KVR Audio

deathmetalmaster · Post by **deathmetalmaster** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:08 pm

I have a pretty massive collection of orchestral VST's at this point, most of it from spitfire audio. I am looking for a new library to round out my woodwinds collection, one of the only things I'm really lacking and was considering NI's new symphony series woodwinds collection. I would love to own the spitfire collection, but the BML collection is super expensive. I have heard great things about Berlin woodwinds and cinewinds, but I guess what I'm asking is how does the NI stuff stack up against some of the more well known libraries? Anyone have any first hand experience with this?

As far as application is concerned, I compose game and film music and sometimes classical. I really need a high quality and versatile library with a lot of articulations...

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:39 pm

deathmetalmaster wrote: I have heard great things about Berlin woodwinds and cinewinds, but I guess what I'm asking is how does the NI stuff stack up against some of the more well known libraries? Anyone have any first hand experience with this?

Berlin series is amazing. If you buy the woodwinds, you will end buying the rest, I'm afraid

I am becoming a fan of Orchestral Tools.

deathmetalmaster · Post by **deathmetalmaster** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 8:00 pm

I don't think I'll end up buying much else (though I've certainly said that before). I'm using spitfire chamber strings and spitfire symphonic brass and they are both incredible libraries. I might check out some of their other stuff for the sake of "reasesrch"

Aryaroman · Post by **Aryaroman** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 8:13 pm

deathmetalmaster wrote:I have heard great things about Berlin woodwinds and cinewinds, but I guess what I'm asking is how does the NI stuff stack up against some of the more well known libraries? Anyone have any first hand experience with this?

No experience with Symphony Essentials, but I've gotten the impression that the series has been quite the hit-and-miss, due to inconsistency, overall, with ensemble sizes and uncommon instrument groups, in addition to other strange design choices. There was some talk about the woodwinds over on VI Composers and I recall someone expressing their impression, that the library might have been recorded by someone who has never sat in front of an orchestra/recorded orchestra.

An okay starter-orchestra and one to layer with other libraries maybe.

Cinesamples' woodwinds, as I understand, are not their strong suite. The samples have some noise issues among other things.

Haven't heard of any major issues with OT.

deathmetalmaster · Post by **deathmetalmaster** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 8:50 pm

Aryaroman wrote:
deathmetalmaster wrote:I have heard great things about Berlin woodwinds and cinewinds, but I guess what I'm asking is how does the NI stuff stack up against some of the more well known libraries? Anyone have any first hand experience with this?
No experience with Symphony Essentials, but I've gotten the impression that the series has been quite the hit-and-miss, due to inconsistency, overall, with ensemble sizes and uncommon instrument groups, in addition to other strange design choices. There was some talk about the woodwinds over on VI Composers and I recall someone expressing their impression, that the library might have been recorded by someone who has never sat in front of an orchestra/recorded orchestra.
An okay starter-orchestra and one to layer with other libraries maybe.

Cinesamples' woodwinds, as I understand, are not their strong suite. The samples have some noise issues among other things.

Haven't heard of any major issues with OT.

Thanks for the reply. Very informative. I have had my suspicions about NI's orchestral stuff. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. I think maybe I'll keep shopping around

DSmolken · Post by **DSmolken** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 8:59 pm

SampleModeling and VSL are other options to consider, though they're very different from Spitfire, so OT Berlin WW will probably still be your best option.

deathmetalmaster · Post by **deathmetalmaster** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:04 pm

DSmolken wrote:SampleModeling and VSL are other options to consider, though they're very different from Spitfire, so OT Berlin WW will probably still be your best option.

Different in what way exactly?? The UI or the overall sound of the library?

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:09 pm

deathmetalmaster wrote:
DSmolken wrote:SampleModeling and VSL are other options to consider, though they're very different from Spitfire, so OT Berlin WW will probably still be your best option.
Different in what way exactly?? The UI or the overall sound of the library?

Yhe overall sound. You mentioned that you need a versatile library, yet you went all the way down to Sptifire libraries, which, IMO, are not THAT versatile. Good for soundtracks, etc. but not so good for classical orchestrations. VSL libraries are recorded "dry", which means that any ambient you want is up to you to create it. This gives much more versatility to the library.

DSmolken · Post by **DSmolken** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:22 pm

Yeah, VSL is pretty different beacuse it's very dry, very consistent, and more classical than soundtrack-ish. SampleModeling (who now have clarinets, double reeds, flutes and saxes for woodwinds) are even more different, being very expressive instruments with a lot of, well, modeling and adjustable parameters. They're very popular with people who use MIDI wind controllers.

So, different, but worth checking out some demos, at least.

coincidental · Post by **coincidental** » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:32 pm

I wouldn't bet against Spitfire releasing a Symphonic Woodwinds package before too long. If you start buying up the BML winds you won't be too much out of pocket when you upgrade. That would have the benefit of keeping all your instruments with the same room - Air Studios Lyndhurst Hall. Then again, there's no guarantee, and what do you do in the meantime?

I'm looking for some woodwinds too, and my impression is that the NI solo instruments look decent for the crossgrade price. The section sizes for the woodwind sections are a bit OTT though. Soundiron are very good at what they do, but 6 bassoons?

If you want soloists too, Fluffy Audio now also have a full wind bundle. Check out Sonokinetic too.

I'm waiting to see if Black Friday throws up any bargains. Also, you might want to look at the Call to Arms auction (http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 1&t=470835) - several woodwind libraries in there!

TheKid · Post by **TheKid** » Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:54 am

What coincidental said.

Berlin stuff is top notch. Another great library is Sonokinetic. The crossgrade price for NI stuff is perfect (probably the best bang for the buck).

Overall die NI Symphony Series Essential is just useless for any serious musician. Totally cut down articulations, only one mic position and no true legato. Just crap.

deathmetalmaster · Post by **deathmetalmaster** » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:18 pm

TheKid wrote:What coincidental said.

Berlin stuff is top notch. Another great library is Sonokinetic. The crossgrade price for NI stuff is perfect (probably the best bang for the buck).

Overall die NI Symphony Series Essential is just useless for any serious musician. Totally cut down articulations, only one mic position and no true legato. Just crap.

Well then, I am absolutely not buying it. You have made up my mind with that statement haha

deathmetalmaster · Post by **deathmetalmaster** » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:20 pm

fmr wrote:
deathmetalmaster wrote:
DSmolken wrote:SampleModeling and VSL are other options to consider, though they're very different from Spitfire, so OT Berlin WW will probably still be your best option.
Different in what way exactly?? The UI or the overall sound of the library?
Yhe overall sound. You mentioned that you need a versatile library, yet you went all the way down to Sptifire libraries, which, IMO, are not THAT versatile. Good for soundtracks, etc. but not so good for classical orchestrations. VSL libraries are recorded "dry", which means that any ambient you want is up to you to create it. This gives much more versatility to the library.

I don't want to sound like too much of a Spitfire fanboy here, but have you tried their chamber strings library? In my opinion, it's absolutely perfect for classical music. It's the most beautiful string library I have ever heard. I will definitely check out the VSL stuff though. I suppose I am just trying to get as many opinions as possible so I don't make any wasted purchases. I am trying to avoid too much redundancy in my collection.

Aryaroman · Post by **Aryaroman** » Tue Oct 25, 2016 5:53 pm

coincidental wrote:I'm looking for some woodwinds too, and my impression is that the NI solo instruments look decent for the crossgrade price. The section sizes for the woodwind sections are a bit OTT though. Soundiron are very good at what they do, but 6 bassoons?

I wonder what's their reasoning behind this.

deathmetalmaster wrote:I don't want to sound like too much of a Spitfire fanboy here, but have you tried their chamber strings library? In my opinion, it's absolutely perfect for classical music. It's the most beautiful string library I have ever heard. I will definitely check out the VSL stuff though. I suppose I am just trying to get as many opinions as possible so I don't make any wasted purchases. I am trying to avoid too much redundancy in my collection.

I've read about some bad inconsistency-problems with the Chamber Strings, like volume.

Zookes · Post by **Zookes** » Wed Oct 26, 2016 5:39 am

Having experience using Hollywood from EWQL and Pro versions from Cinesamples, I say they are OK and comparable maybe with Spitfire by quality. Only OK. Choose for taste like this.

Woodwinds tho? I say do not waste money for this from Cinesamples and EWQL. Soundiron also, in the demo I hear similar problems I have already, it is not good.

Woodwinds I recommend by experience only SampleModeling, very playable and can mix as you desire. Tho I will soon trial Berlin Woodwinds. This Capsule thing OT make is very very good with flexibility, and sound quality I can hear is good by this setup I use now. You hear this also? Maybe it is a good price like this.

SampleModeling tho always is good.

Native instruments Symphony series vs...?