is Sampletank usefull?

[defjamm]

@squids: thank you for this info, didn't know that. the sampletank-sounds are good enough for rap-music, not that realistic, but realistic and good enough for a hot beat(but not the synths and drums). i own sampletank and know many workstation-demos(motif es, korg triton extreme, roland) and imho sampletank can't compete in sound-quality, so i have a queston towards studio phonik: i guess the accoustic instruments are better than in sampletank, but can they compete with a motf es? what is your oppinion on that question?

[DevonB]

and imho sampletank can't compete in sound-quality, so i have a queston towards studio phonik: i guess the accoustic instruments are better than in sampletank, but can they compete with a motf es? what is your oppinion on that question?

Oh oh.... Even I'll say that Studio Phonik doesn't sound bad, but it's not out yet. I need to get my butt in front of a Motif ES, but the Fantom X that I've had for 2 months now I'm fairly impressed with.

Devon

[Squids]

I happen to be one of the people who programmed the sounds in the Motif ironically. I think it is absolutely one of the best hardware workstations sound-wise. I use it in my set up and it is a nice controller as well.

Having said that, Sonik Synth 2 and Studiophonik are way beyond it sonically. One piano in Studiophonik is the size of the entire rom set of the Motif. That is the main drawback of hardware workstation keyboards. The largest rom set of samples tends to be a hundred megs or so. While these software modules are multi-gig.

Yes, it is true that some amazing things are done with smaller sized roms. I know because I have done this work with Alesis as well (on the QS series, DPpro, Q cards... many of my samples fit onto that stuff). All kinds of compromises are made though like sample rate conversion, data compression, loops earlier than they naturally should be and other things (try taking the effects off, hike the filter up and bring the sustain of your envelopes up on your favorite hardware workstation and be possibly horrified). So, those kind of compromises can be completely avoided in software sound modules. Of course that is speaking for all software sound modules. What makes Sonik Synth 2 and Studiophonik different is the particular work that we've done on it... and only we know for now what that is until it is released. Soon you will be able to find out for yourself.

[flugel45]

.... the sampletank-sounds are good enough for rap-music, not that realistic, but realistic and good enough for a hot beat(but not the synths and drums). i own sampletank and know many workstation-demos(motif es, korg triton extreme, roland) and imho sampletank can't compete in sound-quality....

If you only think inside the (beat)box, you'll only be able to deliver as far as your perception of whatever happens to be the latest and greatest piece of gear.

The Roland 808 doesn't sound "realistic" but is as popular as they come in R&B and pop music. Ditto alot of classic synth workstations (D-50, M1, etc). Bottom line, if you can't make a good tune from Sampletank, it ain't gonna happen even if you had the Tower of Power horns and the London Symphony at your disposal.

Creativity rules over tools, not the other way around.

JD

[DevonB]

.... the sampletank-sounds are good enough for rap-music, not that realistic, but realistic and good enough for a hot beat(but not the synths and drums). i own sampletank and know many workstation-demos(motif es, korg triton extreme, roland) and imho sampletank can't compete in sound-quality....

If you only think inside the (beat)box, you'll only be able to deliver as far as your perception of whatever happens to be the latest and greatest piece of gear.

The Roland 808 doesn't sound "realistic" but is as popular as they come in R&B and pop music. Ditto alot of classic synth workstations (D-50, M1, etc). Bottom line, if you can't make a good tune from Sampletank, it ain't gonna happen even if you had the Tower of Power horns and the London Symphony at your disposal.

Creativity rules over tools, not the other way around.

JD

I'm sure I can write a good tune off of a Casio. Question is, do I want to? Flat and boring sounds don't inspire me to write a great tune either.

Really, if that statement was 100% true, the pop charts would be full of songs written with all freeware and a single computer.

Devon

[defjamm]

.... the sampletank-sounds are good enough for rap-music, not that realistic, but realistic and good enough for a hot beat(but not the synths and drums). i own sampletank and know many workstation-demos(motif es, korg triton extreme, roland) and imho sampletank can't compete in sound-quality....

If you only think inside the (beat)box, you'll only be able to deliver as far as your perception of whatever happens to be the latest and greatest piece of gear.

The Roland 808 doesn't sound "realistic" but is as popular as they come in R&B and pop music. Ditto alot of classic synth workstations (D-50, M1, etc). Bottom line, if you can't make a good tune from Sampletank, it ain't gonna happen even if you had the Tower of Power horns and the London Symphony at your disposal.

Creativity rules over tools, not the other way around.

JD

I'm sure I can write a good tune off of a Casio. Question is, do I want to? Flat and boring sounds don't inspire me to write a great tune either.

Really, if that statement was 100% true, the pop charts would be full of songs written with all freeware and a single computer.

Devon

i totally agree

@flugel45: it seems you missed my point. i'm making hot tunes with sampletank, but this wasn't the subject in ma posting. i compared it to the sound of nowadays workstations and once again IMHO sampletank can't compete with a motif es or a korg triton extreme in sound quality so i'm really curious to hear soniksynth 2 and studiophonik. but i said, sampletank offers enough for a hot rap-tune, so where is your problem with that? i don't know how much you know about the rap-game, i sure know a lot about it. there is a reason that you see avalons and neumann u87s and distressors and ureis and more all over the place. and yeah cats like swizz beatz for example used cheap keyboards to make hot beatz, but i don't wanna sound like swizz beatz ya know. i really appreciate what sampleank offers for the money, but imho it doesn't sound as good as the workstations mentioned above, and these are the pieces you find also all around the place in rap-studios.

@squids: that sounds really great, can't wait to find it out for myself.

[Squids]

I think that there are going to be sounds in a lot of these keyboards that are just fine how they are and if you like them then you'll use them. I have a Motif and a Triton. I want to pick up a V-Synth and if I had enough room a Fantom-S too. There are also unique things they can do that I like or particular sounds of the effects etc. A sound doesn't ALWAYS have to be larger to be good.

But, by the same token, I think that SampleTank 2, Sonik Synth 2 and Studiophonik are filled with different sounds, some of which are better than hardware workstations mainly because they aren't capable of playing sounds this large (or are but no commercial native sound libraries are made for them that way... this is something SR has even considered doing and has even started for the Motif and Triton but... the demand has to be there too and not everyone bought the ram upgrades... now if they SHIPPED with the ram and CD ROM that might be a whole different story!).

Anyway, it is so subjective. These are all tools. Part of it is how they can inspire and the other part is what you do with them.

[flugel45]

I'm sure I can write a good tune off of a Casio. Question is, do I want to? Flat and boring sounds don't inspire me to write a great tune either.

Really, if that statement was 100% true, the pop charts would be full of songs written with all freeware and a single computer.

Devon

Oh come on, you're comparing a Casio to Sampletank (2)? This guy was implying Sampletank 2 was not up to creating professional material, and I'm saying he's wrong.

And as Squids remarked, this is all subjective, so your remark about my statement not being 100% true is just ridiculous. Few of the comments here on this forum would qualify as being 100% true.

Don't know why you have a problem with my point that tools should be secondary over creativity. You seem to be trying to justify gearlust (a whole other topic which I won't get into), but just because you dislike Sampletank and/or have a houseful of gear is no reason to try and contrive a silly argument.

JD

[pheeleep]

DevonB, where can we listen to some of your music please?

[DevonB]

I'm sure I can write a good tune off of a Casio. Question is, do I want to? Flat and boring sounds don't inspire me to write a great tune either.

Really, if that statement was 100% true, the pop charts would be full of songs written with all freeware and a single computer.

Devon

Oh come on, you're comparing a Casio to Sampletank (2)? This guy was implying Sampletank 2 was not up to creating professional material, and I'm saying he's wrong.

And as Squids remarked, this is all subjective, so your remark about my statement not being 100% true is just ridiculous. Few of the comments here on this forum would qualify as being 100% true.

Don't know why you have a problem with my point that tools should be secondary over creativity. You seem to be trying to justify gearlust (a whole other topic which I won't get into), but just because you dislike Sampletank and/or have a houseful of gear is no reason to try and contrive a silly argument.

JD

Wow, you read entirely too much into what I said. Care to quote me from this thread where I said precisely these statements?

Devon

[DevonB]

DevonB, where can we listen to some of your music please?

Devon

[Squids]

Can't you hear some of Devon's music with the UF demos he made?

I don't know why there's a remark to that post. It is great to hear people's music especially relating it to their opinions.

One thing for sure, is that this forum is filled with subjective opinions. Tools vs. Creativity is a very interesting thing. It all depends.

I once saw someone named Jon Brion play (he plays every Friday night at Cafe Largo in LA) and while he was known for having the coolest vintage keyboards he chose to put a PSR700 on stage instead! I thought he was brilliant for doing it because the way he made it sound was NOTHING like what kind of Casio-like home keyboard sound you'd expect. He ran it through guitar pedals and just the way he played it made great creative music as he manages to do every Friday night.

So, that would be an argument toward it being what you can do with something. On the other hand, I agree that it is just great to have sounds that instantly inspire! Sometimes the sound itself can make you write a certain thing. I believe everyone is right in this thread so far really so... no need for bickering IMO.

Also, FTR, Devon doesn't hate ST2. He doesn't even have it. He was not a fan of Sonic Synth 1 with ST1LE. I think he would probably like Sonik Synth 2 as it would be more to his tastes. Oh and nothing wrong with being a gear slut if you can. It's one of the better vices. I have this same problem!

[flugel45]

I'm sure I can write a good tune off of a Casio. Question is, do I want to? Flat and boring sounds don't inspire me to write a great tune either.

Really, if that statement was 100% true, the pop charts would be full of songs written with all freeware and a single computer.

Devon

Oh come on, you're comparing a Casio to Sampletank (2)? This guy was implying Sampletank 2 was not up to creating professional material, and I'm saying he's wrong.

And as Squids remarked, this is all subjective, so your remark about my statement not being 100% true is just ridiculous. Few of the comments here on this forum would qualify as being 100% true.

Don't know why you have a problem with my point that tools should be secondary over creativity. You seem to be trying to justify gearlust (a whole other topic which I won't get into), but just because you dislike Sampletank and/or have a houseful of gear is no reason to try and contrive a silly argument.

JD

Wow, you read entirely too much into what I said. Care to quote me from this thread where I said precisely these statements?

Devon

Uh, most of it is quoted right above my statement.
So assuming I'm dead wrong about your feelings toward Sampletank and penchant for acquiring gear...

What WERE you trying to say?


JD

[pheeleep]

Why the rolling eyes? I just wanted to know if I could listen to some of your music. There isn't a link to any of your music in your profile..

nevermind!

Squids, I didn't know that Devon had made demos for UF.. You said " It is great to hear people's music especially relating it to their opinions" and this is exactly why I wanted to hear some of his music. I love Sampletank 2 and he loves hardware synths and I just wanted to hear the difference, and hear what he thinks are good patches... I was just curious really, as I don't own any expensive hardware synths.. just a QS6.1 that I use as a controller..

[DevonB]

Why the rolling eyes? I just wanted to know if I could listen to some of your music. There isn't a link to any of your music in your profile..

nevermind!

Squids, I didn't know that Devon had made demos for UF.. you said " It is great to hear people's music especially relating it to their opinions" and this is exactly why I wanted to hear some of his music. I love Sampletank 2 and he loves hardware synths and I just wanted to hear the difference, and what he thinks are good patches...

Sorry pheeleep, but I've been in too many thread of I state an opinion about something, and get the 'well, where's your music?' response like I have to prove something.

My music? Like Squids stated, I have a demo song from Ultra Focusup, as well as guitar tracks for Sythilix, demo song for Albino 2 off of Linplug's page, etc.

Devon