside from the obvious display). They are in between the pads of the Korg padKontral and Push 1. More recessed, but no longer so stiff you have beat the crap out of them (unless you want to).

They've made major improvements here where you can play extremely soft if you want to, whereas on Push 1, setting the sensitivity would run the risk of activating pads erroneously.

The display is gorgeous. There's not much for me to compare to because I never owned a Machine and I think that's going to be the biggest area to compare it to.

The Simpler workflow is great. Drop samples direct from the browser. Covert direct from Push 2 to a drum rack.

I don't like the Metronome tap button. I didn't like it on Push 1 and I think it actually got worse on P2.

I don't like the Mute/Solo workflow, but I'm getting used to it. It's a difficult one to explain but I feel it involves more steps.

Loading tracks involve just one extra tap on an encoder compared to Push 1, but does indeed allows for more flexibility on the fly.

I love the Mix view... this truly is what I've wanted the most. Faders still beat encoders, but I'll gladly take encoders on this display that shows the meters so I can mix in Live via Push 2. There are times I think something like Touchable may have an advantage for managing multiple tracks at once for mixing (since you utilize multiple fingers compared to just two hands), but all in all... I am beyond happy.

[maxwelldub]

So what's up with the browser? Will the browser remember your last folder so you don't have to go deep into your hierarchy all over again? Can you duplicate pads on drum racks? Is the sample preview playback browsing super fast like 128s/maschine? All the other features are nice but the terrible browser prevented me from getting into that push (with maschine I was flying around in minutes). Also can you make mappings w/ custom banks of plugins? Cuz if you can't their usefulness is pretty limited from push. Thanks

[djscorb]

@elxsound

I mean customisation of the browser (it's shortcuts and icons) and assignable key commands for important features. In particular, reassigning the spacebar in a performance situation and reassigning mute/bypass from zero to something more useful and/or nearer to Ctrl/Apple etc.

I'm with you in that too many customisable elements can get messy or bloated. Browser and key commands though are a must in any software in which you want to optimise workflow. I spend up to and over 60 hours a week in Ableton and I'm pretty sure a good few of those are wasted due to poor choices by the devs for default behaviours and workflow.

A few extra preferences wouldn't go amiss, starting with the select all tracks behaviour, spacebar reassign, mute reassign and browser locations.

Also the options.txt prefs should be in prefs. They are so widely known now that editing a text file seems rather an archaic way to adjust them.

Cheers

Scorb

[elxsound]

@elxsound

I mean customisation of the browser (it's shortcuts and icons) and assignable key commands for important features. In particular, reassigning the spacebar in a performance situation and reassigning mute/bypass from zero to something more useful and/or nearer to Ctrl/Apple etc.

I'm with you in that too many customisable elements can get messy or bloated. Browser and key commands though are a must in any software in which you want to optimise workflow. I spend up to and over 60 hours a week in Ableton and I'm pretty sure a good few of those are wasted due to poor choices by the devs for default behaviours and workflow.

A few extra preferences wouldn't go amiss, starting with the select all tracks behaviour, spacebar reassign, mute reassign and browser locations.

Also the options.txt prefs should be in prefs. They are so widely known now that editing a text file seems rather an archaic way to adjust them.

Cheers

Scorb

Okay, you got my vote. That's my same wish for the browser (customization). I'm fine with the spacebar the way it is (and actually map other hosts to follow same behavior as Live, since that's what I'm used to - so I definitely do understand the wish). I would love to remap mute to somewhere closer... I absolutely hate looking to down to find "0".

[elxsound]

So what's up with the browser? Will the browser remember your last folder so you don't have to go deep into your hierarchy all over again? Can you duplicate pads on drum racks? Is the sample preview playback browsing super fast like 128s/maschine? All the other features are nice but the terrible browser prevented me from getting into that push (with maschine I was flying around in minutes). Also can you make mappings w/ custom banks of plugins? Cuz if you can't their usefulness is pretty limited from push. Thanks

1. P2 browser will not remember your last folder, so yes you have to dig deep each time.
2. No you cannot duplicate pads in Drum Racks via Push 2.
3. Sorry can't compare to Machine... never used it. But there is a slight delay the first time you browse when on a new set. Nothing big and then its smooth/quick.
4. Custom banks of plugins? As in, organize plugin folder hierarchy (like favorites or organized by manufacturer vs. plugin type)? The answer is no, although someone recently brought to light a way to do this using AU plugins through OSX functionality, so not native to Live or P2. If I can find a way to share this I will post how.

I will say that others I've spoken to that have P2, say it tops Machine or Maschine studio... Again, I have no input here because I've never used Maschine AND they do have complaints that some of what P2 can't do, Maschine can (like a more intuitive way of muting/soloing tracks).

[ezelkow1]

4. Custom banks of plugins? As in, organize plugin folder hierarchy (like favorites or organized by manufacturer vs. plugin type)? The answer is no, although someone recently brought to light a way to do this using AU plugins through OSX functionality, so not native to Live or P2. If I can find a way to share this I will post how.

That can at least be done easily in live in windows ( i believe theres a similar solution for osx). Live still follows shortcuts for vsts. So you create a folder and in there create shortcuts to all your vst dll's. Then you can organize those however you want in as many sub folders as you want, by whatever you name them. That hierarchy shows up in live, and now also on push. I saw it on my push v1 when trying it out with the update

Unless of course he meant custom controller mappings, which the new 'set default' on plugins is meant to address. Set one default of mapped parameters and its set for all instances of that plugin

[thetechnobear]

@elxsound... does the P2 have any more features on the VST side... e.g. being able to add automation parameters without first having to touch them on the UI?

in Live 9.x/Push1, I've saved most of my plugin in an instrument rack, with and added the parameters manually, but would be nice for the Push/Live to do this 'automatically' ... it would also be nice if we could save these parameters in pages, to get a similar 'look' as the builtin instruments have.

[elxsound]

@elxsound... does the P2 have any more features on the VST side... e.g. being able to add automation parameters without first having to touch them on the UI?

in Live 9.x/Push1, I've saved most of my plugin in an instrument rack, with and added the parameters manually, but would be nice for the Push/Live to do this 'automatically' ... it would also be nice if we could save these parameters in pages, to get a similar 'look' as the builtin instruments have.

If the parameter is visible by default, then you can automate directly from Push 2 without touching the UI. This is only really true for plugins where there are not many parameters to display. To get an idea which plugins this works for, expand the plugin in Live and if all the parameters are already listed then you're good... If you expand and the only option is to "configure" to add the parameters, than no, you'll have to click on the UI to get them to show up (and they won't save with the VST/AU for the next time unless you save it as a rack).

Also no pages like the default instruments/effects. You can continue to drill down, but you can't organize it.

[BDeep]

@elxsound... does the P2 have any more features on the VST side... e.g. being able to add automation parameters without first having to touch them on the UI?

in Live 9.x/Push1, I've saved most of my plugin in an instrument rack, with and added the parameters manually, but would be nice for the Push/Live to do this 'automatically' ... it would also be nice if we could save these parameters in pages, to get a similar 'look' as the builtin instruments have.

If the parameter is visible by default, then you can automate directly from Push 2 without touching the UI. This is only really true for plugins where there are not many parameters to display. To get an idea which plugins this works for, expand the plugin in Live and if all the parameters are already listed then you're good... If you expand and the only option is to "configure" to add the parameters, than no, you'll have to click on the UI to get them to show up (and they won't save with the VST/AU for the next time unless you save it as a rack).

Also no pages like the default instruments/effects. You can continue to drill down, but you can't organize it.

It does actually, you'd still have to map manually of there are more than 128 parameters in a plugin, but now you can save that as a default (right click in the device title bar). That way, when you load the plugin the next time, all parameters are mapped. So no need for racks anymore for this specific task.

[BDeep]

Oh and you can't organize as neatly as native plugins (with names for the different parameter banks) but you can move the parameters around in the device parameter configure GUI (in Live). So just make sure you you make logical arrangements of groups of 8 parameters and it makes more sense once you're in Push.