KVR Audio

LB0ND · Post by **LB0ND** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 3:25 am

Just recently did a fresh install of El Capitan after using Mavericks for the last year or so. I've noticed some performance glitches with Logic, particularly on larger projects that I never got on Mavericks. I'm finding Logic unresponsive when pausing and playing, also the meters freeze for a second before they refresh (Like volume ect)

Anyone else experiencing these issues?

dupont · Post by **dupont** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 10:42 am

Hi,

LPX UI is slow on El Capitan, windows resizing is jerky and crashes when recalling screensets.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 10:57 am

it's the same on Yosemite.. that's why i gave logic up, just had enough.

I have a project here with just 8 tracks, barely any cpu usage, and i zoomed in on the audio in the arrange page to edit automation.

50% of the time it is so sluggish it's more or less unbearable. The most simple fundamental requirements are wrong. I never understand how every review publication conveniently manages to miss these things

Cubase GUI is WAY snappier, and has instant audio engine response when doing edits during playback. Pro tools is also very snappy to move around the gui.

Cinebient · Post by **Cinebient** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 11:42 am

Agree, Logic gone crap. After months they still doesn´t fix huge bugs like the transposer doesn´t work, reverse in space designer and a lot more.
I also think i will leave it soon. Bitwig maybe.
If i could get a refund for Logic Pro X i would use it in a heartbeat. It´s buggy as their iOS. A shame...
....rant over

LB0ND · Post by **LB0ND** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 12:45 pm

Ah not just me then. Looks like it's time for find a new DAW!

musiclover55547 · Post by **musiclover55547** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 1:36 pm

Funny how everyone has different experiences. I suppose HW plays into the equation, particularly with a new OS, but that's just a piece. I posted this New Years Eve Morning:

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&t=453842

"Since the installation was on top of my main Yosemite drive, I can report almost no glitches and 90% of the AU plugins are working untouched. For the other 10%, it's been a painless reinstallation of the software.

The synths were all fine, including Serum, Synthmaster, Hive, Arturia, Spire, Dune 2, and all the Kontakt Libraries. All of my third party drum libraries / programs are working without a hitch.

I'm quite amazed, and then I shifted to effects. Just about all of them work, a few problems with Melda and FXPansion, however, none with Nugen, Klanghem, or even iZotope.

Logic's performance is smoother, the automation is not producing lateny, and I almost feel as if Metal Graphics must be contributing, though it's not really all that realistic. However, I am not compaining one bit.

Also, Ableton is great & BWS is OK. I haven't used the latter too much lately, however, though they claim to have improved performance on OSX.

Maybe you guys could check your overall computer's performance with such a tool:

http://www.primatelabs.com/geekbench/

My machine (iMac 5K i7, 24G Ram) is performing well as compared with the general benchmarks. I use a lot of sample libraries, too, on external 7200RPM drives (not SSD.) However, my main drive is SSD. I'm only getting SW validation problems with Iris 2 (Izotope-- and honestly with the addition of Alchemy to Logic I could care less. It's a CPU hog and the functionality is so-so at best. Radius RT is the only thing I'd really ever pull it out for as it's time stretching algos are good, though CPU intensive. I can do that with Bitwig or Ableton (or standalone.)

LOL Logic did come in second on Synthtopia'a & Ask Video's yearly polls (behind Ableton,) and third (right behind Ableton) on musicradar's.

Something's going right; that's statistically significant. Ableton is on a roll, as most know, and Logic is right there with 'em.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 1:46 pm

Funny but after moving to LPX when Alchemy 2 got added, I'm finding it much faster to load and snappier on my system than LP9 ever was, I had stopped using that because it was so slow. Ableton and Bitwig on the other hand, they are the kludges right now.

musiclover55547 · Post by **musiclover55547** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 1:55 pm

aMUSEd wrote:Funny but after moving to LPX when Alchemy 2 got added, I'm finding it much faster to load and snappier on my system than LP9 ever was, I had stopped using that because it was so slow. Ableton and Bitwig on the other hand, they are the kludges right now.

Snappier is the right word. Regarding Ableton, have you upgraded to 9.5? It's performing well on my machine, but again I haven't stressed tested it as I have primarily been working on a project this new year in logic.

Long live the EXS24 -- seriously some of my sample libraries are pretty good (not new given many top tier devs solely focus on Kontakt now. Too bad as it is the most CPU efficient plugin I have given that it's baked into Logic's main codebase. 100 instances and it's regarded as one.) A new skin off the Logic Interface Site has given the plugin a much needed face lift too.

musiclover55547 · Post by **musiclover55547** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 2:00 pm

TheoM wrote:it's the same on Yosemite.. that's why i gave logic up, just had enough.

I have a project here with just 8 tracks, barely any cpu usage, and i zoomed in on the audio in the arrange page to edit automation.

50% of the time it is so sluggish it's more or less unbearable. The most simple fundamental requirements are wrong. I never understand how every review publication conveniently manages to miss these things

Cubase GUI is WAY snappier, and has instant audio engine response when doing edits during playback. Pro tools is also very snappy to move around the gui.

On Gearslutz, the tally is just about the same for Cubase and Logic in the polls; the ramp down is dramatic after the two.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 2:12 pm

musiclover, shouldn't I expect it to run ok on a 10.10.5 15" macbook pro, with 16gb ram, a 1tb 1000 mb/s internal ssd, and a 2.8ghz 4 core 8 thread haswell i7 processor?

Sure there are variances, but this is still currently the fastest macbook money can buy. And it runs like an absolute dog.

I actually believe the problem is the legacy code that's just built up over 20 years.

That said, despite the pdc bugs, 9.1.8 on 10.6.8 was still the finest logic combo to date.. The OS boot and shutdown so fast, and logic had ZERO lag anywhere.

Honestly alot of the times, cause my imac is older than my macbook and shipped with 10.6.8, i think about going back to L9 and just using whatever plugins will work with that OS still. But i'd have to give up all my UAD and that's the issue as the investment is just too huge.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 2:13 pm

musiclover55547 wrote:
TheoM wrote:it's the same on Yosemite.. that's why i gave logic up, just had enough.

I have a project here with just 8 tracks, barely any cpu usage, and i zoomed in on the audio in the arrange page to edit automation.

50% of the time it is so sluggish it's more or less unbearable. The most simple fundamental requirements are wrong. I never understand how every review publication conveniently manages to miss these things

Cubase GUI is WAY snappier, and has instant audio engine response when doing edits during playback. Pro tools is also very snappy to move around the gui.
On Gearslutz, the tally is just about the same for Cubase and Logic in the polls; the ramp down is dramatic after the two.

what poll? Who uses which daw? I never said Logic wasn't VERY popular. I am just saying cubase's interface doesn't have the lag, cause it doesn't. I have never read that sort of thing about Cubase tbh, anywhere.

Dúnedain · Post by **Dúnedain** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 3:00 pm

LPX runs fine over here. Mac Pro 2009 running El Capitan. I only do small projects I must admit.

musiclover55547 · Post by **musiclover55547** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 3:34 pm

TheoM wrote:
musiclover55547 wrote:
TheoM wrote:it's the same on Yosemite.. that's why i gave logic up, just had enough.

I have a project here with just 8 tracks, barely any cpu usage, and i zoomed in on the audio in the arrange page to edit automation.

50% of the time it is so sluggish it's more or less unbearable. The most simple fundamental requirements are wrong. I never understand how every review publication conveniently manages to miss these things

Cubase GUI is WAY snappier, and has instant audio engine response when doing edits during playback. Pro tools is also very snappy to move around the gui.
On Gearslutz, the tally is just about the same for Cubase and Logic in the polls; the ramp down is dramatic after the two.

what poll? Who uses which daw? I never said Logic wasn't VERY popular. I am just saying cubase's interface doesn't have the lag, cause it doesn't. I have never read that sort of thing about Cubase tbh, anywhere.

General Poll.

It's interesting, as there are a handful of people who have the same latency issue I believe you are, and others who are not. As far as your machine, of course it's good as it's a newer model, higher end. I am curious if it is only on-screen latency and not audio. It's interesting as this is the issue that's plagued Ableton over the years, and as of late some are having similar issues on Logic. All I can say is everyone can't be given how omnipresent it is in most professional studios.

Perhaps a system check is warranted, though yours is new as mentioned, hence I posted the geekbench link. It would appear it might have to do with the overal set up for some people. There were two threads on gearslutz late last year from the same person regarding his issues with what he referred to as his "flagship" model. It was actually pretty humorous. However, it's clear that different people have different experiences, beginner to pro, so I'm certainly not questioning yours.

However, if it was a show stopper for the majority, it would not have done so well this year in the polls, and more importantly it would not be a go-to DAW for the likes of Aarmin Van Buuren, who also uses Universal Audio -- and one that's pretty much universally used in studios to varying degrees.

http://www.uaudio.com/blog/armin-van-buuren

"How does your choice of Logic Pro X for your DAW affect your and Benno’s workflow?

What I love about Logic Pro X is that you can import channel strips, including MIDI and bus routing. The way Benno and I work is, everything is hooked up to an old Apple server upstairs from my studio. That houses all of my samples and it’s fast enough that I can work from one server and have two projects open and streaming from it at the same time. Then Benno and I can each open the same project and, search for bass lines, import entire channel strips with MIDI or audio information, automation, or whatever, and efficiently combine our ideas."

He also uses Ableton, and evidently Fruity Loops, but Logic is his primary rig.

However, irrespective, the Logic team does have its work cut out for themselves in order to get into full compliance with Metal graphics. When that happens (notice I did not say "if" as it's Apple's show -- and Metal is a big part of the holistic value prop,) perhaps the issues will go away for you and others. However, I also read the Cubase forum on Gearslutz and can assure you that many people are having performance issues with their new point release, particularly when dealing with old projects. And (I have to say it) Steinberg does not offer free point releases; Apple does, Alchemy included. Plus we have no dongle. How you deal with that is a whole other topic.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 4:00 pm

musiclover i am a bit tired now and would like to address a few of your points, so i will do that tomorrow if that's ok. I'm still up but it's just on 3am here.

I want to try finish this bassline of a new track and then i can sleep finally.

You make interesting and valid points but i do have some rebuttals (with explanations) to share.

Cheers, Theo

musiclover55547 · Post by **musiclover55547** » Sat Jan 09, 2016 5:01 pm

TheoM wrote:musiclover i am a bit tired now and would like to address a few of your points, so i will do that tomorrow if that's ok. I'm still up but it's just on 3am here.

I want to try finish this bassline of a new track and then i can sleep finally.

You make interesting and valid points but i do have some rebuttals (with explanations) to share.

Cheers, Theo

Cool! I hope the bassline pans out well, I suppose pun intended. I'm glad my post was well received. If I were on a PC, I would be on Cubase, though I will assume you're on a Mac you nut

Interestingly, if it wasn't for the price point I'd be all over Digital Performer, at least to supplement. I do some 90s type house, but also orchestral and piano. I tend to flip back and forth between Logic & Ableton (for loops / clips) for the former, some trance too. I'd love to do more Grateful Dead type stuff, but alas I only play mandolinin addition to woodwinds (keys of course too.)

Bitwig has me a bit frustrated, hence Ableton has stolen its spot on my end. I can only afford so many DAWs, and Logic is bang for the buck to me. I'm also not having automation issues / latency, and that would drive me nuts.

Logic X Performance on El Capitan