a little backstory first:
I've been an avid music listener for longer than I can remember and have been exposed to and learned to appreciate music in various forms and from various regions. Though never really truly studied an instrument - have taken piano lessons when I was little, but I wouldn't really count that since i did not continue the studies and it was a rather brief experience.
However,ever since I was little, I have been whistling nonstop, to the point where now I can vibrato with ease, listen to a tune and whistle along; improvising as I go regardless of its genre. And basically just take the existing melody as the base and go wild with it and recreate it on the spot. In the same way, when it comes to music production, I'm much the same way.
Though, for me, it's ridiculously hard to come up with an original idea or score on my own. However, If i listen to a song and it catches my fancy, I am able to immediately hum it or whistle it along and freestyle it on the spot, manipulating it on the spot and just run with it so to speak after hearing its rhythm and melody. But coming up with something off the top of my head has always been difficult for me.
Also,just humming/singing/whistling a melody is one thing, however, being able to conceptualize a piece of multi-layer song with different sounds and instruments coming in and playing at different segments of the song is something that I have always find incredibly hard to do.
It just seems like without the proper understanding of music or enough practice,I am only able to be creative at a very one dimensional level, whereas the complexity of a song often times require you to be able to hear and visualize in multi-dimensions- to direct and lead an entire orchestra. That is something I'm having the hardest time with.
Sorry for such a lengthy post, but would Music Theory help in this department? Surely this is common problem for many as well! If so, does anyone have any good recommendations as to what would help ? Or know of any good materials for learning Music Theory? This can be dvds, books, websites, I'm opened to all options.
Lastly, I've been meaning to learn the Harmonica for the longest time- thinking that perhaps my skills in whistling would translate well into this wind instrument, and I certainly will begin my journey real soon, but when it comes to instruments, piano is probably the most versatile and commonly used tool for electronic music when it comes to inputting and laying out a melody right?
good resources for learning Music Theory?
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HolisticSongwriting HolisticSongwriting https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=377322
- KVRer
- 11 posts since 4 Apr, 2016
You know I studied classical and jazz theory for many years and I had some amazing teachers, but I recently realized that all the time I put into it wasn’t really worth it in the end.
I have known a lot of songwriters who went through conservatory who really struggled with theory and whose songwriting actually got WORSE after learning it (seriously!).
I believe this is for two reasons:
1) Classical theory is made for analysis, not for original creation. Actually, it becomes your biggest enemy when trying to be original, because it pushes you inside a very tight little box of out-dated rules and practices, because
2) Classical theory is really just that… classical. It may work for Mozart, Wagner and Schönberg, but it has practically no use in modern songwriting. Listen to the radio - do you think any of the writers of these songs are thinking in counterpoint or which upper structure to use?
It turns out theory is such a different way of looking at music that most musicians struggle with learning it - as I’ve said for a reason! The learning curve just doesn’t add up. You learn and you get worse.
By the way, I will admit that after many years of learning the curve goes back up and ends up a little above zero, but I hardly think it is worth the effort.
Actually, seeing how great songwriters struggle with theory every day was one of my main reasons to start my blog (http://blog.holistic-songwriting.com/). I want to present a new, up-to-date theory to you where you learn something new and you get better immediately. Where everything you learn can be heard on the radio in some shape or form.
Because after reading dozens of songwriting books let me tell you: 90% of what you read you will NEVER hear on the radio.
If this sounds interesting, I also wrote a book on how to write captivating songs that draw in your audience called the Addiction Formula (on Amazon) and a month ago I released a workshop on how to write, notate and program live drums (http://holistic-songwriting.com/groove/). So far I only have happy clients, maybe something for you as well?
I have known a lot of songwriters who went through conservatory who really struggled with theory and whose songwriting actually got WORSE after learning it (seriously!).
I believe this is for two reasons:
1) Classical theory is made for analysis, not for original creation. Actually, it becomes your biggest enemy when trying to be original, because it pushes you inside a very tight little box of out-dated rules and practices, because
2) Classical theory is really just that… classical. It may work for Mozart, Wagner and Schönberg, but it has practically no use in modern songwriting. Listen to the radio - do you think any of the writers of these songs are thinking in counterpoint or which upper structure to use?
It turns out theory is such a different way of looking at music that most musicians struggle with learning it - as I’ve said for a reason! The learning curve just doesn’t add up. You learn and you get worse.
By the way, I will admit that after many years of learning the curve goes back up and ends up a little above zero, but I hardly think it is worth the effort.
Actually, seeing how great songwriters struggle with theory every day was one of my main reasons to start my blog (http://blog.holistic-songwriting.com/). I want to present a new, up-to-date theory to you where you learn something new and you get better immediately. Where everything you learn can be heard on the radio in some shape or form.
Because after reading dozens of songwriting books let me tell you: 90% of what you read you will NEVER hear on the radio.
If this sounds interesting, I also wrote a book on how to write captivating songs that draw in your audience called the Addiction Formula (on Amazon) and a month ago I released a workshop on how to write, notate and program live drums (http://holistic-songwriting.com/groove/). So far I only have happy clients, maybe something for you as well?
Learn more on Songwriting & Producing here: http://blog.holistic-songwriting.com/
or listen to my Demo Reel here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiRg3DLCHSY
or listen to my Demo Reel here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jiRg3DLCHSY
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- KVRian
- 1182 posts since 11 Sep, 2015
what I've found is that theory can sometimes help you know how to start and how to end, when it works and when it doesn't, and why it's good or why it sucks.
ultimately though you're probably better off seeing your keyboard as 49 notes at first rather than 12 scales.
ultimately though you're probably better off seeing your keyboard as 49 notes at first rather than 12 scales.
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- KVRAF
- 16803 posts since 8 Mar, 2005 from Utrecht, Holland
OK, but how's your skill in naming the chords you hear and playing these on a piano? I'd concentrate on that, find a teacher that can teach you that aspect of music. It will give you more vocabulary of what's actually going on in a song and noting it down in a very comprehensive form.uptick wrote:now I can vibrato with ease, listen to a tune and whistle along; improvising as I go regardless of its genre.
We are the KVR collective. Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated. 
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
My MusicCalc is served over https!!
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- Banned
- 307 posts since 30 Sep, 2015
Yeah, but it is in German. More than 500 pages. However, a grumbler who pays attention to that 
Der Contrapunkt - Heinrich Bellermann (1901)
PS there's also Gradus ad Parnassum. That's how the Baroque guys did it (and it has an English translation!). It's not such a big deal...
'The most celebrated book on counterpoint is Fux's great theoretical work Gradus ad Parnassum. Since its appearance in 1725, it has been used by and has directly influenced the work of many of the greatest composers.
J. S. Bach held it in high esteem, Leopold Mozart trained his famous son from its pages, Haydn worked out every lesson with meticulous care, and Beethoven condensed it into an abstract for ready reference. An impressive list of nineteenth-century composers subscribed to its second edition, and in more recent times Paul Hindemith said, "Perhaps the craft of composition would really have fallen into decline if Fux's Gradus had not set up a standard."'
From: Counterpoint, Fux, by Alfred Mann
Der Contrapunkt - Heinrich Bellermann (1901)
PS there's also Gradus ad Parnassum. That's how the Baroque guys did it (and it has an English translation!). It's not such a big deal...
'The most celebrated book on counterpoint is Fux's great theoretical work Gradus ad Parnassum. Since its appearance in 1725, it has been used by and has directly influenced the work of many of the greatest composers.
J. S. Bach held it in high esteem, Leopold Mozart trained his famous son from its pages, Haydn worked out every lesson with meticulous care, and Beethoven condensed it into an abstract for ready reference. An impressive list of nineteenth-century composers subscribed to its second edition, and in more recent times Paul Hindemith said, "Perhaps the craft of composition would really have fallen into decline if Fux's Gradus had not set up a standard."'
From: Counterpoint, Fux, by Alfred Mann
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- KVRer
- 19 posts since 11 May, 2016 from Hearthis.at
http://www.musictheory.net/ might help, I don't knwo how far along you are in music thoery, so it might help might not!
PEAS!
PEAS!
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- Banned
- 307 posts since 30 Sep, 2015
Maybe 'Guide to the Practical Study of Harmony (1872)' by Pyotr Tchaikovsky is something for you.
It has a very funny last paragraph:
Deviations from the laws of harmony
The laws of harmony being the outcome of experience, and corroborated as they are, by our musical instinct, are in the main inconvertible; but in a highly-developed harmonization the melodic tendencies of the voices are so powerful (...), that even the boldest deviations from these laws are sometimes justified by them.
The preponderance of the melodic element and the influence it exerts on chord-progression is best exhibited in the irregular resolution of dissonant harmonies.
It's obvious that a total disregard of the laws of natural chord-connection can be indulged in only by the experienced composer, who, in the pursuance of aims higher mere than pedantic, anxious observance of rules, knowingly deviates from harmonic laws.
It has a very funny last paragraph:
Deviations from the laws of harmony
The laws of harmony being the outcome of experience, and corroborated as they are, by our musical instinct, are in the main inconvertible; but in a highly-developed harmonization the melodic tendencies of the voices are so powerful (...), that even the boldest deviations from these laws are sometimes justified by them.
The preponderance of the melodic element and the influence it exerts on chord-progression is best exhibited in the irregular resolution of dissonant harmonies.
It's obvious that a total disregard of the laws of natural chord-connection can be indulged in only by the experienced composer, who, in the pursuance of aims higher mere than pedantic, anxious observance of rules, knowingly deviates from harmonic laws.