what envelope filter?

[ugo]

anyone know what envelope filter was used on meshell ndegeocello's bass for lamb's song "sweet"? it sounds much squishier, and higher quality than the envelope filters i've tried.

also...can anyone suggest envelope filters that you have found to be extraordinary on bass?

i've tried the ebs filter and i used to have a q-tron. but, as i remember, neither of them offered a fast enough release times for me. on even remotely quick slap parts, the filter just stayed open.

right now i use an electrix filter queen, which is plenty fast enough and very versatle, but its too damn noisy, doesnt have a true bypass (and sucks the life out of my bass tone). also the tone of the fitler is ok, but nothing stunning.

my bass pod xt has some filters in it too but, imho, they really suck.

so im still in search for a high quality, true bypass envelope filter thats got a rich, lively and super squishy tone, with the option of very fast release times, that sounds great on bass when recording direct or through a pod.

any suggestions? what are your favorites?

actually...while im asking filter/fx related questions...has anyone here tried using an adrenalinn on bass? if so, how is it? does it sound just as good on bass or does it thin out the bass tone? (like most guitar processors do to bass.) if its cool, how are the envelope filters?

i wouldnt mind getting a new amp sim / processor for my guitars and the adrenalinn looks like fun. so if it rocks on bass too (and even offers great envelope filtering) then it might be a good option for me.

oh, to any other filter funk loving players here, check out the new envelope phaser from pigtronix. judging from the mp3's this could be very cool.

thanks for the advice,
-ugo

[Muff Wiggler]

hmm, could it have been a Bassballs? It has a faster response than the Q-Tron does.

Although this wasn't it, have a look at EH's newly released Bi-Filter as well. Seems to have a much faster envelope that the qtron.

Good luck!

[Muff Wiggler]

p.s.

I could be wrong, but it seems like the release time on the Q-Tron (I have a Q-Tron+) is tied to amplitude. The filter closes pretty damn fast once it falls below the threshold level. It's the OPENING speed that I was originally thinking you meant, which is indeed a little slow on the QT

(QT+ has an extra 'response' switch, which controls the env. speed, but sadly all you get are 'normal' and 'slow' - slow for 'vowel like response' hehe)

Anyway, seems your filter will close very fast once the amplitude of the input signal drops enough. Try setting the 'gain' knob at a lower value. Ideally (wheather you are in 'Boost' or 'Normal' mode, no matter) you want it set so that the red LED comes on at your MAXIMUM amplitude only, and only lights for a moment. If you keep the gain knob low enough, you can get a very very sensitive and fast filter response, without ever actually peaking and lighting the LED.

If I was you, I'd try to set my qtron to the highest gain without ever seeing the red LED, and play right at the edge - this might help. You'll probably want 'normal' mode and not 'boost' mode either.

Now, if you are after that chewy, saturated filter sound that everyone associates with Mu-Tron III, please ignore the above advice, set your unit into 'boost' mode, and make sure that the led ALWAYS lights up!

Good luck

[uncleruby]

Ahh filters on your bass...I am mostly applying filters to Synth bass' these days,, but..I came across a new envelope filter pedal I've never heard of from a shop near me It's called "Chunk Agent OOfunk" the mp3s demo's give me the impression it might be quieter than the usual EHX stuff...check it out here
www.stevesmusiccenter.com/ChunkAgent00Funk.html
also I have had a great time with the EHX Tube Zipper
with sequenced (predictably or tightly timed) parts it can really get crazy. the tube zipper is a bit noisy (its a distortion pedal too) and I always place a gate after it...but it has become one of my "signature sound" devices.I'm not sure if anything else sounds like it..
also check out www.eowave.com and pedals by frostwave--more about filter (as opposed to strictly envelope type--narrow?).. I have the Electrix filter queen too.I went through hell getting one that didnt have problems.Electrix 'fessed up finally and said this model had inherent problems- Mine went to the repair shop 3 times!. anyway I'm still really sorry Electrix went bust.-their stuff was great when it worked....good luck in your filtery ways!

[Muff Wiggler]

i can completely vouch for everything he says about the Tube Zipper

there's nothing else like it in the world as far as I know...one amazing little beastie.

hey uncleruby... if you have an older model tube zipper, it will probably have the sovtek tubes in it (probably the 'WA' model). If you replace these with the EH-branded tube (much different than the sovtek one, much less noise), your TZ will be much quieter.

Still, its noise is part of its charm, and you aren't gonna lose it completely, but mine really did settle down very nicely. Anyway, they are like $9 a tube, so if you don't like 'em, you can put the sovtek ones back in.

One other thing I've noticed but cannot explain - I've encountered a few of EH's tube pedals that seem unduly noisy, even for the sovtek tubes (which are quite noisy, not too 'warm', but as a tradeoff ( ? ) hardly have any microphonics at all...you can hit them and you won't really hear it!)..

anyway, I took off the guard, and simply swapped the 2 tubes, putting one in each other's place. This made a huge difference. Again, I don't know why, but it's happened on a few EH pedals I've seen now, so it might be worth a try for you.

cheers

[ugo]

I came across a new envelope filter pedal I've never heard of from a shop near me It's called "Chunk Agent OOfunk" the mp3s demo's give me the impression it might be quieter than the usual EHX stuff...

i've seen occasional mention of that online but i've never seen one in a shop around me. those mp3's do sound pretty cool.

also I have had a great time with the EHX Tube Zipper

aww man, thats one i've been itching to try since it was released...but again, no one around me ever seems to have one in stock. and every mp3 i've heard of it has been with guitar, not bass. and generally speaking...whats with electro harmonix and their lack of bass mp3's anyway?

also check out www.eowave.com and pedals by frostwave--more about filter

yeah, those look cool too.
i'd also love to try a manatone mail bomb.
http://www.musictoys.com/guitar/pedals/mena.php

I have the Electrix filter queen too.I went through hell getting one that didnt have problems.

this is my second one. the first one totally freaked out on me. i think it was due to an overheating issue. my current one runs hot too (cutting vents in the case might help) but its been working ok. it really is a cool box, its just a shame its kinda noisy and doesnt have a good bypass.

anyway I'm still really sorry Electrix went bust.-their stuff was great when it worked

i agree.
from what i've gathered, it seems that it was the development of the repeater that did them in.

-ugo

[ugo]

well, after talking about it, and messing with my gear for a few hours...i've greatly improved my envelope filter situation. this one falls under the "why the hell didnt i think of this sooner" heading.

1. run bass into EBS stereo chorus (for chorus and as a line splitter)
2. run line 1 to bass pod xt
3. run line 2 to dave smith evolver
4. set up groovy, squishy, and quick(!) envelope filter patch for incomming bass signal
5. mix both signals into the computer
6. get down with my bad self

this isnt a perfect sounding arrangement but its much, much better than what i had been doing. hmmm...now if i get a pigtronix and put it in the front of the chain....

-ugo

[Muff Wiggler]

[ugo]

?
im sorry if i came across as not appreciating all your suggestions. i really do, and i probably should have responded to the replies in order. actually...i did respond to your first one but it never showed up. mabey i hit a server glitch or something.

i will definitely be trying out your qtron settings the next time i go to the store. (i used to have a qtron, but that was a few years ago.) i'll check out the bassballs too. i think one of the local shops actually has one of those in stock. (good bass effects can be rare around here.)

that new bi-filter does look cool but its unfortunately way out of my price range for this.

the tone im getting with what i just setup is closer to what i was looking for, but not quite there yet. i'd really rather have a dedicated pedal too...and place it in the chain before the pod. so the search is still on. but at least i've got a better tone to work with in the meantime.

-ugo

[7XL]

Lovetone Meatball.

That's the pedal that you want.

[Muff Wiggler]

no worries, hehe, long day, long night, grumpy wiggler..

thanks

I think you'll like the bassballs!

cheers

[ugo]

no worries,

cool.

I think you'll like the bassballs!

i just listened to some more mp3's of it..wow...very interesting. less squishy, but far more vocal than most other envelope filters. (and distortion too.) nicely priced as well. yeah, im definitely going to check that out.

-ugo

[ugo]

Lovetone Meatball.

That's the pedal that you want.

i listened to the mp3's on their site. its a shame the recordings are so lo-fi but it sounds like its got a very cool voice. a bit too expensive for me though...300GBP = around 550USD.

as i keep searching online, i keep finding more pedals...here's another one for the 'i wonder what that sounds like?' list: Emma DiscumBOBulator.
http://www.gguitars.com/emma.html not too badly priced either.

-ugo

[Muff Wiggler]

if it's helpful, i expect there will be a group buy on the EH bi-filter in upcoming months, and if previous listprice/buyer's-clubprice ratios are any indication, it should be about $399 USD to snag one.

It's an amazing unit (2U rack), 2 multimode analog filters with envelope followers, 'fx loop' out's and in's (so you can trigger the filter's envelope with different audio than what the filter is processing, as well as running fx in the loop too I guess, if you wanna be boring ..), seperate input and output of each filter, as well as mixed output with different filter routing options, etc. etc. etc. Designed by Mike Biegel (Musitronics..Mu-Tron III and Bi-Phase desiger), and very tasty.

Anyway, the EH buyer's club is currently voting on the next item, but if it isn't Bi-Filter (that's what I cast my vote for), it will be sometimes soon

[Muff Wiggler]

and I only voted bi-filter because...


even at an INSANE discount,

i still cannot come close to affording NY-2A