KVR Audio

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:33 pm

In one of my posts at the previous page i added screenshots that show that the filter modes in Retrologue 2 seem to be insopired by the Matrix 12. As i love the "3Phase" filter mode in Matrix-12V i just tried to program comparable patches in Matrix-12V and Retrologue 2 using teh compareböe "AP" filter in Retrologue.

While those filters could produce interesting and comparable results in both synths they still do not seem to sound similar. While i somehow prefer the sound of the 3Phase filter in Matrix-12V the AP filter in Retrologue 2 sounds vry nice too and depending on the Cutoff setting could produce a broader palette of different timbres.
Like with e.g. a formant filter the resulting timbre of the AP filter is not as predictable as e.g. a Lowpass or Highpass filter and even small changes of the Cutoff could make a bigger change to the resulting sound (actually a bigger change than with the 3Phase filter in Matrix 12V).

Concerning the combined filter modes "AP+LP6" (Retrologue 2) and teh comparable "3Phase+1Low" (Matrix-12V) the result in the Matrix12-V seems to sound much better and allows a broader palette of sounds than the "3Phase" mode that is somehow comparable to the "AP" filter (without the additional Lowpass) in Retrologue.

KingClarkie · Post by **KingClarkie** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:31 pm

Ingonator wrote:Once the license is on your HD teh only way to move it to another computer would be to first copy it onto a dongle and then use it at the other computer (you coudl also copy it back to the HD of that other computer, using the eLicenser software).

Copying a software license to a dongle is a one-way process; once it's on a USB-eLicenser there's no going back.

I believe it is possible to reactivate a soft-eLicense on a different machine but where this leaves Steinberg's one-machine-at-a-time policy I don't know. Perhaps the previous license gets deactivated when you run maintenance after it has been reauthorised elsewhere.

The soft-eLicense system has always seemed to me to be a bit of a bodge. It feels like the system was designed for hardware dongles only and the need for the software version was added on later, without taking into account the ramifications of the need to be able to recreate software licenses in the event of hard-drive failures, OS reinstalls and so on.

ghettosynth · Post by **ghettosynth** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:35 pm

They must have added this in an update, it's not in my retrologue with Cubase 7.5. I kind of like retrologue's interface, but I pretty much have a thing about wasting my time on daw specific VST/AU plugins. I don't mind using live's proprietary plugins because their workflow really brings something new to the table.

While I'm ranting, I have mainstage, and holy cow are logic's synths hilariously out of date, save alchemy of course. Mainstage is great value for sampling because you get Redmatica's autosample and Alchemy as well as a capable live plugin host for $30. Of course, like Steinberg, Apple doesn't want you using their plugins in other hosts, but, at least Steinberg has updated their plugins over the last decade or so.

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:38 pm

KingClarkie wrote:I believe it is possible to reactivate a soft-eLicense on a different machine

Not according to my experience.

I wanted to move Sequel to a different PC, from the PC that I had authorized it with soft eLicenser.

The problem is if you have more than one Steinberg product activated on the PC you want to move from. In my case in addition to Sequel I have PadShop Pro and some other plugs.

What I am told then by Steinberg earlier this year is that it is not possible to run the same soft eLicenser account on separate PC's, which I would have to if I wanted to move one product but not all from a pc to another:

It is not possible to reactivate a separate license.

But after the reactivation of your old Soft-eLicenser, you can activate some of the activation codes on your second pc and some on your first.

The second point is promising but I have so far not tried that, would want some feedback from other users how much hoop jumping it involves

ghettosynth · Post by **ghettosynth** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:41 pm

Ingonator wrote:
fluffy_little_something wrote:The filter combos remind me of Dune.
As i already mentined the filter modes seem to be close to those in a Matrix 12 and also to those in the XPnader filter of UVI Falcon.

One filter modes where this is obvious is e.g. "AP + LP6" which in the Xpander/Matrix is 12 is called "3Phase + 1Low" and in Falcon's Xpander filter "A3L1". In Falcon and Retrologue the "Phase" filter seems to be called an "Allpass" filter which is a more common term.

Depends on perspective. To a guitar player, an allpass filter + LFO is called a phaser. So named because the allpass filter does not impact the amplitude of a signal with respect to frequency, only the phase. Phaser was probably more understood by musicians as allpass filters weren't all that common and seem to imply to the uneducated that they pass everything, hence, how could that even be a useful filter?

fluffy_little_something · Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:05 pm

Sometimes the oscillators produce only sine although they are set to saw. Happened to me three times so far...

KingClarkie · Post by **KingClarkie** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:08 pm

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:12 pm

ghettosynth wrote:They must have added this in an update, it's not in my retrologue with Cubase 7.5. I kind of like retrologue's interface, but I pretty much have a thing about wasting my time on daw specific VST/AU plugins. I don't mind using live's proprietary plugins because their workflow really brings something new to the table.

While I'm ranting, I have mainstage, and holy cow are logic's synths hilariously out of date, save alchemy of course. Mainstage is great value for sampling because you get Redmatica's autosample and Alchemy as well as a capable live plugin host for $30. Of course, like Steinberg, Apple doesn't want you using their plugins in other hosts, but, at least Steinberg has updated their plugins over the last decade or so.

I had not checked that with Cubase 8 or Cubase 7.5 but with v8.5 the installed VST2 plugin of Retrologue 2 (which is installed besides the VST3 plugin) also works with Live 9.5 here so it does not seem to be "DAW specific" like the Live synth plugins.
If i remember correctly in the past i was also able to use the Retrologue v1 VST3 plugin included with Cubase in Studio One.

Recently i was able to install the old A1 plugin from a Cubase SX3 installation (the newer Cubase licenses are compatible with that) and that one is indeed limited to be used in Cubase and not in other hosts. A1 still worked in Cubase Pro 8 64-bit with the built-in bridge.

KingClarkie · Post by **KingClarkie** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:22 pm

Retrologue is sold as a stand-alone product so I doubt it would be host-locked. Also it is was meant to be Cubase-only I doubt they would bother with a VST2 version.

zvenx · Post by **zvenx** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:27 pm

I think both Retrologue and Padshop which are also available for separate purchases, come in Cubendo with versions that other host can read.
on PC, VST3, VST2
on Mac
VST3 and AU.

Maschine 2 and Studio one Pro, sees them fine on both my Mac and PC
rsp

ghettosynth · Post by **ghettosynth** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 3:59 pm

Ingonator wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:They must have added this in an update, it's not in my retrologue with Cubase 7.5. I kind of like retrologue's interface, but I pretty much have a thing about wasting my time on daw specific VST/AU plugins. I don't mind using live's proprietary plugins because their workflow really brings something new to the table.

While I'm ranting, I have mainstage, and holy cow are logic's synths hilariously out of date, save alchemy of course. Mainstage is great value for sampling because you get Redmatica's autosample and Alchemy as well as a capable live plugin host for $30. Of course, like Steinberg, Apple doesn't want you using their plugins in other hosts, but, at least Steinberg has updated their plugins over the last decade or so.
I had not checked that with Cubase 8 or Cubase 7.5 but with v8.5 the installed VST2 plugin of Retrologue 2 (which is installed besides the VST3 plugin) also works with Live 9.5 here so it does not seem to be "DAW specific" like the Live synth plugins.

Well, I just checked again, you're right. Retrologue and Padshop load in other hosts. Both are broken in Reaper,the preset popup window pops below the plugin window and I can't seem to select it.

Going back to Cubase 5, none of the included plugins load in other hosts save the grungelizer and the surround panner. With 7.5, you can still load those two, and you can load Retrologue and Padshop. I am unable to load the special edition of Halion Sonic, or the other included plugins.

So, everything but retrologue and padshop is DAW specific up to v7.5 with cubase. I believe that this is true with logic as well, all of the included synths can't be loaded in other hosts. The last time I tried was with the plugins that came with mainstage v2. I haven't tried to see if alchemy loads in something else, but I have my doubts.

I'm not impressed with the filters in Retrologue 1. I like padshop, but, meh, I'm kind of off the cubase upgrade train for now, despite the best of intentions, I never use it.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:04 pm

ghettosynth wrote: I'm not impressed with the filters in Retrologue 1.

Dunno if it's just a placebo "new" effect, but it felt like Retrologue 2 sounds a bit better than Retrologue 1. Bit more snappy and "detailed". I could be wrong though. The arp is a lot of fun, so it could be that, as i had some more "musical" fiddling, it's just imagining. Shame that you get close to zero info on what they really changed, especially under the hood, apart from the marketing effective bla.

ghettosynth · Post by **ghettosynth** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:12 pm

chk071 wrote:
ghettosynth wrote: I'm not impressed with the filters in Retrologue 1.
Dunno if it's just a placebo "new" effect, but it felt like Retrologue 2 sounds a bit better than Retrologue 1. Bit more snappy and "detailed". I could be wrong though. The arp is a lot of fun, so it could be that, as i had some more "musical" fiddling, it's just imagining. Shame that you get close to zero info on what they really changed, especially under the hood, apart from the marketing effective bla.

I'm currently on a reduction vs expansion trend. So, even if they're better, I doubt that they're better than Diva, or what I can cook up in Reaktor, so I think that I'll skip the upgrade this time.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:22 pm

Sure, fair enough.

It definitely has a special character in the filters, and they tend to get a bit shrill with high resonance. But definitely lovely with some key and velocity track and a sequence with different velocity on every note. Not entirely sure either yet if it's worth the upgrade for me, after i all i didn't really make much use of version 1 lately, but it's surely a lot more fun to program now, and they definitely improved in the right places.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Thu Dec 03, 2015 4:25 pm

After having alraedy tested the "AP" filter (see my first post at this page) i just checked the 3 band "Resonator" module found at the FX page. This is simply crazy and much more flexible than "usual" formant filters.

Besides the controls for each band including Cutoff, Resonance and Level you got up to 14 different modes for the filter shape. Each band could be modulated by it's own LFO and there are additional LFO settings at the "LFO" tab found at the Resonator module.
It'S also cool that the Resonator is used in series/combination woth teh filter so could could do some crazy sound shaping stuff with both combined. The Resinator has a "Mix" fader to adjust the amount of the filter and the Resonator.

Besides a 3rd oscillator, additional filter modes, a 3rd envelope and the new Arp this seems to be one of teh major new additions and looks like fun.

While i would not say that the Retrologue filters are the best sounding in the world they are still nice and very verstaile beyond teh "usual" stuff, of course also due the additional Resonator which many will maybe miss at the first look due to be found at the FX page.

I did not find a dedicated Unison but the "Multi" mode that could be selected for each oscillator could easily emulate this and that for all waveforms.
Also the CPU use seems to be low even with all features (including the Resonator) activated and all oscillators set to "Multi".

Steinberg Retrologue